General Chat

no - being patronising

AnnCardiff there is no call for rudeness and I stand by my posts. If an individual wishes to misinterpret them or misguidedly twist the meaning into something clearly different then that is their right.

Once again, the phrase "Kindle-toting pseudo-intellectuals" has a different meaning to the one you are trying desperately to enforce and I refuse to rise to the bait.
This is a thread about enforced internet censorship and I very much welcome any informed or intelligent input - both for and against.

The same word constructions can have different meanings to different people depending on all manner of things. Thus it does not follow when people take different perceptions from the same words that either of them is wrong or expressing any particular opposition to a point of view. It is just that the meaning of meaning differs.

The seminal work on this matter, which has had a massive impact on social studies, law and so on , was by Hilary Putnam in 1973. The full work "The meaning of meaning" is easily available and downloadable as a free pdf file. However it is quite long though not so long that it won't fit easily on your Kindle Kobo or whatever.

Here is a 2 page version of the work. Please don't tell me that I am pseudo anything at all Putnam's work is something with which any professional lawyer, psychologist et al would be expected to be familiar with along with other major cognitive studies.

http://faculty.washington.edu/smcohen/453/Putnam.pdf

aside:

Our public library dumped its copy in favour of making space for a children's playroom and basic reading. This has of course increased the "footfall" and thus popularity of the library. I would have thought that learning to read was a function of the schools, kindergartens and parents not the local library. The ensuing noise renders the building impossible to use for its supposed functon - reading - at some times of the day. Moreover the already difficult problem of quiet space for older students trying to pass GSCE and A level has been made worse. The space has been made of course by removing most of the collection of classic fiction and non fiction. Obviously the meaning of the world library has quite a few different meanings...

Rollo - thanks for that.

'A History Of Ideas'. Radio 4 today @ midday. (Not totally unrelated to some postings on this thread. Not a very interesting programme, as it turned out.)

'Barry Smith argues that language is our most important uniquely human attribute. It doesn't just help us communicate, it helps us to think. He makes the case for the distinctiveness of human language against the limited signalling systems of other animals.

He looks at Noam Chomsky's idea of a universal grammar - that there is something in the human brain that gives us an innate ability to produce language from very early in our lives.

And he talks to experts on other intelligent animals - Prof. Nicola Clayton and Prof. Robin Dunbar - to ask how human language and imagination compares with that of birds and primates'.

The R4 program Dermot mentions is very good and available on iPlayer.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b04ykk50

The work of Naom Chomsky underpins all modern human / device design starting with the ground breaking work of Xerox at Palo Alto.
http://www.cs.ubc.ca/~carenini/TEACHING/CPSC503-10/applications-of-finite-state.pdf
Errol will be well aware of that.

( NB: automotive/highway and to a large degree avionic control design pay very little attention to cognitive issues and that is one reason for the terrible highway accident rate and "pilot error" plane crashes. Audi, BMW are just beginning to redesign accordingly. Ford otoh have taken a giant step backwards with the new Fiesta. The current gap between military and civil avionic control systems is alarming. ATC even more so.)

Naom is a very nice guy but also a very, very disruptive one. As he has tenure at M.I.T. there is not much anybody can do about it. As well his professional work he is not in the least afraid of pointing out the double thinking that passes for logic and allegiance in today's world. Naom is a particular bete noire of "right thinking" people such as Fox News, the UK Conservative party and so on.

http://edition.cnn.com/2015/01/19/opinion/charlie-hebdo-noam-chomsky/

Never mind about the insult ( perceived) to kindle users...what about the snipe (perceived) at those who wear cardis ;-) :-D

Wearing a cardi is eminently sensible, not only can you put one on easily when you are cold but you can take it off when you are too hot, less weighty and restricting than a coat, easier to carry ( you can even tie it round your waist should you have a mind).

No! cardi wearers are not necessarily old biddies who wish to censor anything that is a little risque, who sit at the guillotine knitting ( more cardis?) while freedom of speech is executed to a cheer of "Down with Lady Chatterley".

Rosie in a coffee bar with a kindle or a book is just an intellectual with a kindle or a book ;-) , Rosie with a cardi on is still the same liberal minded, freedom loving, largely anti-censorship ( but essentially sensible) person as she is without the cardi......

Now about those pearls and sensible shoes........ ;-)

you can always tell when its cold in the north east

as my ugly cardie comes out like it has today

I've got my cardi on as we speak and my Kindle is on my bed :-D

A 'Cardi' is sometimes known as a 'Ganzie'.

Just thought this extraordinary fact might add something to the quality or otherwise of this thread - or maybe not. :-D

Redact my comment if you strongly disagree with this comment.

Guess who else has got a cardie on. :-D

But then I am an intellectually challenged person.
Sorry, I don't have a kindle, simply because I don't read books nowadays that's all.
The reason being, because I am frightened of snuffing it before I have read the final chapter. :-D :-D

Thanks for that Rollo - interesting reading indeed.

Errol,

Please don't take this the wrong way. I have been carefully reading all posts and cannot understand why the word Kindle was used or what point was to be made by it's inclusion, although you have tried to explain. I don't entirely agree with the formation of the sentence. Would it be possible to explain it in any other way?......I am genuinely interested and am not knocking the poster......I hope you will take this post the way it is intended. :-)

Susan10146857 - I used a phrase adjectivally. As I said earlier, would I get the same reaction if I used the adjectival phrase iPhone 6-toting?

Maybe we need to look at how English is taught as some people (not necessarily on this thread) have a problem with the basics of grammar.

The above is in no way singling out any one person who is a member of this website.

Ahhhh Adjectively!...Ok, I will go along with that cos it is my tea time and an English lesson would be too much for my poor brain to cope with without sustenance ;-)

( actually....I do believe you would get the same reaction, but I only joined the thread to get an answer to my initial interest so won't bother you any further with my ramblings ) :-)

Enjoy your tea.

as you're banging on about grammar - how about this

"Once again, the phrase "Kindle-toting pseudo-intellectuals" has a different meaning to the one you are trying desperately to enforce and I refuse to rise to the bait."


it should be "has a different meaning FROM"

the rule is "similar to" and "different from"

I know a song about grammar. :-P

I love you our Rose <3 :-D

I second that Supercrutch :-D <3

Nothing self-important or pompous about Rosie ;-)