Genealogy Chat

I'm having three problems around John:

there is some doubt about his birth year, an alternative hypothesis suggests 1763

he had a wife Elizabeth and there are suggestions of a sister Elizabeth, these come from another tree here in GR but the owner is not in a position to comment further, if the alleged dates are right then they both were born roughly at the same time and died about the same time - both reaching the ripe old age of 104 which stretches the imagination a bit . I'm wondering if they are in fact the same person or perhaps we are ascribing the birth date of one to both and the death date of the other to both

at least three of us are having difficulty (actually have met a brick wall) trying to get back to JH's parents

I wonder whether anyone here might have some helpful advice or could access records which might help please?

Keith

What is the source of the 'info' you have so far?

How did you work back to this man?

Where have you looked to try to find info?

.....................have you looked for a baptism........................at

https://familysearch.org/

For anyone unaware..........Beaminster is in Dorset

When in 1837 is he reputed to have died?

IF this is the right man.....................his age seems clear

Forename(s): John
Last name: HAMILTON
Date of burial 31 May 1837
Age at death: 74
Calculated year of birth: 1763
Place of burial Beaminster
Dedication: St Mary County: Dorset
Notes:
Beaminster St Mary:

Denomination: Anglican Coverage 1591 - 1995 Number of entries: 7,307
Record source: National Burial Index Data provider: Somerset & Dorset Family History Society

Place of death is no guide as to place of birth...........................

Day:6
Month:Sep
Year:1795
Groom Forenames:John
Groom Surname:HAMILTON
Groom's parish:Beaminster
Groom's county:Dorset,England
Groom's condition:bac
Groom's occupation:linendraper
Groom's age:Groom's notes:

Bride Forenames:Eliz
Bride Surname:CLIFT
Bride's parish:Beaminster
Bride's county:Dorset,England
Bride's condition:sp
Bride's age:
Bride's notes:dau of Mary
Place of Marriage:
Bondsman 1:GALPIN Richd,farmer,Yetminster,Dorset
Bondsman 2:
Jurisdiction:The Dean of Sarum in Wiltshire, Berkshire, Dorset and Uffculme, DevonRecord source:Sarum Marriage Licence Bonds
Find out more Data provider:Wiltshire Family History Society Transcriptions © Wiltshire Family History Society

Thanks Reggie
The doubts over the birth date arise from a version of the record you quote which suggests 1763 (by calculation based on supposed age at death), and a tree from someone else on GR which suggests 1771.
Keith

That marriage record matches what I know - almost. I have a record from Beaminster which says the marriage was 13 Sept 1795, the record you found says "Day:6", should that be taken to mean the date of marriage?
Keith

Dorset, England, Births and Baptisms, 1813-1906

BIRTH, BAPTISM & CHRISTENING
NAME: Ann Hamilton
MOTHER: Elizabeth Hamilton
FATHER: John Hamilton
BAPTISM: 3 Jan 1816 - Beaminster, Dorset, England
Dorset, England, Births and Baptisms, 1813-1906

BIRTH, BAPTISM & CHRISTENING
NAME: Robert Hamilton
MOTHER: Elizabeth Hamilton
FATHER: John Hamilton
BAPTISM: 3 Jan 1816 - Beaminster, Dorset, England
Dorset, England, Births and Baptisms, 1813-1906

BIRTH, BAPTISM & CHRISTENING
NAME: William Hamilton
MOTHER: Elizabeth Hamilton
FATHER: John Hamilton
BAPTISM: 3 Jan 1816 - Beaminster, Dorset, England
Dorset, England, Births and Baptisms, 1813-1906

BIRTH, BAPTISM & CHRISTENING
NAME: Matilda Hamilton
MOTHER: Elizabeth Hamilton
FATHER: John Hamilton
BAPTISM: 23 Nov 1817 - Beaminster, Dorset, England
Dorset, England, Births and Baptisms, 1813-1906

BIRTH, BAPTISM & CHRISTENING
NAME: Charles Hamilton
MOTHER: Elizabeth Hamilton
FATHER: John Hamilton
BAPTISM: 29 Sep 1819 - Beaminster, Dorset, England
Dorset, England, Baptisms, Marriages and Burials, 1538-1812

BIRTH, BAPTISM & CHRISTENING
NAME: John Hamilton
MOTHER: Elizabeth Hamilton
FATHER: John Hamilton
BAPTISM: 28 Dec 1799 - Beaminster
VITAL: 28 Dec 1799 - Beaminster, Dorset, England
Dorset, England, Baptisms, Marriages and Burials, 1538-1812


BIRTH, BAPTISM & CHRISTENING
NAME: Thomas Hamilton
MOTHER: Elizabeth Hamilton
FATHER: John Hamilton
BAPTISM: 28 Dec 1799 - Beaminster
VITAL: 28 Dec 1799 - Beaminster, Dorset, England
Dorset, England, Baptisms, Marriages and Burials, 1538-1812

BIRTH, BAPTISM & CHRISTENING
NAME: Catharine Hamilton
MOTHER: Elizabeth Hamilton
FATHER: John Hamilton
BAPTISM: 31 May 1806 - Beaminster
VITAL: 31 May 1806 - Beaminster, Dorset, England
Dorset, England, Baptisms, Marriages and Burials, 1538-1812

BIRTH, BAPTISM & CHRISTENING
NAME: Elizabeth Hamilton
MOTHER: Elizabeth Hamilton
FATHER: John Hamilton
BAPTISM: 31 May 1806 - Beaminster
VITAL: 31 May 1806 - Beaminster, Dorset, England
Dorset, England, Baptisms, Marriages and Burials, 1538-1812

BIRTH, BAPTISM & CHRISTENING
NAME: Mary Hamilton
MOTHER: Elizabeth Hamilton
FATHER: John Hamilton
BAPTISM: 4 Nov 1810 - Beaminster
VITAL: 4 Nov 1810 - Beaminster, Dorset, England
Dorset, England, Baptisms, Marriages and Burials, 1538-1812

BIRTH, BAPTISM & CHRISTENING
NAME: Sarah Hamilton
MOTHER: Elizabeth Hamilton
FATHER: John Hamilton
BAPTISM: 4 Nov 1810 - Beaminster
VITAL: 4 Nov 1810 - Beaminster, Dorset, England

Unsubstantiated entries on trees should be treated as 'suspect'........at best

Two transcribed records of his burial show his age to have been 74......

here is the other one, which I didn't originally feel it necessary to reproduce.

Forenames:John
Surname:HAMILTON
Abode:
Day:31
Month:May
Year:1837Age:74
Place:Beaminster
County:Dorset
Country:England
Notes:Record source:Dorset Burials
Find out more Data provider:Dorset FHS Transcriptions © Dorset Family History Society

From the IGI


Name: John Hamilton

Spouse's Name: Elizabeth Clift
:
Event Date: 13 Sep 1795
Event Place: Beaminster, Dorset, England

Indexing Project (Batch) Number: M15803-1
System Origin: England-EASy
GS Film number: 1279479

Thanks for the other marriage record, that agrees with what I already have, so do you know why the other record says day 6?

The baptisms are their children, although I have my suspicions that one or more of them might belong to another John + Elizabeth pair - although baptism dates are not a reliable guide to birth dates.

How much confidence would you have in the declared age at death? Some people simply didn't know ...

Keith

No, I don't know why the records differ...........


As for the age at death.........................I'd give more credence to the burial record than to someone else's tree, which, from what you say, does not have any documentary backup

BUT................visit the County Records Office............see what you can find there

Visiting the County Records Office would be ideal, but as I live in France it's a bit of a challenge :-(

Which was why I was hoping that someone here might be able to help out.

This has so far focused on JH's birth date, any thoughts on the other issues? Maybe a birth date for Elizabeth Clift? To compare with Elizabeth Hamilton?

Keith

Hello Keith apart from the family search site which Reggie suggested you might like to try this one too.

http://www.opcdorset.org/BeaminsterFiles/Beaminster.htm

Lesley x

Thanks Lesley, I've already found some useful dates there - but not for Elizabeth or JH birth unfortunately!

Keith

Keith you can always contact the OPC Zoe Martin she will probably be very helpful.

Good Luck
Lesley x

Well it's time to sign off for tonight, thanks Lesley and Reggie, I'll pick up any further thoughts in the morning ...

And it was Zoe who introduced me to the records, as you say she is very helpful!

Keith

Apologies....wasn't aware of your location.

The snag is....................no-one - at present - knows where either John or Elizabeth was born.

Both were 'of Beaminster' at the time of their marriage, but it doesn't necessarily follow that either of them was born there.

Elizabeth was apparently illegitimate......................which isn't of itself a great help, but, at least, if you do find a baptism, you'll be able to be reasonably confident of its relevance.

Do you know when Elizabeth died? And how old she was stated to be?