Military Chat

Just looking at the dates...

Joseph died 2 days before Herbert was captured, so your father probably never knew for some time, that his brother had died :-(

He was born in 1919, so was 22 when he died:

Births Jun 1919
Salter Joseph W (mmn Thompson) Basford 7b 352

Yes this is my uncle, I think he was 21 when he died my sister as a photo of the cemetery he is in. Thank you

Commonwealth War Graves listing for Kranji cemetery Singapore

https://www.cwgc.org/visit-us/find-cemeteries-memorials/cemetery-details/2015800/singapore-cremation-memorial/#:~:text=Kranji%20War%20Cemetery%20is%2022,Club%20Avenue%20and%20Kranji%20Road.

This Joseph Salter ????

https://probatesearch.service.gov.uk/search-results

1 result returned
Last name First name Date of death Regiment number
SALTER JOSEPH WILLIAM 13 February 1942 5776707

Probate number FAEK056540

A copy of Joseph's will is available to order from GOV.UK website
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
First name(s) Joseph William
Death date 13 Feb 1942
Last name Salter
Country Singapore
Service number 5776707
View the original source View the record's source
Rank Private
Original source Commonwealth War Graves Commission Debt Of Honour
Regiment Royal Norfolk Regiment
Record set World War 2 Allies Collection
Unit or regiment 6th Bn.
Category Military, armed forces & conflict
Year 1942
Subcategory Second World War
Death year 1942
Collections from Americas, Australasia, Great Britain, Ireland, UK None
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
First name(s) Joseph William
Regiment Royal Norfolk Regiment
Last name Salter
Grave reference Column 52.
Birth year -
Cemetery or Memorial Singapore Memorial
Age -
Burial country Singapore
Death year 1942
Link https://www.cwgc.org/find/find-war-dead
Death date 13 Feb 1942
Record set Commonwealth War Graves Commission Debt Of Honour
War Second World War, 1939-1945
Category Military, armed forces & conflict
Number 5776707
Subcategory Second World War
Rank Private
Collections from Great Britain, UK None
Unit 6th Bn.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Army Roll Of Honour 1939-1945
Great Britain

First name(s) Joseph W
Death day 13
Last name Salter
Death month 2
Service number -
Theatre of war Malaya
Rank Private
Country Great Britain
Regiment The Royal Norfolk Regt
Record set Army Roll Of Honour 1939-1945
Birth place Nottingham
Category Military, armed forces & conflict
Residence Nottingham
Subcategory Second World War
Death year 1942
Collections from Great Britain, UK None

T,hank you very much for all your information, you are amazing. This is my father and I am fascinated with all the information you have provided. My father's brother Joseph Salter is on the 1939 register was killed in the war and his buried in Singapore but unfortunately I have never been able to go there. Once again tha nk you x

WO 344 - War Office: Directorate of Military Intelligence: Liberated Prisoner of War Interrogation Questionnaires
Subseries within WO 344 - Japan
WO 344/400 - RUSKIN - SETTLE. In 2 parts. (Orderable at item level)

"Ordering and viewing options
This record has not been digitised and cannot be downloaded.
You can order records in advance to be ready for you when you visit Kew. You will need a reader's ticket to do this. Or, you can request a quotation for a copy to be sent to you."

https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C9105454

TRAIL AND TRIAL THE 35TH LIGHT ANTI-AIRCRAFT REGIMENT ROYAL ARTILLERY 1939-1945

https://www.iwm.org.uk/collections/item/object/1506001342

This media is not currently available online. Contact the Image and Film Licensing team about access

Following on from Herbert's Liberation Questionnaire in my last post -

On pages 8-13 of the link below, there's a description of Saigon camp from a US point of view.
(I assume it's No. 1, although it says it was only set up in May 1942. Perhaps Herbert was held elsewhere from Feb to May) :

https://tinyurl.com/2vy5fmnd

Apparently it was one of the better camps, though that's not saying much.

For Far East Prisoners of War (FEPOW) websites, consider looking at the following:

http://www.captivememories.org.uk/

http://www.fepow-community.org.uk/

http://www.cofepowdb.org.uk/cdb2/Index.jsp

http://www.cofepow.org.uk/pages/armedforces_raf1.htm

http://www.west-point.org/family/japanese-pow/

http://www.far-eastern-heroes.org.uk/

http://www.mansell.com/pow-index.html

http://www.researchingfepowhistory.org.uk/

http://www.fepow-memorial.org.uk/The_FEPOW_Story.htm

http://www.theprisonerlist.com/further-research.html

http://www.cofepowdb.org.uk/cdb2/Controller.jsp?action=simplesearch

Prisoners of war, Far East: British POWs in Thailand and Saigon as at 1st August 1945; nominal roll

First name(s) Herbert
Archive The National Archives
Last name Salter
Archive reference WO 361/2196
Year 1945

Re Gunner Herbert Salter, service number 1700105 - that is the correct man:

Captured 15/2/1942, liberated 2/9/1945 - as posted by Gwyn.
One sketchy record on Ancestry implies he was in Camp No 8 in Thailand - but Google searches don't reveal exactly where Camp 8 was.

There are records on FMP, a couple of which say he was in Camp 4, but I don't have a sub.
https://www.findmypast.co.uk/search/results?datasetname=prisoners+of+war+1715-1945&sid=103&firstname=herbert&firstname_variants=true&lastname=salter


Someone here says Camp 4 was a "Death Camp" at Kanchanburi:
https://ww2talk.com/index.php?threads/no-4-camp-thailand.95275/


Many Google results say that Kanchanburi was the camp associated with the River Kwai bridge.

HOWEVER, here is the first page of Herbert's Liberation Questionnaire, in which HE says he was in Camp 1 at Saigon.

https://lq-cofepow.org/products/salter-herbert?_pos=2&_sid=d7f32b4ae&_ss=r

DOB: 14 July 1910. <<<<<<<<<<<<
Unit: 35th Lab. Regt. RA
Enlisted: 30 9/1940
Home address: 228 Highbury Road, Bulwell, Notts.
Captured: Singapore, 15/2/1942
Was at No 1 Camp, Saigon, 1942-1945.

That page says that Ancestry has Liberation Questionnaires - and it does, but apparently not Herbert's.

War Office: Directorate of Prisoners of War: Prisoners of War Lists, Second World War, 1943-1945

First name(s) Herbert
Conflict World War 2
Last name Salter
Archive The National Archives
Year 1942
Service number 1700105

WO 392/26

WO 345 - War Office: Japanese Index Cards of Allied Prisoners of War and Internees, Second World War

Reference: WO 345/45
Description: Rote - Schofield
Date: 1942-1945

Prisoners of war, Far East: Thailand POW Camp, name list, as of 1 November 1944; volume II

Reference: WO 361/1955

FMP has an original Index Card

Apart from duplicating information already available, further info includes

NOK Mr H Salter
228 Highbury Road
Bulwell
Nottingham

Served with Royal Artillery

DOB 14/07/1910 ***************************************

Herbert had several Card Numbers during his capture. These included 14056 (newer) and 465 (older)

1921 Census Of England & Wales
18, Wollaton Street, Hucknall, Hucknall Torkard, Nottinghamshire, England

Herbert Salter Head Male 1883 38 Stonebroom, Derbyshire, England Coal Miner Hewer Newstead Colly Co
Florence Salter Wife Female 1885 36 Kingswinford, Staffordshire, England Household Duties -
Herbert Salter Son Male 1910 10 Newstead, Nottinghamshire, England - -
Leslie Salter Son Male 1912 8 Newstead, Nottinghamshire, England - -
Nellie Salter Daughter Female 1914 7 Hucknall, Nottinghamshire, England - -
Wilfred Salter Son Male 1915 5 Hucknall, Nottinghamshire, England - -
Samuel Salter Son Male 1917 4 Hucknall, Nottinghamshire, England - -
Joseph Salter Son Male 1919 2 Hucknall, Nottinghamshire, England - -

1939 Register
228 Highbury Road, Nottingham, Nottingham C.B., Nottinghamshire, England

Herbert Salter 24 Feb 1883 Male General Light Labourer Married 143 1
Florence Salter 17 Feb 1885 Female Unpaid Domestic Duties Married 143 2
Herbert Salter 14 Jul 1910 Male Colliery Hewer Married 143 3
Leslie Salter 23 Sep 1912 Male Quarry Stone (Labourer) Single 143 4
Wilfred Salter 01 Jul 1915 Male General Labourer Single 143 5
Joseph W (L) Salter 29 Mar 1919 Male Cabinet Works Labourer Single 143 6
Bertram Salter 22 Sep 1921 Male Painter Wagon Works Single 143 7
Roy Salter 19 Dec 1933 Male At School Single 143 8
Ernest E Lane 10 Sep 1889 Male General Labourer Married 143 9
Cecelia Blackshaw (Richards) 19 Jul 1920 Female Hosiery Factory Hand Single 143 10

Using his service number and the regiment (Royal Regiment of Artillery) you can now apply for his records using the link provided earlier by greyghost

This may help.......................Archive reference WO 361/2172

It is likely that he is remembered by name at the National Memorial Arboretum in Staffordshire.
Just names are shown, no details, but there is a special area where prisoners of war are remembered.

There are - very basic - records on FMP of a Gunner of that name being a PoW in Thailand
Service number 1700105

UK residence, Newstead, Notts, which fits census records for him

???
Possible record on Ancestry. No date of birth shown for anyone on this page.

Name Herbert Salter
Rank Gnr
Military Date 15 Feb 1942
Service Branch A
Service Number 1700105
Description 26: British Prisoners of War Held in Japan or Japanese-Occupied Territory: R - Z

Service number on image 1700105
The date shown is date of capture.
Image shows date of capture was 15 February 1942 and date of liberation was 2 September 1945
Camp where held , TH