General Chat

God created the heavens and the earth. The earth was without form and it was void, and darkness was over the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God was hovering over the face of the waters.

1. Long ago in lecture halls and books I discovered physics; more advanced and mind-blowing than I had done in A levels at grammar school . I learned about relativity and cosmology and wished I had done tensor calculus at school, rather than trigonometry, and been more dedicated to my studies. I read that when Albert Einstein first published his paper on relativity, just about 100 years ago, the number of scientists who understood it could be counted on the fingers. But it was the building blocks of nuclear physics. His equation was E=mc². Not much to look at but mind shattering. E is the energy equivalent of mass (m) and c is the speed of light. Light is the form of electromagnetic radiation that makes things visible to us and travels at 186,281 miles a second. Squared, the size of the figure (11 figures) takes it outside of our grasp. Mass and energy are interchangeable. This equation is the basis of all nuclear energy and has subsequently been verified experimentally. Moreover, although energy may change to another form, or to mass and vice versa, matter cannot be destroyed, only altered into another form. The world about us changed from then on. We had been used to three dimensions, up and down, side to side and backwards and forwards. Now we had to cope with a fourth, time. It doesn’t stop there, as it turns out there may be any number of dimensions. Those not wishing to believe in what the eye cannot see should leave now.

2. Every now and then, usually not within a normal lifespan, an idea is formed that turns the world on its head. In more recent times, there were Newton, Darwin, then Einstein, Crick, Hoyle and Hawkins but possibly Darwin and Einstein made the most impact on our senses and beliefs. My feeling is that something more wonderful and mysterious lies ahead. Space-time is not something from science fiction but the here and now. Its governing force is that weakest of force-fields, gravity. In fact, in physics, space-time and gravity mean the same thing and it permeates the whole of the cosmos. Shut down gravity and the universe disappears. Electro-magnetism is also a force-field but, together with time is a part of gravity. There’s no point in trying to figure out the meaning of these terms as even scientists cannot yet do this or substantiate them mathematically. Just one of those things; you know damn well it is there but cannot prove it mathematically - yet. Gravity can, though, provide us with a local sense of dimensional space to which most of us grab onto, denying anything outside our own personal experiences. We hang on grimly to our walls, floors and clocks and except, perhaps, after imbibing too rashly, can tell which way up we are, even with our eyes shut. Some of us admit to sensing “something great” out there whilst others feel safer by shutting their minds to it.

3. We have found out there in the void (and here on earth), an energy called electromagnetism which comes in many and varied forms. It acts as an invisible force marshalling and moving matter. Electromagnetism is an energy requiring neither matter, time nor dimensions to support it. Physicists have failed, so far, to find any unity among the disparate fields and particles that skein throughout space-time but it appears to be connected, in a very subtle form, with consciousness and the power of the mind to affect animate or inanimate objects. In this universe of ours, there’s a tantalising prospect of finding unification of all space-time theories. In the meantime, since the 1940s, astronomers, astrophysicists. mathematicians, thousand upon thousands of them, have continued the task of understanding the cosmos, using a variety of techniques. By the 1980s vast skeins and voids have emerged in intricate mathematical patterns but there are still vast regions beyond, full of billions upon billions of galaxies each full of billions of stars where laws of physics may differ from our own. The vastness and intricacies of the void is incomprehensible Nothing in our collective knowledge can prepare us for what may be found in this cosmic abyss. The cosmos is controlled by vast reservoirs of “dark matter” and mysterious energies unknown to science. It is said that “dark matter”, a specialised form of energy that has the attributes of mass and extension in space and time, comprises 96% of what is out there. Eternity of time and infinity of space are concepts that the intellect can’t fully grasp - except, perhaps, that the void is not empty as a vacuum.

4. These mysterious energies that remain unseen and unknown in the 21st century first began to emerge in 50 or 60 years ago. Since the 1940s, astronomers, astrophysicists and mathematicians have bit by bit winkled themselves into a much bigger and more complex universe than was ever imagined, even in the realms of science fiction. Only recently has the concept of “other dimensions” (let’s not call it the paranormal – yet) been explored. The world about us seemed quite adequate and normal with three dimensions but the logical progression of research seems to lead to others. Although the mathematics of space dealt with abstractions, discoveries made by George Riemann’s and others make it irresistible to think that our worldly, physical space may be just as weird, complicated and wonderful as demonstrated by Einstein in his “General Theory”. We cannot have the slightest conception of what space out there in the cosmos is about. Many, therefore, shun it. “ We cannot comprehend, therefore it cannot exist”. There is, though, a deeper mystery to the void first hinted at by Minowski, Albert Einstein’s tutor. Space and time form a continuous mathematical entity which encompasses dimensions at present unknown to humanity but which are gradually being revealed.

Len I find everything you post so interesting but off to bed now as have a job interview tommorow so will digest properly in the am, Nite love, Caz xxxxxxxxxxx

5. Our brains have been tuned for the left hemispheres to do all the conscious thinking and organising for us. But our right hemisphere (in some) is probably more adept at visualising and making intuitive sense of the whole picture. This has been so since pre-history, even to the authors of Genesis. In most primitive “Creation” stories we have dark, primordial oceans with hidden forms waiting for the spirit of God to sweep away the darkness and bring life. No one knew where this spirit or intelligence came from but it was always visualised as a vast, all-knowing intelligence. The Old Ones may have been on to the truth, intuitionally. Scientific insight is now bringing the “Creation” stories back but with words so new (eg “distant intentionality” and “precognition” or 'quantum mechanics' etc) as to not yet being part of everyday language. We are entering into new methods of gaining knowledge of our universe. Eventually all things will be translated into common terms. But with such information that consciousness (spirit/soul) is not a brain function but may exist outside the body, albeit normally working in full cooperation within the brain during life-time, we are once again moving in the direction of ancient wisdom. The miracle of new theories now emerging from universities and research establishments is such that it fits in with the rough outlines of the old stories. There seems to be a guiding hand at work; a supreme intelligence from which our consciousness is drawn. Len

6. In 1997 Professor Saul Perlmutter opened another can of worms. While looking at the expansion of the universe, he accidentally discovered that not only were all stars and galaxies moving away from each other, they were doing so at greater and greater speeds. This meant that our future selves might one day look up to a sky without stars (they'd all be too far away). It also meant that 'something' was pushing the stars apart. This anti-gravity force was completely new to science, but again what it actually was remained a mystery. It did however have a name: dark energy. It turned out that the universe is 4% ordinary matter, 21% dark matter and 75% dark energy. That's a lot of stuff that no one really understands. Every civilisation since the year zero has had its own cosmological model. Every few decades or centuries, it has been replaced by something better. Whether we are the privileged generation living in the time of the right idea remains to be seen. Is dark matter here to stay?

Perhaps mankind, or that part of mankind called consciousnes, thought or spirit, is part of a supreme intelligence? Perhaps Archimedes, Newton or Darwin may have considered some of today's discoveries as a step too far. Wonder what they would have commented about exploring the planetary system? Len

Spooky seeing this today..I was just reading an old family Bible this afternoon - Genisis- weird.. Makes VERY interesting reading though.. Off to bed now... LOU XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXx

Thank you, Caz, Joe and Lou for commenting. Also Annie for your PM. I was going to call it a day for lack of response but maybe I will now edge on a bit further with my philosophy and hope that it is tinged with logic. No use withdrawing your postings now, I am already thinking up the next paragraph. len

So in language that I can understand, we could all be atoms making up that supreme being? There is also the posibility that when we die our 'spirit' passes into a 4th.dimention?

Edgar Cayce said: There is no future no past it is all one

Carol. We are all made of the constituents of stardust - with an special ingredient, consciousness. Logically, as matter and energy cannot be destroyed but only changed to another form (a law of physics, not my idea), that is how it will be with us. Our bodies will change into chemicals and heat which will dissipate. But consciousness ? Where does that wander? Maybe it stays around. I do intend getting around to that, if you will bear with me a bit longer. Len

Joe. You are a bit of a pessimist. I can just imagine your granddad intolling the same sentiments over what we, today, take for granted. Discovery and physics have not come to a standstill but, since the 20th century, are accelerating faster and faster. You will not believe where technology will take us in the next 20 years, let alone a couple of centuries With regard to consciousness, I read a scientific paper which hypothesised that consciousness is in all living matter to a greater of lesser degree. Seemed reasonable to me but I do like to think people have a mite more of it than, say, an earthworm . len

Pauline Einstein said much the same thing only in a much more complicated way. Time is the fourth dimension Len

Len have you read 'The Celestine Prophecy' by James Redfield? Fiction?

I occasionally fumble about with what you are saying, Len, and I do believe (I think) that we are all part of some huge cosmic consciousness. How this relates to time and space I haven't worked out yet, but I have come to an understanding that there is a wonderful dichotomy here - as individuals, we matter not one jot - the world will go serenly on with or without us. And yet we DO matter as individuals - we form bonds, we cleave unto each other, we mourn our losses. What can this be about, other than to prepare us for some elevated form of 'consciousness' that we cannot yet comprehend? OC

7. It is a fact that quantum mechanics tells us that the world we inhabit depends for its meaning and reality on our perception of it. To recap from an earlier thread, let’s seriously consider any solid object, perhaps the chair on which you are sitting, and think of it afresh. Firstly, using stored knowledge, we can examine the chair with our normal senses, sight touch and smell and maybe tap it, bringing in our hearing. We may deduce that it is made of wood and not metal, plastic or some other substance. We may go on to deduce the existence of a tree and, subsequently, soil, water, sunlight and air so necessary for the production of wood. But then think of the transmutation of all these forms of matter and energy into a living tree. When does a living tree become a dead one and what happens? Sorry, I digress. But don’t stop there; it is composed of cells and molecules. A molecule is the smallest unit of a compound that can take part in a chemical reaction and is made up of a group of atoms electrically bonded together. An atom has a tiny nucleus surrounded by electrons whizzing round it as the earth and planets whiz round the sun. None of these components, from the atom downwards is touching. Indeed, relative to their size, the spaces are astronomical. To illustrate this, if the electrons circling at set distances made the shape of a football, the nucleus (which can be split) could be compared to a grain of sand in the centre. Had it been a metal or plastic chair we would still have arrived at molecules, albeit of a different sort – but let’s not digress again. So how about your chair or any other “solid” object? Its quite ghostly, in fact, when seen really close up.. We are just used to perceiving it as hard and solid. Since the advent of quantum mechanics, over the last few decades, the physical world has lost it’s old solidity and permanence, certainly as observed by most physicists. That ain't all. len

8. Changing the way we think of ourselves, the planet and the universe is not an easy accomplishment and requires a great deal of open-mindedness (My favourite word used to be ‘Rubbish’). We are conditioned by our immediate environment and education to think that the universe is more simple and material than it really is. It is an interesting fact that those who show the most open-mindedness are not theologians, psychiatrists or psychologists but more often engineers, astro-physicists or mathematicians although, possibly. the driving force of the latter may be a desire to investigate and disprove but who are, in the process, won over. In-depth investigations and analyses often lead to mind-boggling conclusions. Perhaps it is that engineers and the like have more natural investigative skill? The late A.J Ellison, Emeritus Professor of Engineering at The City University, London was in no doubt that the paranormal exists and it may be demonstrated and observed using the strict protocols of modern science. For those interested there are many published scientific papers available online detailing and endorsing paranormal activity but be warned, they are written in scientific jargon which can be heavy going. Quantum Mechanics itself, as a branch of physics, would appear to be paranormal to the ordinary person. No philosopher would dispute that “there may be something out there” and there’s not yet hard evidence proving that there is - or isn’t. It’s equally difficult to prove that there isn’t a God as it is to prove there is one. But there is mounting circumstantial evidence and, in a court of law, circumstantial evidence can be overwhelming. That we all think we know the physical world so well is the result of thousands of years of developing belief systems and the conditioning of each generation by earlier ones. Now modern science is slowly but surely unravelling the truths of the void, their minds are slowly but surely meeting the minds of philosopher of old, who got a lot wrong, but may have got it right over the big picture. That giant of philosophers, Aristotle, thought that bees were created from the carcases of lions. In a recent survey, 68% of interviewed adults admitted to having had what they thought was paranormal experience. Others described experiences which they put down to mental aberrations. Throughout the world, most races predominately are adherent to a spiritually-based sectarian religion which they are prepared to defend with fervour or even violence. But admit to believing in the occult? Not on your life! Humans are complicated beings but, as Mr Spock of the Starship Enterprise observed, entirely illogical.