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Yes it does say Minnie was widow on her death certificate

Hello Samuel,

It's been a while since we looked into this one, so I just want to post the 1911 so we know where Samuel was living.

It's also worth noting, for others that are helping, that earlier records indicate he was born 1854.

1911 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
11 Higher Temple St C on M M/c, South Manchester, Lancashire, England

Samuel Rogers Head Married Male Coachmaker 45 1866 London City
Minnie Rogers Wife Married Female - 38 1873 Handley
Arhur Bridley Stepson Single Male Schoolboy 14 1897 Handley
Glaydas Brindley Stepdaughter Single Female Schoolgirl 11 1900 Handley
Samuel Rogers Son Single Male - 0 1911 Manchester
Rose Lee Lodger Single Female Mill Girl 23 1888 Glasgow
Thomas McNulty Lodger Single Male Coachman 33 1878 Ireland

Archive reference RG14
Registration district Chorlton<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Registration district number 464
Enumeration district 5

Samuel, the address above registers under Chorlton district. Is this the certificate you ordered that had the wrong wife listed?

Death:
First name(s) SAMUEL
Last name ROGERS
Gender Male
Birth year 1864
Age 51
Death quarter 4
Death year 1915
District CHORLTON
County Lancashire
Volume 8C Page 1037

The 1915 with wrong wife was Chorlton upon Medlock the 1931 was Salford.
All of his family were in involved with horses on my man and dads marriage
certificate 1938 it had Samuel father deceased Cab Proprieter.

In case it turns out to be relevant, what was the name of the wrong wife on the 1915 cert?

Emily wife on the 1915 certificate

Just a thought, do you know where Minnie was buried please? Is it possible that Samuel is buried in the same lair but not named on the headstone?

I have never been able to find a death registration for my great great grandfather but I got his date of death from the cemetery records as he was buried with his wife and a couple of their grandchildren.

Remember too that state old age pensions were introduced for 70 year olds in 1909 so if Samuel was still around in 1924, he may have come clean about his year of birth to enable him to claim his pension.

Re wrong wife Emily -
Yes, she and her husband are on the 1911 and 1901 censuses - so it's definitely not your Samuel who died in 1915.

I don't know where my gran is buried all I know is it was the time of
the depression and my dad like many more had no work so gran was
buried in a papers grave.My dad died in 1961 when I was 12 so everything
I know was off my mother.I wish I had asked her more when she was alive.

I know she knew Minnie but she didn't know Sam.
It always upset my dad he couldn't give his mother a proper funeral

This is where Minnie is buried and it does look as if she is in a Paupers Grave as there are many others buried in it and not related.

Burial Date Deceased Cemetery Grave Number Grave Details
09/03/1935 Minnie Rogers Philips Park Cemetery IConsecrated 504 View details


These are some Samuel Rogers' buried at the same cemetery during the time period we are looking at:
Burial Date Deceased Cemetery Grave Number Grave Details
10/08/1912 Samuel Rogers Philips Park Cemetery CRoman Catholic 96 View details
22/04/1919 Samuel Rogers Philips Park Cemetery IConsecrated 2681 View details ******
01/03/1924 Samuel Rogers Philips Park Cemetery IConsecrated 2533 View details
18/04/1917 Samuel Rogers Philips Park Cemetery KConsecrated 187 View details


These are the ages of the above taken from LancsBMD site:

Lancashire Death indexes for the years: 1912
Surname Forename(s) Age or Date of Birth Sub-District Registers At Reference
ROGERS Samuel 70 Cheetham Archives+, Manchester Central Library CHE/140/342


Lancashire Death indexes for the years: 1919 *****
Surname Forename(s) Age or Date of Birth Sub-District Registers At Reference
ROGERS Samuel 57 Cheetham Manchester CHE/164/390


Lancashire Death indexes for the years: 1924
Surname Forename(s) Age or Date of Birth Sub-District Registers At Reference
ROGERS Samuel 72 Cheetham Manchester CHE/179/47


As you see, the 1912 and the 1924 ones are too old but the one in 1919 is the correct age if he is now using his correct dob.

This would be the GRO ref:

Deaths Jun 1919 (>99%)
Rogers Samuel 57 Prestwich 8d 258

I can't see him mentioned already in the thread but has this one been discounted ?

I can't find any death reg for the 1917 one but will see if I can find any details elsewhere.....

Dea x

Dea
I thought you had deserted me how do you do it
Every bit of info I get is brilliant all this info again .
Thank you so much Dea and all my friends at Genes for taking your time to help me
Best Wishes Sam xxx

Good find there Dea, would be worth getting credits to view perhaps?...(Abode/Address, could perhaps be on it)

http://www.manchester.gov.uk/info/200032/deaths_funerals_and_cremations/1064/burial_records/3


(Info. from above, if you wanted to says)

The bundles are four for £12, ten for £25 and 25 for £50. You don't even have to use the credits all in one visit, an account is created which allows you to keep coming back until the credits are used and you are also able to top up your account by purchasing more credits at any time.


http://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gs&

(also on above, no further info.)

Chris :)


http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards/board/ancestors/thread/1304115

(and just to add above Samuel, in case you wanted to trace the Brindleys sometime in the future, lol, below link will help, more Births by the looks of it!)

http://www.staffordshirebmd.org.uk/cgi/birthind.cgi

Dea.
I have looked at the 1924 because unless I am wrong if Sam was born in 1854 the date matches but it said Prestwich and I didn't know the boundries but now you have given me Cheetham it makes sense and finding Minnie and the cemetery.I couldn't,ask for more.
Thank you Samxx

Samuel, think Dea was meaning the 1919 one...

Chris :)

Yes - It is the 1919 one - the 1924 one is too old !!!

Dea x

Couldn't resist - I looked at further detail on the grave site and it gave his address as the poorhouse but he could have been in there for hospital treatment as they also served as hospitals in those days.

The only other thing it gave was his occupation as a 'Carrier' which was a driver of horsedrawn vehicles - this could well fit with the occupation given on your father's marriage cert for him as a 'Cab Proprietor' - SO.......... looking good so far !!!

Dea x

Dea
My mother said Sam was in hospital so you are definitely on to something
and the details match.Sam changed his birth that often so is this one right
His death 1919..My mother said my dad was only a child when his father died but
when you get older someone in there twenties you could class as a kid.
Samx <3

Dea.
Going by the records you have seen on Sam does it
look like he was in a paupers grave.as well.
I am going to the cemetery hope to see one grave
Samx

Yes - there are 13 people in the grave and they don't seem to be connected to each other.

You have the grave numbers above - hope you can find them.

Dea x

Thank you Dea .
I know there are a lot of people in each grave but I will definitely mark both
with some kind of marker.It is the least I can do.
I think this will please my wonderful dad.
Dea without you help this would not be possible.
Many Many Many Thanks.
Samxxxx

Just as a matter of interest - what address was Minnie at when she died ?

The 1924 death of a Samuel Rogers was for a Cab Driver at 123 Crescent Road - This was the address for the Workhouse. - This might also match ??

Dea x