Military Chat

Captain James Agg was the father of Maria Agg, Maria was born in India in 1782 and died there in 1851, she married William Coward Faithfull in 1805. I read that James Agg was the designer & builder of St Johns Cathedral in Calcutta in 1784.
However I have read at Landed Families blogspot.com that James Agg went to India in 1777 and designed & built St St Johns Cathedral and did not start a family until after he returned to England in 1796 & married 1797.
It would appear to be 2 different men in India at the same time with the same name.
Does any one have more details on James Agg that can resolve this mystery about Captain James Agg.

Not sure if this is "your" James Agg but I can only find one baptism of a child called James Agg from 1755 +/- 40 years in England:-

Record Transcription:
England Births & Baptisms 1538-1975
What can I do with this record?
Attach this record as a source to a person on your tree. Also update people and relatives with details from this record

First name(s) James
Last name Agg
Gender Male
Birth year -
Birth place -
Baptism year 1756
Baptism date 16 Jul 1756
Place Coln Saint Denis
County Gloucestershire
Country England
Father's first name(s) Henry
Father's last name Agg
Mother's first name(s) Mary
Mother's last name -
Record set England Births & Baptisms 1538-1975

Kath. x

According to this Maria's husband's name was William CONROD Faithfull:-

Record Transcription:
British India Office Marriages

First name(s) William Conrod
Last name Faithfull
Marriage year 1805
Marriage date 26 Jun 1805
Spouse's first name Maria
Spouse's last name Agg
Place Bengal
Presidency Bengal
Groom's father's first name -
Groom's father's last name -
Bride's father's first name -
Bride's father's last name -
Catalogue description Parish register transcripts from the Presidency of Bengal, : 1713-1948
Archive reference N-1-7
Folio number 104
Entry number -
Record set British India Office Marriages
Category Birth, Marriage, Death & Parish Records
Subcategory Parish Marriages

Kath. x

According to Google St. John's Cathedral in Calcutta was designed by architect Lieutenant James Agg of the Bengal Engineers

Kath. x

This is the only baptism of a Maria Agg that I can find and it's in England but her father's name is John, not James:-

Record Transcription:
England Births & Baptisms 1538-1975

First name(s) Maria
Last name Agg.
Gender Female
Birth year -
Birth place -
Baptism year 1785
Baptism date 08 Dec 1785
Residence Claydon, Suffolk, England
Place Claydon
County Suffolk
Country England
Father's first name(s) John
Father's last name Agg.
Mother's first name(s) Sarah
Mother's last name -
Record set England Births & Baptisms 1538-1975

Kath. x

Captain James Agg of Bengal retired from the East India Company on 11 Dec 1799, per the image of this record:

James Agg
in the UK, Registers of Employees of the East India Company and the India Office, 1746-1939
Name: James Agg
Record Type: Military
Military Date: 11 Dec 1799
Military Place: India

So he can't be the one who returned to England in 1796.

EDIT:
But see later post - the Landed Gentry BlogSpot says the cathedral builder retired from the EIC in 1799, after his marriage in England.

And this must be the other one - the one who built the cathedral:

[ EDIT: No, I think this is Maria's father.]

Lieutenant James Agg, assay master at Moorshedabad was commissioned on 3 Nov 1785. He's listed under Engineers.
The register is dated 1795.

James Agg
in the UK, Registers of Employees of the East India Company and the India Office, 1746-1939
Name: James Agg
Record Type: Military
Military Date: 3 Nov 1785
Military Place: India


Or maybe not - a Captain is higher in rank than a Lieutenant, so maybe he was promoted between 1795 and 1799.

And I wouldn't think an assay master would be designing and building cathedrals.

See page 106 of this book:

https://tinyurl.com/ycf73wu8

This will be the cathedral builder - commissioned 3 Nov 1782.

James Agg of Fort William, Bengal - an engineer.
Record dated 1792.

Lieutenant James Agg
in the UK, Registers of Employees of the East India Company and the India Office, 1746-1939
Name: Lieutenant James Agg
Record Type: Military
Military Date: 3 Nov 1782
Military Place: India


Or is one of the dates of commission a mistake ? 1782 or 1785?
Same day and month in the two records.

Kath posted baptism of James Agg 1756, father Henry.

Apparently the cathedral builder was born 1746, father William, baptised Cheltenham - per the Landed Gentry BlogSpot (which I don't think is necessarily entirely accurate) mentioned in the opening post.

But it also says he retired from the East India Company in 1799, after his return to England - so that would match with the record posted earlier re Captain James Agg.

I'm beginning to think the two Jameses in India are the same person. He could have been married (and widowed ?) in India - or not married but acknowledged Maria as his child.

This will be the cathedral builder's baptism (and possibly also Maria's father's );


James Agge
England Births and Christenings
Name James Agge
Gender Male
Christening Date 07 Mar 1745
Christening Date (Original) 07 MAR 1745
Christening Place DIDBROOK,GLOUCESTER,ENGLAND
Father's Name William Agge

It may well be that James Agg was not married to Maria's mother.

There is this death of an infant:

First name(s) Elizabeth
Last name Agg
Birth year 1789
Age 0
Burial date 07 Jan 1789
Place Fort William
Presidency Bengal
Archive Reference N-1-4
Folio -
Page 87
Catalogue Description Parish register transcripts from the Presidency of Bengal, : 1713-1948

The image describes Elizabeth as an infant, NATURAL daughter of Lieutenant James Agg.

There is a girl born as the daughter of Captian Agg (no initial or forename), not baptised until 1800 though.

First name(s) Kezia
Last name Agg
Birth year 1793
Birth date Nov 1793
Baptism year 1793
Baptism date 24 Nov 1800
Place Calcutta
Presidency Bengal
Father's first name(s) -
Father's last name Agg

Her sister, born 1890, is baptised at the same time:

First name(s) Mary Ann
Last name Agg
Birth year 1790
Birth date Apr 1790
Baptism year 1790
Baptism date 24 Nov 1800
Place Calcutta
Presidency Bengal
Father's first name(s) -
Father's last name Agg
Mother's first name(s) -
Mother's last name -
Archive reference N-1-5

Mary Ann Agg died as a spinster and is described as the daur of Lieut Agg of the Engineers.

First name(s) Mary Ann
Last name Agg
Birth year 1791
Death date 17 Nov 1869
Death year 1869
Age 78
Burial date 18 Nov 1869
Place Calcutta
Presidency Bengal
Archive Reference N-1-130
Folio -
Page 133
Catalogue Description Parish register transcripts from the Presidency of Bengal, : 1713-1948

There is mention of a Mary Ann Agg, and other Aggs in the inventory following James Agg's death in 1827, but I find it hard to pick out all the names. I think there is a Miss Margaret Agg, and a Miss Mary Agg,

First name(s) James
Last name Agg
Event year 1828
Presidency Bengal
Age -
Record type Inventory
Archive reference L-AG-34-27-91
Page/folio number 462
Catalogue description Inventories & Accounts of Deceased Estates - Bengal 1780-1937
Record set British India Office Wills & Probate
Category Birth, Marriage, Death & Parish Records
Subcategory Wills & Probate

The listing of the will the previous year mentions his widow, Edith Agg.

irst name(s) James
Last name Agg
Event year 1827
Presidency Bengal
Death year -
Place -
Record type Administration
Archive reference L-AG-34-29-3
Catalogue description Administrations - Bengal
Record set British India Office Wills & Probate
Category Birth, Marriage, Death & Parish Records
Subcategory Wills & Probate

His marriage in England to an Edith:

Pallot's Marriage Index, 1780-1837

Name: James Agg
Spouse: Gardner Edith
Marriage Date: 1797
Parish: Cheltenham Glouc Marr Vo 7

and:

Name: James Agg
Gender: Male
Event Type: Marriage
Marriage Date: 14 May 1797
Marriage Place: Cheltenham, Gloucestershire, England
Parish as it Appears: Cheltenham
Spouse: Edith Gardner

A third child, son of Captain Agg baptised belatedly in 1800

First name(s) Thomas
Last name Agg
Birth year 1788
Birth date Dec 1788
Baptism year 1788
Baptism date 24 Nov 1800
Place Calcutta
Presidency Bengal
Father's first name(s) -
Father's last name Agg
Mother's first name(s) -
Mother's last name -
Archive reference N-1-5
Folio 282
Page -
Catalogue descriptions Parish register transcripts from the Presidency of Bengal
Record set British India Office Births & Baptisms
Category Birth, Marriage, Death & Parish Records

Some of that - e.g. - marriage to Edith - does look as if the two Jameses are one and the same person.

But Mary Ann and Thomas were baptised after he had returned to England.
Baptism arranged by the mother ??
Or by whoever had been left to care for them?

Gordon says Maria was born in India in 1782.

However, a tree on Ancestry says the Maria who married William Faithfull was born in Gloucestershire in 1786, and baptised at Coln St Denis.

That ought to link her to the 1756 baptism of James Agg in Coln St Denis, posted by Kath near the start of this thread.

But that James's father was Henry, not William as stated in Landed Gentry blogspot.

According to the tree that Maria's parents were William Agg 1752-1808 and Sarah Arundell 1758 -1838. Not James.
William was, apparently, never in India.

There seem to have been a few Agg families in Gloucestershire, all with the same forenames.

Easy to get them mixed up, especially as records are scarce and not very informative.

I did wonder whether Kezia, Mary Ann and Thomas were all baptised in a job lot as a reaction to James deciding it would not be advisable to return to India as it might be "injurious to his health" , possibly to 'validate' them in some way?

Maria's age at death gives her a birth year of c1787, which ties in reasonably well with the births of the other childrn.

First name(s) Maria
Last name Faithful
Birth year 1787
Death date 02 Apr 1851
Death year 1851
Age 64Y 7M
Burial date 03 Apr 1851
Place Calcutta
Presidency Bengal
Archive Reference N-1-79
Folio -
Page 393
Catalogue Description Parish register transcripts from the Presidency of Bengal, : 1713-1948
Record set British India Office Deaths & Burials
Category Birth, Marriage, Death & Parish Records
Subcategory Parish Burials

She is described as the relict of the late Maj General W C Faithfull.

??

Described as a Lieut Colonel on the image for this record :

First name(s) William Conrad
Last name Faithful
Birth year 1857
Death date 22 Dec 1914
Death year 1914
Age 57
Burial date 23 Dec 1914
Place Srinagar
Presidency Bengal
Archive Reference N-1-401
Folio -
Page 242
Catalogue Description Parish register transcripts from the Presidency of Bengal, : 1713-1948
Record set British India Office Deaths & Burials

The James who died 1827 was aged 80 according to the record

Gloucestershire, England, Church of England Burials, 1813-1988

Name: James Agg
Age: 80
Birth Year: abt 1747
Burial Date: 22 Jan 1827
Burial Place: Prestbury, Gloucestershire, England
Parish as it Appears: Prestbury

My gut feeling is that we are talking about just one James Agg, the one who died in 1827 aged 80, so likely the one baptised 1845?

Whilst in India he formed a liasion(s), possibly with a local woman that fell short of marriage and resulted in the births of at least five children, Maria c1787, Elizabeth 'natural' daughter of Lieut James Agg born 1788/9, died Jan 1789 possibly twin of Thomas Agg born Dec 1788, Mary Ann Agg born April 1790, and Kezia Agg born Nov 1793.

None of the children were initially baptised, though the latter 3 were done in a job lot in 1800 - not sure why Maria was not included in that.

After James returns to England he contracts his first 'offiical' marriage with Edith Gardner at the age of 50 or so.

Another Agg infant's death is recorded at Fort William in 1792, but no parentage is recorded:

First name(s) Robert
Last name Agg
Birth year 1792
Death date 24 Jul 1792
Death year 1792
Age 0
Place Fort William
Presidency Bengal
Archive Reference N-1-4
Folio -
Page 160
Catalogue Description Parish register transcripts from the Presidency of Bengal, : 1713-1948

I agree with you ,Kucinta.

I think it's too much of a coincidence to have two James Aggs in Calcutta and area, both working for the East India Company, at the same time.

The Ancestry tree has confused two Gloucestershire Jameses and also two Marias.

This might be a complete red herring....

First name(s) -
Last name Agg
Birth year 1766
Age 41
Burial date 08 Jan 1807
Place Calcutta
Presidency Bengal
Archive Reference N-1-7
Folio -
Page 338
Catalogue Description Parish register transcripts from the Presidency of Bengal, : 1713-1948
Record set British India Office Deaths & Burials
Category Birth, Marriage, Death & Parish Records

Imags says Fort William garrison. Mrs Agg, a native aged 41 years.

Also this death at Fort William garrison:

First name(s) Thomas
Last name Agg
Birth year -
Age -
Burial date 29 Sep 1803
Place Calcutta
Presidency Bengal
Archive Reference N-1-6
Folio -
Page 238
Catalogue Description Parish register transcripts from the Presidency of Bengal, : 1713-1948
Record set British India Office Deaths & Burials

No age or parentage given, but he is recorded as Master Thomas Agg, suggesting he was not yet adult?