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No time to look through all of thread, so if noted before - apologies..
Scotland's People show baptisms under surname Kelly to James and Janet nee Whitecross for
James 10.6.1802
John 6.2.1805
James 4.6.1810
Janet 4.1.1815
under surname Kellie
Ann 16.12.1802
Peter 20.7.1807
Richard 7.3.1812
Easiest explanation for 2 x James is that the first one died (probably after John and Peter were born) and the next son was named for the one that died.
NO burials in the parish show on SP - (not unusual for this to happen)
What I find "odd" is the baptism of James in June 1802 and then Ann in Dec 1802 unless the year is wrong for one of them or James was baptised late perhaps.
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Re James 1802 -
I thought that perhaps he was baptised hastily if a sickly child, and I therefore had a look at the image on SP.
Interestingly, his baptism is part-way down a page of 1805 baptisms.
The record says his birth was 3 June 1802.
The date of baptism is immediately below, and it just says the date was the 10th (no month or year specified), which has made the transcriber assume the baptism was on 10 June 1802.
But as it's in the middle of a list of 1805 baptisms, perhaps it means 10 June 1805.
EDIT:
On closer inspection, although the baptisms on that page are all 1805, they're not listed chronologically.
ADDED:
John 1805's baptism is on the same page.
He was born on 25 Jan 1805, and baptised 6 Feb 1805.
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Thanks to you guys I have made great progress with my family tree.
I was told that the head of my family tree was James Kelly born 1801 in White Kirk.
The next generation up seems to be James Kelly who married Janet Whitecross in White Kirk.
So I have deduced that the family lived in Canty Bay
1841 Scottish Census
Parish Number 731
Address Canty Bay - Occupation Fisherman Ages
James Kelly abt 1801 East Lothian, Scotland North Berwick East Lothian 40
Janet Kelly nee Hogg abt 1811 East Lothian, Scotland North Berwick East Lothian 30
Elizabeth Kelly abt 1824 East Lothian, Scotland North Berwick East Lothian 17
John Kelly abt 1826 East Lothian, Scotland North Berwick East Lothian 15
Janet Kelly abt 1828 East Lothian, Scotland North Berwick East Lothian 13
Cathraine Kelly abt 1831 East Lothian, Scotland North Berwick East Lothian 10
Mary Kelly abt 1833 East Lothian, Scotland North Berwick East Lothian 8
Margaret Kelly abt 1835 East Lothian, Scotland North Berwick East Lothian 6
George Kelly abt 1837 East Lothian, Scotland North Berwick East Lothian 5
Address Canty Bay - Occupation Fisherman
Elizabeth Kelly nee Hogg abt 1806 East Lothian, Scotland North Berwick East Lothian 35
John Kelly abt 1811 East Lothian, Scotland North Berwick East Lothian 30
Janet Kelly abt 1831 East Lothian, Scotland North Berwick East Lothian 10
James Kelly abt 1836 East Lothian, Scotland North Berwick East Lothian 5
Elizabeth Kelly abt 1838 East Lothian, Scotland North Berwick East Lothian 3
SO TWO KELLY BROTHERS MARRYING TO HOGG SISTERS
Address Canty Bay - Occupation Fisherman
I am Presuming the head of the family James Kelly born 1776 who was married to Janet Whitecross is here living with his son Richard Kelly who married Mary Davidson
James Kelly ( Head) abt 1776 East Lothian, Scotland North Berwick East Lothian Age 65
Son - Richard Kelly abt 1811 East Lothian, Scotland North Berwick East Lothian Age 30
Dau in law Mary Kelly nee Davidson abt 1811 East Lothian, Scotland North Berwick East Lothian Age 30
Robert Kelly abt 1816 East Lothian, Scotland North Berwick East Lothian Age 25
James Kelly abt 1836 East Lothian, Scotland North Berwick East Lothian Age 5
Ellen Kelly abt 1838 East Lothian, Scotland North Berwick East Lothian Age 3
Isabellia Kelly abt 1840 East Lothian, Scotland North Berwick East Lothian Age1
I do not know who Robert is or who the three children belong to.
This confused me :
Parish 709
Address Haddington
Janet Kelly abt 1811 East Lothian, Scotland Haddington East Lothian 30
John Kelly abt 1811 East Lothian, Scotland Haddington East Lothian 30
Helen Kelly abt 1830 East Lothian, Scotland Haddington East Lothian 11
John Kelly abt 1833 East Lothian, Scotland Haddington East Lothian 8
Robert Kelly abt 1836 East Lothian, Scotland Haddington East Lothian 5
Peter Kelly abt 1838 East Lothian, Scotland Haddington East Lothian 3
James Kelly abt 1840 East Lothian, Scotland Haddington East Lothian 1
Margaret Yount abt 1841 East Lothian, Scotland Haddington East Lothian 0
AND HOW DOES THIS FAMILY CONNECT TO MW
In which case this would be his birth showing his parents
County East Lothian
Place North Berwick
Church North Berwick Parish Church
Register Number
Date Of Birth 22 Jul 1773
Baptism Date 25 Aug 1773
Forename James
Sex M
Father Forename James
Mother Forename Hellen
Father Surname KELLY
Mother Surname COMB
Abode
Father Occupation fisher
Notes Wts Alexr Mitchell Thomas T** Sponsor Alexr Comb File Number 22509
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"
I do not know who Robert is or who the three children belong to." (ie - James, Ellen and Isabellia)"
I posted James's baptism today at 10:53 - definitely the son of Richard and Mary.
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I would really like to find out about James Kelly living in WhiteKirk Marrying Janet Whitecross. Do I visit church / Graveyard in Whitekirk? Newspapers ? I realise that there are no census etc
1841 Census:
James Kelly ( Head) abt 1776 East Lothian, Scotland North Berwick East Lothian Age 65
Son - Richard Kelly abt 1811 East Lothian, Scotland North Berwick East Lothian Age 30
Dau in law Mary Kelly nee Davidson abt 1811 East Lothian, Scotland North Berwick East Lothian Age 30
Robert Kelly abt 1816 East Lothian, Scotland North Berwick East Lothian Age 25 - THIS ROBERT DOESN'T SEEM TO BE SON OF JAMES AND JANET WHITECROSS ?
James Kelly abt 1836 East Lothian, Scotland North Berwick East Lothian Age 5
WE NOW KNOW THIS JAMES KELLY BELONGS TO RICHARD & MARY
Ellen Kelly abt 1838 East Lothian, Scotland North Berwick East Lothian Age 3
Isabellia Kelly abt 1840 East Lothian, Scotland North Berwick East Lothian Age1
DO THESE GIRLS BELONG TO RICHARD OR ROBERT?
I've realised Haddington is a county, so when address states Haddington could it be Canty Bay? The Kelly Family in Haddington have very similar names
This confused me :
Parish 709
Address Haddington
Janet Kelly abt 1811 East Lothian, Scotland Haddington East Lothian 30
John Kelly abt 1811 East Lothian, Scotland Haddington East Lothian 30
Helen Kelly abt 1830 East Lothian, Scotland Haddington East Lothian 11
John Kelly abt 1833 East Lothian, Scotland Haddington East Lothian 8
Robert Kelly abt 1836 East Lothian, Scotland Haddington East Lothian 5
Peter Kelly abt 1838 East Lothian, Scotland Haddington East Lothian 3
James Kelly abt 1840 East Lothian, Scotland Haddington East Lothian 1
Margaret Yount abt 1841 East Lothian, Scotland Haddington East Lothian 0
AND HOW DOES THIS KELLY FAMILY in HADDINGTON CONNECT TO MY KELLY CANTY BAY FAMILY. The names are very similar
County East Lothian
Place North Berwick
Church North Berwick Parish Church
Register Number
Date Of Birth 22 Jul 1773
Baptism Date 25 Aug 1773
Forename James
Sex M
Father Forename James
Mother Forename Hellen
Father Surname KELLY
Mother Surname COMB
Abode
Father Occupation fisher
Notes Wts Alexr Mitchell Thomas T** Sponsor Alexr Comb File Number 22509
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In answer to the question at the start of the last post.
You use every resourse - if that means visiting then do so, if that means newspapers - read them. If that means local records office research their holdings - I could go on.
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Are you aware of the Scottish naming pattern - have a read of these articles -
https://www.findmypast.co.uk/blog/help/traditional-scottish-naming-patterns
https://www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk/guides/research-guides/forenames
It could well mean that the children of two brothers/sisters might well have very similar names - especially if brothers married sisters! Or could appear very similar if they are children of cousins.
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You must do whatever you feel necessary to find the info you need for yourself.
Good luck
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I repeat (at least I think I said already) that Isabellia and Ellen Kelly, because of their ages and the way the names are listed in 1841, are almost certainly children of Richard and Mary.
Posting 1841 yet again:
Richard Kelly
in the 1841 Scotland Census
Name Richard Kelly
Age 30
Estimated Birth Year abt 1811
Gender Male
Where born East Lothian, Scotland
Civil parish North Berwick
County East Lothian
Address Cantybay
Parish Number 713
Household Members (Name) Age
James Kelly 65
Richard Kelly 30
Mary Kelly 30
James Kelly 5
Ellen Kelly 3
Isabellia Kelly 1
Robert Kelly 25
As there is no existing baptism record for either Ellen or Isabellia, we can't prove it, but if it were my family, I would believe it to be true.
Haddington is a TOWN in East Lothian.
East Lothian was called Haddingtonshire until 1921.
Canty Bay is near North Berwick, about 13 miles away from Haddington.
The Haddington family are not in Canty Bay.
Kelly is a very common name.
There is no reason to assume that the family in Haddington is (or isn't) necessarily related to the family in Canty Bay.
There were a limited and oft-repeated selection of first names used in Scotland in those days - and there's also the naming pattern tradition.
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St Mary's Church in Whitekirk was closed in 2021, and subsequently has been sold by the Church of Scotland to Whitekirk New Life Trust:
https://whitekirkchurch.org.uk/about#403b9678-0b38-4820-8f1d-0e9b49774432
Before it was sold it was part of the Parish of Traprain.
Parish minister's contact details:
Rev Douglas Hamilton can be contacted on 07831 657854, e-mail: [email protected]
https://www.parishoftraprain.org.uk/
Records are not kept at the church, but I assume people can still visit the graveyard.
https://tinyurl.com/29vau4a3
EDIT: Re visiting the graveyard, there are no Kelly gravestones existing at Whitekirk.
https://www.findagrave.com/cemetery/2532530/whitekirk-churchyard
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