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Not him his father is Charles Hill

Hi there LK. You sure are a glutton for punishment. I have to tell you that I have found that census entry for Frederick Hill at Manor House Rottingdean. It is the only thing which makes sense and seems to fit with his history. The 1887 date of birth fits. He could have been placed there after his mother dies, or even his mother and father. Edit. I t hink I need to make a concerted effort to find records of the place and whether there is any info about him.

I am puzzled why he knows his father's name and not his mother's name.

Hi Calhame, Janey and I are related. Well, we will be when she finds out that my Ernest Hill is the same as her Ernest Hill. She had decided to make that search her piece de resistance. That was before the lurgi took hold and she was reduced to eating chicken soup, baking cookies, and labouring industriously at work work.

No, I do jest. I think we have established that our Ernest Hills are a good distance apart in time and geography.

I am currently looking at an Edwin M Hill b. 1841 who was a reporter and a journalist. He had a son Ernest CS Hill born 1869. I am looking to see if that Ernest could have had a son Frederick. I am working on the occupation trend in this search.

As I said the 1891 census interests me. It may be I will have to buy the birth certificate of that Frederick and check the name of the father and mother.

I have found a birth Frederick William Hill JunQ 1887 Kensington 1a 96. That is as close to Earls Court London as I can find.

I have googled births, baptisms, foundling infants found on doorsteps in the Earls Court area around 1887 without success. I keep getting tangled up in records other than those for Earl's court and am beginning to wonder if the records might all be kept in one central point.


I am assuming the London Parish registers might hold the key. No luck. Also google brought up the Docklands Registers, why??

Name: Frederick William Hill
Year of Registration: 1887
Quarter of Registration: Jul-Aug-Sep
District: Kensington
County: Greater London, London, Middlesex
Volume: 1a
Page: 96 (click to see others on page)

Now if he is the Frederick William aged 4 on the 1891 census shown as born Earl's Court London we might be getting somewhere.

I also found a very interesting record on the 1901 census for a children's home for a William Hill, aged 14 in the "bereaved and destitute" list. His place of birth was given as London. That is stretching the imagination a little however once again it does fit his time frame, location and circumstances.

I have been trawling through the FreBMD records for any female with the family name Hill who died between Mar 1887 and Dec 1890. Females must be between 16 and 35. I have 63 names. I am now checking marriages for them to see when or if they married a Mr Hill.

If I am out in his date of birth I will just have to shift the search dates.

So that will keep you out of trouble fo a while.

Yep!! And not only that but I also ran reports for every marriage for an Ernest Hill between 1885 and 1888. I think about 16. I have cross check them between the Indexes and the marriages and Banns reports. Now I need to check which of the wives died just after marriage.

And I have also run the 1911 census info for Frederick Hill looking for someone who was a boarder. Strewth that little undertaking chewed up the credits. It may be that I have found what I was looking for, there is one possibility. Now I need to find Frederick going to Australia as an immigrant sometime between 1915 and 1919. And have you any idea how many Hill names did that?????

There's cobwebs everywhere.

Sherlocks climbed out of the archives.

Aatchoo!



Don't forget I have sub for 1911.

Well fine, you didn't tell me you had an actual thread, did you? There we were doing it by email. Of course, this was all when I was on my sickbed.

I went aha for a minute:

"Very intrigued by the census image showing Frederick Hill aged 4 living with a Matron Domestic at St Stephens in 1891 census."

St Stephens by Saltash being, of course, the home turf of my branch of the Bonds of Earth (Bond, James Bond -- family motto Orbis non sufficit = the world is not enough) -- Sarah Emma Bond being the mother of my Ernest Augustus Hill/Monck 1851.

But I see it's a different St Stephens. Dang, eh?

The only way we could be related is if AuntyS's Ernest Hill was a son of my

- Jacob James Hill, born 1845, married 1871 in St Giles in the Fields, died 1872 - issue - ??

- Stephen William Hill, born 1844, last seen 1861 in Plymouth

But there was a family tendency to name children after parents' siblings!

I recall messing around with these Hills of AuntyS's a fair bit, and finding nothing ... just thought I'd report in!

Hi Janey


I trust you are feeling better?

Rottingdean is near Brighton if you did not know.

Thanks, LK.

Yes, Sylvia, I am recovered, and madly procrastinating.


AuntyS and all -- one thing I didn't mention.

When searching censuses for Hill you must also search for

Hell
Hile
Hele
and maybe Hills

Just in case you've missed something. ;)

And a search for Fred* Hel* Hil* does find the odd interesting thing.


1901

Name: Frederick Hell
Age: 13
Estimated birth year: abt 1888
Relation: Inmate
[no place of birth]

Civil parish: Brentwood
Town: Brentwood
County/Island: Essex
Country: England
Registration district: Billericay

ED, institution, or vessel: Hackney Union Training Schools

another hill family in earls court

1901 census - household transcription
Person: HILL, Lilian
Address: 55, Chesson Road, Fulham

HILL, Thomas Head Married M 24 1877 Printer (Journeyman)
Chelsea
London VIEW
HILL, Lilian Wife Married F 22 1879
Earls Court
London VIEW
HILL, Muriel B Daughter Single F 0 (10 MOS) 1901
West Kensington
London VIEW

Possibly also intereting in 1901 (the name does look like Hele - but then my Ernest is a perfect Hile in 1871):

Name: Frederick Hele
Age: 14
Estimated birth year: abt 1887
Relation: Son
Mother's Name: Mary A
Gender: Male
Where born: Bow, London, England
> Occupation: Office Boy

Civil parish: St Mary Stratford Bow
Ecclesiastical parish: St Stephen
County/Island: London
Registration district: Poplar
Sub-registration district: Bow

Mary A Hele 56
Albert Hele 25
Rhoda Hele 23
Mary A Hele 19
Frederick Hele 14
George Hele 13
John Hele 10
Frederick Reynolds 27


- edit - knock them out; in 1891 at Ancestry they're transcribed as LELE and someone has corrected it to HELE.

LK, I just cannot follow FMP census results copied and pasted and not touched up.

Is Earl's Court not the birthplace just of the wife, not a Hill by birth?


There is a Hill couple with the husband born in Earl's Court Brompton -- he is variously Arthur E and Edward A, married to Louisa. He's a carpenter and in 1901 they're together with kids.

1901 census - household transcription
Person: HILL, Ernest L
Address: 36, Abingdon Villas, Kensington

SKINNER, J S Head Widow F 79 1822 Living On Own Means
Bradwich
Devonshire VIEW
SKINNER, Sydney M Son Single M 36 1865 Drapers Assistant
Notting Hill
London VIEW
HILL, Blanche M Daughter Widow F 38 1863 Living On Own Means
Notting Hill
London VIEW
HILL, Edgar W Grand Son Single M 13 1888
Walford
Hertfordshire VIEW
HILL, Ernest L Grand Son Single M 2 1899
Wembley
Middlesex VIEW
JENNINGS, William E Visitor Single M 33 1868 Ribbon Warehouseman
Dalston
London

Interesting as there is a baby earnest

she married William

Sorry JC
Wife is born earls court which is an area of Kesimgton so I have posted a family in the same area connection unknown.

The father here is a porter, in 1891:

Name: Fred Hill
Age: 4
Estimated birth year: abt 1887
Relation: Son
Father's Name: Wm
Mother's Name: Mary G
Where born: Shoreditch, London, England

Civil parish: Shoreditch

Wm Hill 40 - born Hampshire
Mary G Hill 38
Henry Wm Hill 14
Alfred Hill 12
Ada Hill 9
Fred Hill 4
Frederick Hill 22
Wm Kidd 39
Catherine De Velk 33
Obediah Whitehead 60


For some reason I had looked at Frederick Hill 22 and Wm Kidd before.