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Frederick with his parents in 1891?

Frederick B Smith
Gender: Male
Age: 34
Relationship: Son
Birth Year: 1857
Father: Frederick L Smith
Mother: Annie M A Smith
Birth Place: London, England
Civil Parish: Tottenham
Residence Place: Tottenham, Middlesex, England
Sub registration district: Tottenham
ED, Institution or Vessel: 28
Neighbors: View others on page
Piece: 1076
Folio: 34
Household Members:
Name Age
Frederick L Smith 72
Annie M A Smith 59
Frederick B Smith 34 (painter, writer & decorator)
Ernest Smith 24 (postman)
Edward G Smith 20(ironmongers assistant)

& in 1881:

Frederic B. Smith
Age: 25
Estimated birth year: abt 1856
Relationship to Head: Son
Father: Frederic L. Smith
Mother: Anne M. A. Smith
Gender: Male
Where born: London Bow, London, Middlesex, England
Civil Parish: Battersea
County/Island: London
Country: England
Street address: 10 Christchurch Terrace
Education:

Employment status:

View image
Occupation: Painter
Registration district: Wandsworth
ED, institution, or vessel: 8
Neighbors: View others on page
Piece: 639
Folio: 87
Page Number: 24
Household Members:
Name Age
Frederic L. Smith 61
Anne M. A. Smith 48
Frederic B. Smith 25
Ernest E. Smith 15
Edward G. Smith 10

His parents marriage?

Marriages Sep 1853 (>99%)
BARTER Anne Mary Amelia Southampton 2c 29 Scan available - click to view
Smith Frederic Leopold S Hampton 2c 29 Scan available - click to view

Ann's christening:

Ann Mary Amelia Barter
Birth Date: 25 Feb 1829
Birth Place: Fordingbridge, Hampshire, England
Gender: Female
Event Type: Baptism
Father: Thomas Barter
Mother: Maria
Baptism Date: 10 May 1829
Baptism Place: Fordingbridge, Hampshire, England
Denomination: Independent
Piece Title: Piece 0719: Fordingbridge (Independent), 1795-1837


And her parents marriage

Maria Ganaway
Gender: Female
Marriage Date: 1818
Marriage Place: Fordingbridge, Hampshire, England
Spouse: Thomas Barter
FHL Film Number: 1041294
Reference ID: 2:3V5011R

Frederick's christening:
Frederic Leopold Smith
Gender: Male
Baptism Date: 5 Sep 1819
Baptism Place: St. Mary's, Reading, Berkshire, England
Father: Thomas Smith
Mother: Sarah Smith
FHL Film Number: 1279467

His probate:
Frederic Leopold Smith
Death Date: 28 Jul 1893
Death Place: Middlesex, England
Probate Date: 22 Aug 1893
Probate Registry: London, England

Of 23 Stanley road, West Green, Tottenham, died Edmonton workhouse, probate to Anne Mary Amelia his widow - £107 3s 3d

Not sure, but this looks like Anne's death:

Anna Mary A Smith
Estimated birth year: abt 1830
Registration Year: 1908
Registration Quarter: Jan-Feb-Mar
Age at Death: 78
Registration district: Edmonton
Parishes for this Registration District: View Ecclesiastical Parishes associated with this Registration District
Inferred County: Middlesex
Volume: 3a
Page: 323

When i added this info i got hints for a different family so im worried these are coincidentally similar

Frederick Leopold Smith
BIRTH9 Oct 1825 St George, Middlesex, EnglandNEW

DEATH6 Nov 1894DIFFERENT 11 Railway Terrace, Derby, Derbyshire, EnglandNEW

sources (11) records (10)
Family Info
Father Thomas Smith (1780-)
Mother Sarah Smith (1785-)
Spouse Mary Ridgely Elliott (1839-1887)<-- Not the same as what i have below
Married 1858
Children
Frederick J R (1861-)
Florence M (1867-)
GERTRUDE MARY (1869-1915)
Alfred L. (1872-)
Sydney (1874-)
Davey (1877-)


My records below

Frederic Leopold Smith
BIRTH

DEATH28 Jul 1893

Family Info
Father Thomas Smith
Mother Sarah Smith (1785-)
Spouse Anne Mary Amelia Barter (-)
Children
Frederick Barter (1854-1933)

Mariposa, ignore hints, if they are matched to what other people submit,rather than actual records 90% of the time they are not related, just 'coincidental names' :-D

Also im struggling to find a death cert for Elizabeth Smith Nee Evans

?

Deaths Mar 1941 (>99%)
Smith Elizabeth 69 Surrey Mid.E. 2a 574

Thing is the Frederick dont match because the baptism shows 1819 yet my Frederick wasnt born until 1825

Frederick's christening:
Frederic Leopold Smith
Gender: Male
Baptism Date: 5 Sep 1819
Baptism Place: St. Mary's, Reading, Berkshire, England
Father: Thomas Smith
Mother: Sarah Smith
FHL Film Number: 1279467 :-\

Rambling, How did you find her death please? i seem to be really bad at this!

There was another Frederick Leopold Smith living in Derby - he was also a freemason from what I found earlier, but a different one to yours. Maybe you've latched onto the wrong one?

perhaps but now im so confused :(

i have Ada Lavinia Searl Nee smith born to Frederick (Frederic) Barter Smith 1857 and Elizabeth Evans 1871

Frederick B Smith was born to Frederick Leonold Smith 1825 and Anne Mary Amelia Barter 1829

I have no parents for Elizabeth

Is this correct?

Mariposa if you go onto freebmd.or.uk and deaths for an Elizabeth Smith after 1939 ( when we know she was still alive) and you can either put in Surrey from county list or as I did Surrey Mid eastern in registration districts ( that covers Epsom area) and that is the most likely given date of birth I think.

Mariposa What you have said is correct, as far as can be worked out without buying certs, but I would advise that you do buy some. Probably at least the Marriage cert for Ada to Searl, and for Elizabeth Evans to Frederic Smith, to confirm father's names, if stated.

Thanks Rambling. Now how do i get their marriage certificates? Is there a cheaper place to order from? any advice is welcome? id prefer a download rather than a physical copy posted out to me!

The certs can be ordered from the GRO (£11) using the details that have been posted eg Marriages Dec 1926 (>99%)

Searl Harry J Smith Kingston 2a 998
Smith Ada L Searl Kingston 2a 998

https://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/


Q2. What records are available as a PDF?
PDFs are available for historical digitised civil registration records held by GRO (i.e. birth entries from 1837 - 1918 and death entries from 1837 - 1957). A GRO index reference is required to be provided with the application. You can find the GRO index references by logging on to the GRO online ordering service and accessing the GRO online indexes. A PDF will cost £7.00 each.

So basically i cannot get a PDF Marriage Cert?

Afraid not, unless the GRO introduce that in the future. It is only the last couple of years that PDFs have been available for the births and deaths.

ok, ive ordered Ada and Harrys marriage Cert so i will wait for that. a month wait apparently :-| :-| :-|

Thanks to all who have helped on this piece, its been very successful

There were 2 Frederic(k) Leopold Smiths, the one you have born in 1825 was a railway inspector right up to his death (ancestry has the record), who was married to Sarah and had a son Frederick T Smith, who's occupation in 1881 was a railway clerk. The other is the one I posted born in 1819, who had a son Frederick B Smith, a painter /decorator depending on which census you look at, so hopefully the marriage certificate will throw some light on it.

Hopefully you can update us when the cert arrives.

So i received the Marriage Cert and it confirms Adas father is Frederick Barter smith - Gloucester Road, Kingston. Can anyone see who her mother was please?