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Aww right Rachel, didnt know she was listed at Dona, i still cant seem to find him in Tynemouth, Newcastle in 1901, all children where born there from 1907 so its a mystery as to where he was from 1891-1901 apart from the Thomas in Barrow in Furness and the prison..

Hi Kaz, Sorry I disappeared, had to go out...just got back. Is this them in 1891....I know the mothers name is Helen...but when the name is said could have been misheard Ellen...Helen.1891 England Census about Thomas Riley Name: Thomas Riley Age: 17 Estimated birth year: abt 1874 Relation: Son Father's name: John Mother's name: Helen Gender: Male Where born: Newcastle Upon Tyne, Northumberland, England Civil parish: Caldewgate Ecclesiastical parish: Holy Trinity County/Island: Cumberland Country: England Street address: Occupation: Condition as to marriage: Education: Employment status: View image Registration district: Carlisle Sub-registration district: St Mary ED, institution, or vessel: 16 Neighbors: View others on page Household Members: Name Age Francis Riley 7/12 Helen Riley 35 Helen Riley 6 Henry Riley 7/12 James Riley 10 John Riley 40 John P Riley 8 Margaret L Riley 5 Mary A Riley 15 Thomas Riley 17 Regards Vera

Hi Vera, dont worry about it hunni i had to go out too, ye that is the family, i have got Thomas upto there and then he disappears unless the one i found in 1891 explains he has been married before in 1900 and possibly imprisoned in 1891 after the household had been taken, still trying to work it out..

Hi Vera, That is the family in 1891 - with Thomas there. Its possible that between 1891 and the time of the 1901 census, he may have been taking part in service. He could be the one in prison; however, that Thomas is married. It is possible that Thomas married between 1891 and 1901; as in 1890 he would have been 16; and in 1895 he would have been 21 - old enough to marry without parental consent. On Thomas and Dora's marriage certificate, does it mention that Thomas has previously been married? Did the marriage take place in a church? I have looked on the 1901 census and can find no Thomas living in Tynemouth. Regards Rachel

Rachel, i have found a marriage for a Thomas in 1900 in Barrow but no wife as yet, his first child was born before he married Dora so it makes me think he may have been having an affair??? Got a Thoma in 1901 age 28 as a boarder also in Barrow in Furness stating he is married and was born Newcastle, so this could well be him with first wife...

Hi Kaz, The marriage you found was it in June 1900 Martha Beatrice Turner. Trying to find her on the 1901 census. Regards Vera

It doesnt say anything about him been married before Rachel and they married in a register office..

Aww right Vera nice one, so he was married before then, wonder if she died and then he re-married...

I think I've found Thomas in 1891 getting married! I have an entry on Ancestry for Elizabeth Burton and a Thomas Riley in the April-June quarter in Newcastle-upon-tyne, Northumberland Marriage Index: 1837-1983 It would be good to get this marriage certificate! Name: Thomas Riley Year of Registration: 1891 Quarter of Registration: Apr-May-Jun District: Newcastle Upon Tyne County: Northumberland Volume: 10b Page: 225 (click to see others on page) Here is Elizabeth Riley's death Name: Elizabeth Riley Estimated birth year: abt 1877 Year of Registration: 1898 Quarter of Registration: Jul-Aug-Sep Age at Death: 21 District: Tynemouth County: Northumberland Volume: 10b Page: 151 (click to see others on page) It would be worthwhile getting her death certificate to see who was the informant and what she died of. So, in 1901, he couldn't have been married - unless he married again between 1898-1901; and then have another wife die before 1907 when he married Dora. I wonder if there were any children? Regards Rachel

The Thomas i found in prison doesnt add up now as it states he was 26 and that would of made his birth year 1865, 9 years earlier and also marriage to Marttha he would of been 26.

Aww no has he been married twice before marrying my mums grandfather, lol...getting more and more complicated by the minute...

Hi Vera, that is the same Thomas i have, says he is a Geen Machinist and married but a boarder at 15 Hindpool, barrow in Furness and born in Newcastle.

Hi Kaz, The Thomas I seem to be concentrating on is the Gun Machinist in Hindpool Road, Barrow. He is married. Although no wife. He is a boarder. The marriage to a Martha Beatrice Turner was in Barrow in Furness. Regards Vera

Kaz, Treat ages in census' with caution - the ages could have been misheard/rounded up or down etc. I think I've found Thomas' first marriage - to Elizabeth and when she died. It means he was a widow from 1898 onwards till he married again.... Also, I'm wondering if Thomas and Elizabeth had any children.... Regards Rachel

Rachel, is it not possible that he married Elizabeth in maybe 1892-1897( Thomas at this time would have been 18-23) in Newcastle, she then died in 1898 and Thomas goes off to Barrow in Furness and marries Martha there but they live as boarders there, Martha then dies too and he goes back to Newcastle where he meets Dora...???

There is a birth of Edward Riley born Jul-Sept quarter 1898 - same quarter as when Elizabeth died - its possible she died in childbirth. Edward Riley b1898 Newcastle upon Tyne 10b 70 Regards Rachel

Hi Kaz, Just been looking at Rachels find...marriage Thomas and Elizabeth in Newcastle....I know it means another certificate, but I wonder !! Regards Vera

Vera Im starting to wonder too , must of been a misprint on the one i found cos its very clear as geen.. Rachel if they did have a son where did he go cos he isnt with Thomas when he has John with dora??

Hi Kaz, The writing on the census isn't very good...it is Gun. Regards Vera

Remember Thomas was born in 1874, so in 1891 he would have been 21 - the age where he could marry without his parents consent. I think he married Elizabeth in 1891, she died - maybe during childbirth in 1898; leaving Thomas free to mary Martha in 1900. In that case, if Thomas did marry Martha in 1900, there would have to be a death certificate for Martha as Thomas married Dora in 1907. If there was no death for Martha, then Thomas has committed bigamy. Regards Rachel