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wonder if it might be worth trying to find a Thomas family in a Kelly's directory living in Trethomas in 1920/21 ?

Hi again ,
in regard to whether annie ellen and william were estranged the answer was no they were a very close couple and were together until williams death. I lived with them as a young child with my mother and brother for over 14 years.
I dont know what comment to make with regard to my grandfathers death but just go back to his dob: being 1880 as that is the only certificate I have of his.
I am trying to look through the kelly's directory but this I believe to be a phone directory and I dont know if the average person would have a telephone in the 1920's.

Of the births I managed to find, not one was a twin.

You have Desmond and Thomas born the same year.

This is the only Desmond Phillips birth with MMN of Thomas.

Births Jun 1933
Phillips Desmond T Thomas Bedwellty 11a 155

He wasn't a twin so it's impossible for another sibling to be born that year.

Rose

Not seeing a death for a Mary Virginia born 1919 and died 2005 on Ancestry.

Rose

Do you know where any of them died and under what name? If we can find the deaths, there should be a birthdate listed.

Rose

Mary virginia was my mum and died in 2005 whose record is on ancestory Register number: C2B
District and Subdistrict: 863/1B
Entry Number: 134
The date of birth is incorrect as I have her birth certificate. My mum always said her date of birth was 18th march 1919 but her birth certificate states 19th february, 1919. Name: mary - girl - fathers name - thomas henry phillips mother - mary phillips formerly thomas. fathers occupation coal hewer - informant - mary phillips mother 6, foremans row aberdare - registered 28th march 1919.

Her death certificate states ref: WBP 127268 entry no: 134.

Registration district: caerphilly, glamorganshire, south wales
date of death: 13th february 2005, church view residential home, 13 martins road, caerphilly, glamorganshire, south wales. Name mary annie virginia smith - maiden name phillips.
date of birth 18th march, 1919. Informant: edward st david phillips - brother.

The children of annie ellen thomas and william phillips who have deceased died in the following areas:-
William henry phillips 12.4.1918 born in pontyprydd and died in ontario, canada 26.8.2001.

Nellie phillips 1917? cant locate birth but family indicate this date and she died in caerphilly, glamorganshire south wales in 1997.

Desmond phillips cannot find this birth and death but was born approx 1930's and died late 70's.

hope this helps you thank you ruth

addendum to the children of annie ellen and william phillips is thomas phillips correct dob 22.10.1935. This now puts in more in perspective.

Ok,

Your mother was registered without a middle name. I was looking for a Mary V Phillips.

Births Mar 1919
PHILLIPS Mary Thomas Merthyr T. 11a 13_3

I'm confused as to why is her father stated as Thomas Henry Phillips though. Is this really the correct cert?

Earlier you said Desmond died 1999 but there's a death for a Desmond Trevor Phillips in 1978. Do you think that could be the one?

Rose

I think you have the wrong birth cert for your mother:

See the following marriage:

Marriages Mar 1913
Phillips Thomas H Thomas Merthyr T. 11a 1325
Thomas Mary Phillips Merthyr T. 11a 1325

Rose

Ruth,

What name did your mother marry under? Mary Annie Virginia Phillips?

Rose

Who was Nellie's husband?

Rose

Name: Aneurin Phillips
Birth Date: 8 Nov 1931
Death Registration Month/Year: Feb 2004
Age at death (estimated): 72
Registration district: Neath and Port Talbot
Inferred County: West Glamorgan
Register number: A84D
District and Subdistrict: 896/1A
Entry Number: 23

? ... Nope. Mother was Jones.


Name: Desmond Trevor Phillips
Birth Date: 1934
Death Registration Month/Year: 1978
Registration district: South Glamorgan
Inferred County: South Glamorgan
Volume: 28
Page: 1556

There should be an actual DOB on the record for a death in 1978. The informant did not know it. As posted by Rose:

Name: Desmond T Phillips
Mother's Maiden Surname: Thomas
Date of Registration: Apr May Jun 1933
Registration district: Bedwellty
Registration county: Wales
Volume Number: 11a
Page Number: 155

Just for the record so we can all see what Ruth sees and doesn't copy in full!

Name: Mary Annie V Smith
Birth Date: 18 Mar 1919
Death Registration Month/Year: Feb 2005
Age at death (estimated): 85
Registration district: Caerphilly
Inferred County: Mid Glamorgan
Register number: C2B
District and Subdistrict: 863/1B
Entry Number: 134


Now for the marriage ... Please Ruth? Just copy the Ancestry record of Mary's marriage registration.

I'm now concerned the marriage cert. isn't the correct one either.

Rose

I am now totally confused!! These name changes are so confusing.
My mother from as far back as I can remember always said her name was Mary Virginia

I am now unsure about her birth certificate my grandfather used the name william (sometimes henry) phillips but now I am not so sure and will need to contact my brother to see if he can shed any light on this.

Desmond's death after recent comments on genes I decided to look a little further into desmonds death as the date I was given was by the family and I was not in the country. I then worked it out in my own mind that he died in the late 1970's due to other events that was going on so I believe 1978 to be correct.



This is my dads and mum's first marriage details as you can see mum uses the V as her middle name. I had never heard her use the name annie.

Name: Sydney A Hegarty
Spouse Surname: Phillips
Date of Registration: Jan-Feb-Mar 1948
Registration district: Warwick
Registration county (inferred): Warwickshire
Volume Number: 9c
Page Number: 2492
Find Spouse: Find Spouse

This is my mothers first marriage

Name: Mary V Phillips
Spouse Surname: Hegarty
Date of Registration: Jan-Feb-Mar 1948
Registration district: Warwick
Registration county (inferred): Warwickshire
Volume Number: 9c
Page Number: 2492
Find Spouse: Find Spouse

I believe this to be my mums second marriage and name is different again

Name: Anne M Hagarty
Spouse Surname: Smith
Date of Registration: Jul-Aug-Sep 1973
Registration district: East Glamorgan
Registration county (inferred): Glamorganshire
Volume Number: 8b
Page Number: 1033
Find Spouse: Find Spouse

Nellies birth I am still have problems with and cannot locate.
This is her first marriage

Name: Nellie Phillips
Spouse Surname: Bly
Date of Registration: Jul-Aug-Sep 1937
Registration district: Cardiff
Registration county (inferred): Glamorgan
Volume Number: 11a
Page Number: 963
Find Spouse: Find Spouse

Her second marriage was to a harold goddard in ? 1948 and the third marriage to Thomas Cowan in 1971. Have not found the citations for these.

Aneurin Phillips is still alive and living in caerphilly south wales.
He has given me his date of birth as 20.7.1934

The information on desmond seems about right that you have him born in 1934 and died in 1978.

The death registration for my mother (mary above) is correct as I have the certificate which was given to me by my sister and uncle who organised the funeral. Entry number 134.

I am so sorry for the confusion but very difficult to obtain the information needed for verification.

Nellie Phillips marriages:

Harold J Goddard
Spouse Surname: Bly
Date of Registration: Jul-Aug-Sep 1948
Registration district: East Glamorgan
Registration county (inferred): Glamorganshire
Volume Number: 8b
Page Number: 880
Nellie Bly Goddard Jul-Aug-Sep 1948 East Glamorgan Glamorganshire

Ellen Goddard
Spouse Surname: Cowan
Date of Registration: Jul-Aug-Sep 1973
Registration district: East Glamorgan
Registration county (inferred): Glamorganshire
Volume Number: 8b
Page Number: 845
Thomas Cowan
Spouse Surname: Goodard
Date of Registration: Jul-Aug-Sep 1973
Registration district: East Glamorgan
Registration county (inferred): Glamorganshire
Volume Number: 8b
Page Number: 845

I'm thinking this could be your mother's birth cert.

Births Jun 1919
Phillips Annie M Thomas Newport M. 11a 453

Rose

Although your Uncle has given you his date of birth does he know it is being plastered over the internet?

jax

Wonder if this is Aneurin?

Births Sep 1934
Phillips Iran S E Thomas Cardiff 11a 562

Rose

There's a death for an Ellen Cowan in 1997 who was born in April 1917.

Perhaps this is her birth under Thomas with the P standing for Phillips?


Births Sep 1917
Thomas Ellen P Thomas Newport M 11a 522

Rose