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Fetlar13
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14 Jan 2020 11:53 |
Hello there!
My first post for a while so please be be gentle with me.
My wife's first cousin has a Martha Brabander in her family tree and has asked me to try and find out more. With such an unusual surname I thought it would be fairly straight forward. However other than her marriage to William Robinson in 1880; I cannot find any other mention of this lady, no birth record and she doesn't seem to be on any census that I can access?
The only child I know of born to William and Martha is Thomas Robinson, born 1891 and baptised 01/01/1892 at St John's, Egremont, Wirral, Cheshire.
I'm after a couple of things. Can anyone find records of a younger Martha, birth or census info with her family, maybe a fathers and mother's name? Secondly can anyone tell me if William and Martha had any more children other than Thomas.
Thanks
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ArgyllGran
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14 Jan 2020 12:11 |
The marriage, for our reference:
Marriages Jun 1880 (>99%) BRABANDER Martha Birkenhead 8a 661 Robinson William Birkenhead 8a 661
You may need to buy a copy, to find out her father's name, if known.
Also Thomas's birth for our reference:
ROBINSON, THOMAS mms BRABANDER GRO Reference: 1892 J Quarter in BIRKENHEAD Volume 08A Page 528
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ArgyllGran
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14 Jan 2020 12:15 |
Other children:
ROBINSON, MARGARET mms BRABANDER GRO Reference: 1880 D Quarter in BIRKENHEAD Volume 08A Page 449
ROBINSON, MARY ELLEN mms BRABANDER GRO Reference: 1884 J Quarter in BIRKENHEAD Volume 08A Page 497
ROBINSON, FRANCIS mms BRABANDER GRO Reference: 1885 D Quarter in BIRKENHEAD Volume 08A Page 465
ROBINSON, JOHN mms BRABANDER GRO Reference: 1888 D Quarter in BIRKENHEAD Volume 08A Page 460
ROBINSON, WILLIAM mms BRABANDER GRO Reference: 1886 D Quarter in BIRKENHEAD Volume 08A Page 452
ROBINSON, CHARLES HUGH mms RABANDER GRO Reference: 1894 S Quarter in BIRKENHEAD Volume 08A Page 509
ROBINSON, MARTHA mms BRABANDER GRO Reference: 1890 S Quarter in BIRKENHEAD Volume 08A Page 490
ROBINSON, CATHERINE BRABANDER GRO Reference: 1898 S Quarter in BIRKENHEAD Volume 08A Page 499
ROBINSON, CHARLOTTE BRABANDER GRO Reference: 1896 D Quarter in BIRKENHEAD Volume 08A Page 520
ROBINSON, WILLIAM DAVID BRABANDER GRO Reference: 1902 M Quarter in BIRKENHEAD Volume 08A Page 459
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Fetlar13
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14 Jan 2020 12:15 |
Thanks ArgyllGran!
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malyon
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14 Jan 2020 12:20 |
could this be martha surname mis spelt
Martha Debrabander England and Wales Birth Registration Index, 1837-2008
Name: Martha Debrabander Event Type: Birth Registration Registration Quarter: Apr-May-Jun Registration Year: 1861 Registration District: Wirral County: Cheshire Event Place: Wirral, Cheshire, England Volume: 8A Page: 480 Affiliate Line Number: 153
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ArgyllGran
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14 Jan 2020 12:22 |
Martha Robinson in the 1881 England Census Name: Martha Robinson Age: 20 Estimated birth year: abt 1861 Relationship to Head: Wife Spouse: William Robinson Gender: Female Where born: Birkenhead, Cheshire, England Civil Parish: Birkenhead County/Island: Cheshire Country: England Street address: 8 Havelock St Marital status: Married Education: Employment status: View image Registration district: Birkenhead ED, institution, or vessel: 32 Neighbors: Piece: 3582 Folio: 59 Page Number: 28 Household Members: Name Age William Robinson 23 Martha Robinson 20 Margaret Robinson 1
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malyon
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14 Jan 2020 12:23 |
this could be matha notice she has father francis and sibling charles and she named her children francis and charles
Martha Brabande England and Wales Census, 1871 Name: Martha Brabande Event Type: Census Event Date: 1871 Event Place: Birkenhead, Cheshire, England, United Kingdom Sub-District: Birkenhead Enumeration District: 28 Gender: Female Age: 9 Marital Status: Unknown Occupation: Scholar Relationship to Head of Household: Daughter Birth Year (Estimated): 1862 Birthplace: Birkenhead, Cheshire Affiliate Image Identifier: GBC/1871/3749/0037 Household Role Sex Age Birthplace Francis Brabande Head Male 34 Belgium Bridget Brabande Wife Female 32 Liverpool, Lancashire John Brabande Son Male 19 Birkenhead, Cheshire Martha Brabande Daughter Female 9 Birkenhead, Cheshire Chas Brabande Son Male 1 Birkenhead, Cheshire
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Fetlar13
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14 Jan 2020 12:23 |
Wow thanks that's fantastic!!
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MargaretM
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14 Jan 2020 12:24 |
Possibly Martha in 1871?
Martha Brabande
in the 1871 England Census View 1871 England Census
Name: Martha Brabande Age: 9 Estimated birth year: 1862 Relation: Daughter Gender: Female Where born: Birkenhead Cheshire England Civil Parish: Birkenhead Ecclesiastical parish: St Anne Town: Birkenhead County/Island: Cheshire Country: England Registration district: Birkenhead Sub-registration district: Birkenhead ED, institution, or vessel: 28 Household schedule number: 146 Piece: 3749 Folio: 18 Page Number: 32 Household Members: Name Age Francis Brabande 34 Bridget Brabande 32 John Brabande 19 Martha Brabande 9
Edit: Note that son John is only 13 tears younger than Bridget. Chas Brabande 1
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ErikaH
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14 Jan 2020 12:24 |
DEBRABANDER, MARTHA (MMN) RYAN GRO Reference: 1861 J Quarter in WIRRAL Volume 08A Page 480
DEBRABANDER, JOHN RYAN GRO Reference: 1859 M Quarter in WIRRAL Volume 08A Page 453
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ArgyllGran
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14 Jan 2020 12:24 |
Martha Robinson in the 1891 England Census Name: Martha Robinson Gender: Female Age: 29 Relationship: Wife Birth Year: 1862 Spouse: William Robinson Child: Margaret Robinson George Robinson Mary E Robinson John Robinson Martha Robinson Birth Place: Birkenhead, Cheshire, England Civil Parish: Birkenhead Ecclesiastical parish: St Anne Residence Place: Birkenhead, Cheshire, England Registration district: Birkenhead Sub registration district: Birkenhead ED, Institution or Vessel: 38 Neighbors: Piece: 2886 Folio: 108 Household Members: Name Age William Robinson 32 Martha Robinson 29 Margaret Robinson 10 George Robinson 9 Mary E Robinson 7 John Robinson 2 Martha Robinson 1
Martha Robinson in the 1901 England Census Name: Martha Robinson Age: 39 Estimated birth year: abt 1862 Relation to Head: Wife Gender: Female Spouse: William Robinson Birth Place: Birkenhead, Cheshire, England Civil Parish: Birkenhead Ecclesiastical parish: St Anne County/Island: Cheshire Country: England Street address: Registration district: Birkenhead Sub-registration district: Birkenhead ED, institution, or vessel: 40 Neighbors: Piece: 3393 Folio: 124 Page Number: 10 Household schedule number: 59 Household Members: Name Age William Robinson 43 Martha Robinson 39 Margaret Robinson 20 George Robinson 18 Mary E Robinson 17 John Robinson 12 Martha Robinson 11 Charles H Robinson 6 Kate Robinson
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ArgyllGran
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14 Jan 2020 12:25 |
Mrs Martha Robinson in the 1911 England Census Name: Mrs Martha Robinson Age in 1911: 50 Estimated birth year: abt 1861 Relation to Head: Wife Gender: Female Birth Place: Chedle, Cheshire, England Civil Parish: Pendleton County/Island: Lancashire Country: England Marital status: Married Household Members: Name Age William Robinson 53 Martha Robinson 50 Robert Armstrong 23
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ArgyllGran
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14 Jan 2020 12:26 |
Martha Robinson in the England & Wales, Civil Registration Death Index, 1837-1915 Name: Martha Robinson Estimated birth year: abt 1864 Registration Year: 1906 Registration Quarter: Oct-Nov-Dec Age at Death: 42 Registration district: Birkenhead Inferred County: Cheshire Volume: 8a Page: 315
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Fetlar13
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14 Jan 2020 12:27 |
Confirms that the family came from the Low Countries,
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ErikaH
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14 Jan 2020 12:31 |
1881
Name: Francis Brabinder Age: 43 Estimated birth year: abt 1838 Relationship to Head: Head Spouse: Bridget Brabinder Gender: Male Where born: Belgium Civil Parish: Birkenhead County/Island: Cheshire Country: England Street address: 23 Cumberland Pl Marital status: Married Education: Employment status: View image Occupation: Rigger (Ship) Registration district: Birkenhead ED, institution, or vessel: 31 Piece: 3582 Folio: 32 Page Number: 44 Household Members: Name Age Francis Brabinder 43 Bridget Brabinder 41 Charles Brabinder 11 Catherine Brabinder 3
Martha's mother
Name: Bridget Ryan Age: 0 Birth Date: 15 Dec 1839 Baptism Date: 30 Dec 1839 Baptism Place: St Mary's, Liverpool, Lancashire, England Father: John Ryan Mother: Margaret Ryan
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ArgyllGran
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14 Jan 2020 12:32 |
The family before Martha's birth. Looks like Bridget Ryan was a second wife:
John De Eabander in the 1861 England Census Name: John De Eabander [John De Brabander] Age: 2 Estimated birth year: 1859 Relation: Son Father's name: Francis De Eabander Mother's name: Mary De Eabander Gender: Male Where born: Bhead, Cheshire, England [Birkenhead, Cheshire, England] Civil Parish: Birkenhead Ecclesiastical parish: Holy Trinity Town: Birkenhead County/Island: Cheshire Country: England Street address: Occupation: Condition as to marriage: View image Registration district: Birkenhead Sub-registration district: Birkenhead ED, institution, or vessel: 14 Neighbors: Household schedule number: 32 Piece: 2642 Folio: 44 Page Number: 6 Household Members: Name Age Francis De Eabander 25 - Antwerp, Belgium Mary De Eabander 22 - Liverpool John De Eabander 2
Mary Ann Riner in the Liverpool, England, Church of England Marriages and Banns, 1754-1932 Name: Mary Ann Riner Gender: Female Marriage Age: 17 Event Type: Marriage Birth Year: abt 1840 Marriage Date: 4 Aug 1857 Marriage Place: Liverpool, St Matthias, Lancashire, England Father: John Riner Spouse: Theodore Francois Debrabander
Theodore's father: Johannes Baptiste Debrabander
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ArgyllGran
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14 Jan 2020 12:35 |
No, Mary Ann Riner must be the same person as Bridget Ryan.
Here's the son John's birth:
DEBRABANDER, JOHN mms RYAN GRO Reference: 1859 M Quarter in WIRRAL Volume 08A Page 453
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ErikaH
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14 Jan 2020 12:45 |
Confirms my posting at 12:24
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ArgyllGran
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14 Jan 2020 12:45 |
For elimination only -
NOT Theodore Francois's parents' marriage - this is dated 1858
Joannes Baptista Franciscus De Brabander in the Antwerp, Belgium, Civil Registration, 1796-1906 Name: Joannes Baptista Franciscus De Brabander Gender: Male Spouse: Jacoba Antonia Warens
EDIT:
I suppose it could be a second marriage for Theodore François's father.
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safc
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14 Jan 2020 12:45 |
Marriage: 4 Aug 1857 St Matthias, Liverpool, Lancashire, England Theodore Francois Debrabander - 20, Mariner, Bachelor, Birkenhead Mary Ann Rinen - (X), 17, Spinster, Denison St Liverpool Groom's Father: Johannes Baptiste Debrabander, Master Mariner Bride's Father: John Rinen, Carpenter Witness: David McCowen, (X); Ann McClaughlan, (X) Married by Licence by: John R Pilling Register: Marriages 1850 - 1877, Page 78, Entry 155 Source: LDS Film 1656207
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