Find Ancestors

Hi Christine

The last three entries you posted seem to tie in very well.

Lydia Long I am "assuminhg" is Henry's sster?

Henry in census anhd Baptismal record appears to tie in also.l

Many thanks for that. Had no luck with the websites you posted previously.

Janey thanks for "simplyfying thye thread for me.

No I have not ordered the death cert for Richard not sure other than the personh who was the informant would prove. But do not have a problem orderinhg it,

Not sure where to go from here.

Thank you both much appreciated,

Paula

PS sorry if there are any mistakes on this thead just got a new keyboard the the "touch" is completely different to the old one. Although the "KEYS"
are still thye same place (lol) although you might not believe it!!
PSS Just read this thread back and thought I would leave the typos in for effect!

1851 census - household transcription
Person: LONG, Henry
Address: 1, Francis Place, Saint Margarets, Westminster
LONG, Henry Unmarried M 34 1817 Weaver
Saint Margarets Westminster
Middlesex

Name: Henry Thomas Long
Record Type: Baptism
Date: 8 Oct 1815
Father's Name: Richard Long
Mother's Name: Mary Long
Parish: St Margaret, St Margaret Street, Westminster
Borough: Westminster
County: Middlesex
born 2 Sept (I think -a little diff to read)
Fathers occ Orris weaver
Residence Strutton Ground

London, England, Births and Baptisms, 1813-1906
about Lydia Catherine Long
Name: Lydia Catherine Long
Record Type: Baptism
Date: 8 Aug 1813
Father's Name: Richard Long
Mother's Name: Mary Long
Parish: St Margaret, St Margaret Street, Westminster
Borough: Westminster
County: Middlesex
born 18 july
Residence Strutton Ground
fathers occ orris weaver

Trying to refind the thread ...

On page 1 you said

Problem:- I cannot find any information on Richard Long or Mary other than the 1841 census.


LadyKira (Christine) proposed, on page 1, in 1861:

Address: 8, Emery Hills Almshouses, St John The Evangelist, Westminster
LONG, Richard Head Widower 82 1779
Almsman Formerly Gold Lace Weaver
Westminster Middlesex


I pointed out, on page 3, that the Richard and Mary from the 1841 were, in 1851:

Name: Richard Long
Age: 72
Estimated birth year: abt 1779
Spouse's name: Mary
Where born: Westr, Middlesex, England
Civil parish: Westminster St John The Evangelist
Occupation: horace weaver

Presumably the same man as LadyKira's 1861 Richard.
This would be a good reason to get that death cert -- that Richard was a widower when he died so a child may have been the informant (although likely not, if he was in the almshouse).


Dea proposed, on page 2, in 1851:

Richard Long
Age: 49
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1802
Spouse's Name: Ann
Where born: Westminster, Middlesex, England
Civil Parish: St Martin in The Fields
Occupation: orris weaver

Apparently a little young to be your Henry's father, but quite possibly a brother ... or uncle. It is still possible that your Henry was, e.g., a child of an unmarried daughter of Richard and Mary, who named his maternal grandfather as his father when he married. This was not uncommon. But we're working from the hypothesis that he was the son of Richard Long and Mary Fry, the 1800 marriage in the IGI?

Of course this is the point at which many of us are stymied, since records are not readily available, and the parish records that exist often do not contain enough information (mother's surname, or even mother's given name once we are back into the 1700s) to match up anyhow.


At least we've settled that the Richard and Mary from 1841 whom you were focusing on initially have been identified in 1851 and (for Richard) in 1861?

Did you obtain the death certificate for the possible death mentioned on page 1 a year ago?

Deaths Mar 1865
LONG Richard Westminster 1a 260

Since that's likely to be the one bit of actual documentation easily available, if that is your Richard as it seems it probably is, I hope so!

I will have another look tonight as there are more records available now.

formerly Christine
now LadyKira

n

Thanks Christine will contact Guidhall Library

Someone posted this on an earlier thread I was on. I think your family may fall into several of thesw categories.


For anyone looking for the following , from the Guildhall Library

LOCATIONS OF THE COMPANIES' RECORDS

3. The following companies retain their apprenticeship and membership records, and enquiries about them should be made to the Clerk of the company at the address given:


Clothworkers

Clothworkers' Hall, Dunster Court, London EC3R 7AH

Drapers

Drapers' Hall, 27 Throgmorton Street, London EC2N 2DQ

Goldsmiths

Goldsmiths' Hall, Foster Lane, London EC2V 6BN

Leathersellers

Leathersellers' Hall, 15 St Helen's Place, London EC3A 6DQ

Mercers

Mercers' Hall, Ironmonger Lane, London EC2V 8HE

Saddlers

Saddlers' Hall, Gutter Lane, London EC2V 6BR (Note: some records of apprentices 1658-65 and members 1624-6 included in Court minutes in Guildhall Library, microfilm copy of apprentice bindings 1800-1962 held at Guildhall Library)

Salters

Salters' Hall, Fore Street, London EC2Y 5DE

Stationers

Stationers' Hall, London EC4M 7DD (Note: microfilm copies at St Bride Printing Library, Bride Lane, London EC4Y 8EE; appointment necessary to view)

4. The non-current apprenticeship and membership records of the following companies are in Guildhall Library:

Apothecaries, Armourers and Brasiers

Bakers, Barbers (ca. 1540-1745 Barber Surgeons), Basketmakers, Blacksmiths, Bowyers, Brewers, Broderers, Butchers


Carmen, Carpenters, Clockmakers, Coach and Coach Harness Makers, Combmakers, Cooks, Coopers, Cordwainers, Curriers, Cutlers

Distillers, Dyers

Fanmakers, Farriers, Fellowship Porters, Feltmakers, Fishmongers, Fletchers, Founders, Framework Knitters, Fruiterers

Gardeners, Girdlers, Glass Sellers, Glaziers, Glovers, Gold and Silver Wyre Drawers, Grocers, Gunmakers

Haberdashers, Horners

Innholders, Ironmongers

Joiners and Ceilers

Longbowstringmakers, Loriners

Masons, Merchant Taylors#, Musicians

Needlemakers

Painter Stainers, Parish Clerks, Pattenmakers, Paviors, Pewterers, Pinmakers, Plaisterers, Playing Card Makers, Plumbers, Poulters

Saddlers (some only, see paragraph 3), Scriveners, Shipwrights, Skinners, Spectacemakers

Tacklehouse and Ticket Porters, Tallow Chandlers, Tin Plate Workers, Tobacco Pipe Makers, Turners, Tylers and Bricklayers

Upholders

Vintners

Watermen and Lightermen, Wax Chandlers, Weavers

Thanks

worth looking at


1841
Address: Carrington Street, St George Hanover Square, Westminster
CHARD, Thomas M 45 1796 Middlesex VIEW
CHARD, Eliza F 42 1799 Middlesex VIEW
CHARD, Eliza F 20 1821 Middlesex VIEW
CHARD, Ann F 19 1822 Middlesex VIEW
CHARD, Ellen F 50 1791 VIEW
GOLDSMIDT, Joseph M 50 1791 Foreign VIEW
DEAN, Charlotte F 40 1801 VIEW
BRAITHWAITE, George M 55 1786 VIEW
BRAITHWAITE, Susan F 60 1781 VIEW
LONG, Charles M 28 1813 VIEW
LONG, Mary F 28 1813 VIEW
LONG, Richard M 78 1763 VIEW
LONG, Ann F 70 1771 VIEW
PIPER, James M 24 1817 VIEW
CHISMAN, William M 30 1811 Middlesex VIEW
TAYLOR, William M 25 1816 Middlesex VIEW
TAYLOR, Charlotte F 75 1766 Middlesex VIEW
THORNTON, Charlotte F 50 1791

Thanks Christine. Have just emailed the Weavers Guild - if it goes through ok - the email looked a bit iffy.

Will update if/when they reply.

Will have to bookmark this thread and study it as the dates appear to be the main thing here

Regards Paula

Hi Paula
I also suggestef the weavers guild,From what I can make out it was a highly prestigious trade.

Hi Janey
for info re your optician there are several addresses and tips given on this thread

http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards.asp?wci=thread&tk=1141085

Thanks Janey will have to study this a bit - I think I am losing the "plot" now.

Will try googling the Weavers Guild for contact details

Once again thank you every

Regards Paula

It certainly was a family trade.

In 1881, William's son Henry and Richard's son Henry are both orris weavers, for instance.

Also William's son Thomas.

In 1851, William Long and his wife Ann are in Westminster St Margaret still, and they and their elder children are all orris weavers. William is born in Westminster.

Richard is a "Horace Weaver", heh, and is in Westminster St John the Evangelist.

They have to be related.

Ta Christine, I went back and checked and was relieved to see I hadn't completely lost the thread. ;)

So you figure they were related?

Heh. One of my Hills wasn't a William or a James, he was a Francis. His father was James, and two of his sons were William and James.

I've never been able to find him in 1841. He's from Devon, born 1819 (I have the baptism), and supposedly had a daughter born in Jersey c1843, per censuses. Where he (and his wife, or not-wife, or first wife ...) was in 1841 is a mystery.

I just looked ... again ... at the William Hill, optician, aged 63, in St Margaret Pettens in 1841whom I'd already looked at twice, wondering whether he might be a candidate for being a brother of your Richard. And once again, noted "optician", and saw no obvious connection.

But this time I noticed something that had escaped my notice the other times.

Just above him on the page is somebody I'd included in my list of "people who might be my grx2 grandfather" in 1841 ;) - a Francis Hill, warehouseman, aged 20, born out of county.

You never know. Maybe the Longs were all related, and our Long and Hill ancestors were on a first-name basis. ;)

I believe that was the one from page one Janey