General Chat

Just thought I'd start another debate, seeing as this has been such an interesting thread.................. Aren't all religions cults?

This is a very complex subject and one needs to be able to understand the laws of physics to comprehend it. I believe we all instinctively know that consciousness is separate from the physical body and can exist independently. Humans invented 'religion' to come to terms with it. However, 'religion' has been misused by man (and I do mean man, as distinct from woman) for purposes of power and manipulation and, subsequently, it is no longer trusted or believed in to any great degree except by those unable to think things out for themselves. Len.

Hey! My fave thread has popped back up! Thanks Lynda. What is the difference between a legitimate, genuine group of believers and a cult? To the non-believer, probably very little! Because a cult is essentially a group bound together by beliefs and practices which differ from the accepted norm, and seem extreme or erroneous. So, if you believe there is no God, or that all beliefs are wrong, then all groups/churches will seem like cults. But if you have a belief it is different. Using Christianity as an example, a bible believing church would view certain groups as cults, even though they appear to be based on Christianity. For instance, if a group denied that Jesus is the son of God, altered or misrepresented the basic gospel of salvation by faith as a free gift for all..... There are many real life examples. So I feel the answer to your question. Lynda, depends on your starting point. Hope that helps. Denise

It has featured in the news this week that Catholic stem-cell researchers could be banned from taking Holy Communion, relieved of church duties and even denied a church burial. That's if the Head of the Vatican's Pontifical Council, the most senior official, gets his way. 'Destroying human embryos is equivalent to an abortion' he says. 'Excommunication will be applied to the woman, doctors and researchers and politicians who apply the law'. It remains unclear whether the Pope supports his chief officer or whether it also applies to workers who later work on the derived cells. 'This amounts to religious persecution of scientists' (many of whom are not Catholics therefore are not bothered) says an ethicist at the University of Oxford. On another tack, it is also in the news that the body of Farinelli, the castrato whose voice thrilled thousands of opera lovers, is to be exhumed. This will be in an attempt to discover more about the man and thousands of other castrated singers whose soprano voices were wildly popular in the 18th century. Historians are still unable to explain why there was such an outbreak of Catholic church-sanctioned castration of young boys. Some have suggested that the RC church banned women singers because of the eroticism of the female voice whilst others believe it was St Paul's command 'Let the women learn in silence' (1 Timothy 2:11) , invoked to keep them out of choirs. Double standards? Len

Another question to those who believe in God.... ...do you also believe in the Devil ?? (or what ever he is called) and has the Devil got anything to do with God or is it a separate being. Is there really a Devil or is this something from horror movies?? Sue xx

I see nobody has answered you re the Devil. I wonder if that is because nobody believes in him/it, or because folk don't like to think about him/it. I wonder if people like Hitler, Bin Laden etc, are forms of the Devil, they seem pretty evil to me. Lynda

Personally I do believe that evil exists, I dont believe In the devil as a bieng but as something that is inside us all,its our choice if we allow it to surface,in some its dormant in others its fully awake,if you can understand my woffel!lol

Not sure I believe in evil - I don't think I believe that anyone is born evil but that people are affected by different things differently and some people are less able to help themselves against their demons or are less balanced than others. I definitely don't believe in the Devil but see it more like Roxanne does (again lol) - like the temptation within us. I suppose religions are like cults but I tend to think of cults as organisations(?) where free thinking isn't encouraged. I realise that could apply to a lot of religions but the Protestant religion was founded by people who wanted to think for themselves and to be able to read the Bible in their native tongue etc.

Ah, here's the thread I was looking for, Thanks Lynda! I agree with Len. I am sure there are other 'beings' on other planets and that God won't banish them and only look after the human race. Why should we be superior? I feel sorry for people like William in Gateshead who think they are not worthy. We humans are not perfect beings and God accepts us the way we are. He knows what brought us to think, do or say the 'wrong' thing sometimes. As regards the Devil - I'm not sure. As a child, we learned about the Devil tempting us, in catechism class. I rather think as some have already said, that we all have the devil in us and it is up to us to 'chase' him from our minds and do what we believe is the right thing. I do find reconciliation and peacefulness whenever I am in a church. On the other hand, it does revolt me to see such riches in some churches when there's such poverty in the world outside. I know that certain people/nations give the Vatican extremely valuable presents, but I don't know why the Vatican cannot be in a position to 'broadcast' that they are not in a position to accept such wealthy gifts. I'm sure Jesus' robes and ustensils (chalice, etc) were very modest comodities, so why on earth does the Church continue using golden objects, vestments, statues and why do they continue to build such luxurious churches when there is such poverty in the world? There now, there's a few more things I wanted to get off my chest. Thanks for listening. Thanks again for this very interesting forum, Lynda. Take care everybody. Margaret

'The Devil' is an invention of the church, to scare the wits out of ignoramuses to bring them into line. There is such a thing as evil. I have met up with it. Is the likes of Osama bin Laden more evil than the RC church as personified by the Spanish Inquisition ? Len

Think I said it on here before Margaret St Peters Rome, oozes gold and treasures, and as beautiful as it is, I found it obscene, so much wealth in one place, and for what purpose? Lynda

Is the devil a wicked spirit or a quality of evil inside all of us.? Jesus the son of God was tempted by the devil in the wilderness .As Gods son he knew no evil. Is Hell hot? The misunderstanding about Hell can be attributed to a place in the bible called Gehenna. . Gehenna was the rubbish dump outside Jerusalems walls where rubbish,carcasses of animals and those thought by the Jews to be unfit for burial such as murderers were thrown there. The fire was kept burning by adding sulphur and anything on the edge of the fire was consumed by maggots. When Jesus spoke of the fiery Gehenna he was talking about total destruction with no hope of a resurrection. Why would a God of love torment people for ever and ever in a fiery Hell its unthinkable and does God an injustice. As for life after we die . There is going to be a resurrection of the righteous and unrighteous. Many unrighteous people havnt had an opportunity to learn about God. We are told in Revelation there is to be a thousand year reign of Christ during which time those brought back from the dead will be taught Gods righteous standards. They will be judged not on past deeds but on what they do after they are made perfect.At present we sin because we inherited this from Adam just as a mold with a defect cannot produce a perfect pot we are dented so to speak. It will reflect their true heart condition whether they want to serve a loving Creator or not in a perfect state. There will be some who will not get a resurrection but only God knows who they are as he can read hearts.. Wouldnt it be lovely to have the earth restored to Paradise as it was in the beginning before Adam and Eve lost it for us. Margaret

At least there is still 'free will' - I do not want to be 'perfect'. Why did God tempt Adam in the first place?

I remember having a conversation with some Jehovahs witnesses, They came to my house and I invited them in, they were nice people and obviously very sure of their faith,but I have to say would not listen to my beliefs,I found this rather rude to be honest. They told me that only the righteous would be reborn, I still wonder what the mean,I have an idea and I dont think it would include me because of my beliefs, they couldent answer some of the questions I asked them instead the would go round it!lol I have no problem with others faiths,its a very personal thing,I just find it Ignorant if people think theirs is the only path to god, Its not!!

I think that as long someone who remembers us is still alive then we are not dead brenda

i strongly feel my son in gods heavenly garden God has a lovely garden In his mansion up above He tends the garden every day With tenderness and love The flowers that are in it Are the sweetest and the best To get into god garden They have to pass a test He goes around them every day Treating them with care You're really very lucky you have a flower there And when you reach that garden You'll look at it with pride Knowing god, He'll probably put you At your loved ones side on his head stone it say 'a little flower in heavens garden' Carolinexxxxx

Brenda,I had visits from them often and we had some good debates,but thet still said I was wrong and misinformed in my beliefs. i asked about blood transfusions, organ donations e.t.c, and why if it was wrong then why did God give certain people the ability to do these operations,because I believe all talents come from a higher authority. My real point is that even in Christianity there are so many branches off, not all christians believe the same each Interprets the Bible In a different way, and thats fine In my opinion, everyone Is different and I dont think God would mind that as long as the basics are the same, we all teach ' love thy neighbour,as yourself' E.t.C.

Sorry Brenda, but I disagree with your take on blood transfusion. It's all very well to do an operation without losing blood - using the tool you mention, sounds brilliant - but what about someone who loses a lot of blood in an accident - or for instance the victims of the London bombings? I cannot see that God would provide the means to save a life (ie the knowledge and skills) and then not expect us to use it. Can you honestly say that you would let your child die rather than allow a life-saving blood transfusion? I could not even consider it and I'm afraid I cannot understand how anyone can. It runs contrary to everything I feel Jesus' teachings represent. Maz. XX

Maz,My feelings too.

Hi Brenda, no falling out intended, just stating my own strongly held opinion. I would be interested to know what the substitutes are that you mention, for someone who has lost a lot of blood in an accident. I find these sort of medical advances totally inspiring - such as those working on the Genome project to try and beat terrible diseases and those working to find prevention and cure for cancer. The bible, like ANY book (fact or fiction, written by one person and read by numerous others) can be interpreted in many different ways, or can be taken completely at face value. We are all different (or it would be a very boring world!) so we will all see things differently and have to decide for ourselves what we do or don't believe. Maz. XX