General Chat

Sheesh Cynthia.....I now feel so guilty, but it put a thought into my head.

I used to read the bible most days but not so these last few years. my concentration with words became unfortunately lacking although I love books. The kindle has made reading easier for me but I mostly listen to audio books as it doesn't involve the concentration on the written page that books do......anyway, my point is.....I have just had a thought and will shortly take a look.....I wonder if they do a decent audio version of the bible....( no I am not going blind lol.....just can't concentrate on a written page as much as I could)

John....you have just reminded me of my Sunday school days when I loved to go to as many of them as I could fit in the day, just to listen to the wonderful stories.

There was one time when I had to stay with my step gran in London. I found out where the nearest Sunday school was ( I think I was 5 ) then came back and asked my step gran if she could give me twopence for the plate......well! To say she was not pleased would be an understatement but the gist of it was that she wasn't going to waste her money by giving it to any Sunday school......I was very upset and missed the service because I was too embarrassed to go without plate money.....funny what one remembers when the memory is jogged......I'm afraid we never did get on from that day :-(

Good morning everyone :-)


I found yesterday's words very thought provoking too Susan. If you google, you will find that there are many ways of reading/listening to the bible in many different versions - including audio books. I do hope you find something which is helpful to you.

As I usually speak from my Anglican perspective, I looked into which version of the bible the C. of E. recommend. Most of the information given is for public worship and, no doubt because we are the state church and guided by legislation, that is fair enough.

It was interesting to read the criteria as to which versions of Scripture are judged suitable for reading in church during the course of public worship :

Faithfulness in translating the Hebrew or Greek

Resonance with the language of prayer used in the particular authorized service

Suitability for reading aloud in a public gathering

Use of familiar language in well-known quotations or figures of speech

Familiarity to the listener

Intelligibility to the listener

Appropriateness to the linguistic register of the particular congregation


The versions recommended are:

The Authorised Version (King James)
The Revised Standard Version (RSV)
The New International Version (NIV)
The New Jerusalem Bible (NJB)
The New Revised Standard Version (NRSV)
The Revised English Bible (REB)
The English Standard Version (ESV)


I did some homework and discovered that, at our church, we use the NRSV. :-)


The C. of E. and, I think, our Roman Catholic friends, have set readings for each Sunday and follow a pattern throughout the year.


And on that note.......the following verses are more than apt! :-) :-)


My Bible

I like to read my Bible,
When I go to bed each night;
I like to read a chapter through,
Before I turn off my light.

But some nights when I'm tired,
And can no longer see to read,
I just hold my Bible in my hands,
It seems that's all I need.

Its nearness and its closeness,
Grant wondrous dreams to me.
I can visualize my Lord,
As a youth at Galilee.

I see Jonah, I see Noah,
I see Peter, even Paul.
And I feel truly blest some nights,
To see the Fairest One of All.

My heart goes out to poor, rich Job,
As I hear his plaintive pleas.
I am hurting right there with him,
Oh, God, do help us, please!

Just holding onto that dear Book,
Allows me special powers.
I've traveled to Jerusalem,
I've seen the Babel Towers.

I've traveled to both gardens,
Sometimes they're intertwined.
I've seen the place where Jesus wept,
And where Satan snatched mankind.

I saw Jesus in His swaddling clothes,
I saw that wondrous star;
I shed tears for Him at Calvary,
When I saw His body marred.

On those nights I'm over-tired,
And only want to rest,
And do not want to read or think,
That's when holding's at its best.

For then the sense of calm I get,
Slows down my racing mind.
And I deeply sigh in my relief,
To the welcome peace I find.

When sad, I lay my tearful cheek,
Against my Bible's cover.
And I sense a sweet caress,
More gentle than a lover's.

If I am chilled, it warms my hands,
My heart seems warmer, too.
My twisted fingers straighten out,
They truly feel renewed.

If my head is throbbing,
From the tasks I did that day,
I hold my Bible to my brow,
The ache soon goes away.

I get a warmth or energy,
When something seems to flow.
Between my body and my Book,
I know that this is so.

All I do is hold the Book,
No need to turn a leaf;
I get a message straight from God,
And receive Divine Relief.

If over time my vision dims,
And I can no longer look,
I'll still caress it with my hand,
I'll not give up my Book.

And, of all the years I have survived,
And, of all the books I've read,
My Bible is the only book,
I'll want at my death bed.

~ Virginia Ellis ~



Lovely thoughts..........Cx :-)

There was an immediate divide in Sunday School. We boys would love the stories of David and Goliath and Salome and John the Baptist. Anything blood-curdling. And the girls would love stories like Ruth and Naomi. I wonder why girls seem to be innately sugar and spice and all things nice :-) ;-) And why they always look tidy and always smell nice:-S

I hardly ever attended a church after Sunday School days till I was about 34 or 35. And if that C of E list had been full list available, I would never have picked up a Bible for many more years.

What I decided to do back in about 1981 was go to a large bookshop in Northampton and read a simple passage (first 16 verses from John Chapter 3) out of about 12 Bibles. There was one version that was so simple and had pictures and was called "The Good News Bible" And there was another that presents the Bible like a newspaper with lots of mocked-up photos, which I rather liked.

I believe the Good News version of Bible is for a reading age of 8. My favourite now is KJV (or AV - Authorised Version) which is a reading age of 12, but has the most memorable language by far. Not quite as hard to follow as Shakespeare or Milton, but quite hard. Rumours are that Shakespeare was one of the 54 contributors who put KJV together at behest of old King James the First himself.

However, if I struggle with a passage in KJV, I often revert to other simpler versions (including Good News and NIV) to get a better understanding. And also now have a few Bible commentaries to help my rather limited understanding (favourite an old C of E cleric from Shropshire/Flintshire borders called Rev Matthew Henry)

Welsh Bible was translated from original Greek by Bishop William Morgan about 1588 (26 years before English language KJV). Before that, few churches had an English language Bible or a Welsh language Bible. They seem to have struggled with a Latin translation of the Greek, explained by a well-educated priest in language they were familiar with. You can see from baptisms, marriages and burials that Latin was the language of the church till relatively recent times. :-)

"I believe in Christianity as I believe that the sun has risen: not only because I see it, but because by it I see everything else". - C. S. Lewis (RIP - 50 years).

John, your post reminded me of the outcry there was in the church where I was then living when the Good News Bible was introduced there. My children would then have been about 11 and 13 and going to "Junior Covenanters" at the church. Some of the traditionalists seemed to regard it almost as some sort of heresy, particularly as this version of the Bible had originated in America! They soon got used to it though.

I must admit that, for personal reading, I too like the Good News version but can understand why, for public reading there needs to be a particular criteria for keeping as close to the original translations as possible.

I have often been in discussions where some folk have got in a muddle because they have mis-interpreted something they have read, and it has taken a more experienced person to help them out. I have been helped many times and am very grateful to those who have studied and explored the faith more than I have.


Morning Dermot and Vera :-D

I think the Good News Bible is brilliant. Problem with modern Bibles for me is that they tend to be based on 1881 Revised Translation of Tregelles, Dr Hort and Bishop of Durham, Bishop Westwood. It was a poor translation, based on questionable selection of early manuscripts, I believe.

The earlier English Bibles before 1881 were based on what is known as the Received Text, which used similar original manuscripts from 1st -3rd centuries to those used by Tyndale and Erasmus. So any translation pre 1881 is likely to be more sound that any post 1881.

The Good News never claims to be more than a paraphrase, and I personally use GNB rather than NIV, NKJV, RSV etc in a less formal church or chapel. And always KJV (AV) in a traditional place of worship, where almost all the congregation are familar with the famous old words which are the base of many of the older hymns.

Almost every line of every Charles Wesley hymn is from the AV Bible. Almost every line of John Wesley's 44 published sermons is full of AV quotes. Same with preaching of Baptist Charles Haddon Spurgeon in 19th century. And Congregational Dr Martyn Lloyd-Jones in 20th century. Many of latter's sermons weer recorded and are available now to download free and are very inspiring and true to Scripture.

For translation purposes I used to liken the old type bibles to interpreting Shakespeare .....The meanings became clear when someone explained the passages but it was also great fun seeing who could interpret them before the teacher and whether they were right or wrong. I still love the old fashioned Victorian bibles.

I am afraid I am one who didn't like the introduction of the good news bible It seemed to lose something which I can't quite explain :-(

Good morning everyone. A flying visit today as I am soon going out because it is our annual Christmas Fair at church. I am running a coffee stall as usual and I need to make sure that the boiler is on!!


A short prayer for today:


Prayer for the Start of Day

This is another day, O Lord. I know not what it will bring forth, but make me ready, Lord, for whatever it may be. If I am to stand up, help me to stand bravely. If I am to sit still, help me to sit quietly. If I am to lie low, help me to do it patiently. And if I am to do nothing, let me do it gallantly. Make these words more than words, and give me the Spirit of Jesus. Amen.



Take care all. Cx :-)

Amen.

Thank you again Cynthia.

Emma :-)

Cynthia, I hope your Christmas Fair will be well supported as this is usually one of the major fund raising events of the church calender, so hopefully folk with come prepared to spend generously. It is also a magical time to work together in fellowship with other members of your church family. Always very hard work but an exciting event when all the local folk can come together. Some people I never see from one year to the next owing to ill health or frailty make the effort to come along.

Our own church is joining in the Parish Christmas Event next Saturday. It is the first time we have not had our own Christmas Bazaar held in church, but the PCC made the decision this year to join other village organizations under one roof to be held in the Community Centre This is going to be very different from previous years and you can imagine we have had mixed feelings within our small elderly congregation. We are praying hard for a happy and successful outcome next week.

Cynthia. You have so much energy and commitment. I am quite in awe sometimes. And a lovely prayer.

I watched two programmes from the DAYSTAR channel very late last night (I tend to be up about 5am). I am finding them so uplifting. The first was my weekly "fix" of Judaism a la Rabbi Schneider. He is preaching through the Song of Solomon and relating it to the Christian church, where all can be the bride of God. Jesus finds you and me to be so beautiful, that he wants us to be his bride. Now I can understand that applied to Emma and Cynthia - but does he really want an old, bald, toothless man :-0 :-0 I will certainly need to wear a veil of modesty :-) ;-)

Another programme was a lovely American lady called Joni interviewing a Hindu man of about 50 in India about his conversion to Jesus aged about 20. It was most "real" and most humbling.

One thing is that neither he nor Rabbi Schneider have revoked their Hinduism or their Judaism one iota. One is a Hindu Christian, one is a Jewish Christian. But there is absolutely no doubt in my mind that Jesus has accepted them both as his brothers, the same way he has accepted you and I. All are equal in the eyes of God - we must all (as Christians) help to break down the blindness of the Greek and the stumbling block of the Jew.

The stumbling block of the Jew is that they believe Jesus must have been accursed to suffer death by crucifixion. Therefore Jesus is the "accursed thingt" mentioned in their law of Moses. Yet to my mind it cannot make sense that God in the first person (Father God) can curse God in the second person (God the Son). I have no Jewish credentials to make such a comment - but am pleased that Rabbi Schneider makes similar points every week.

And, as far as the Hindu is concerned, they work themselves to their heaven by "being good". This man felt he was innately a bad person and had decided to commit suicide by hanging (he had cut his father's newly dead body down a few years earlier and wanted to follow his example to the pyre). Then he decided to read some of the story of Jesus before he committed the fatal act. His life since has been hard, but his love of Hinduism and his love of Jesus have helped him to grow spiritually every step of the way.

Oh my word.......am I tired......... :-S

I haven't been in too long and am shortly going to fetch a takeaway. Am absolutely bushwhacked!


The crowds were massive and the atmosphere was great thank goodness. It was so odd not having our lovely vicar around to spur us one but I hope we did him proud.

We serve lunches as well and I heard that they sold out - big trays of hotpot just disappeared. Santa's grotto was amazing with lots of technology involved.

The chocolate fountain next to me was a great crowd puller and looked very appetising but I didn't get round to having anything.

I've just been told that we raised £3000. :-D

An amazing amount Cynthia. Just so pleased that your church has been so well supported and although you are shattered the money will be put to good use and your late vicar will surely have been near everyone today. Well Done! Enjoy your meal.

Thanks kandj, it was an amazing amount indeed....and the fact that everyone worked together so well was the icing on the cake. :-)

Some thoughts for today :

The Most Beautiful Flower

The park bench was deserted as I sat down to read
beneath the long, straggly branches
of an old willow tree.
Disillusioned by life with good reason to frown,
for the world was intent on dragging me down.
And if that weren't enough to ruin my day,
a young boy out of breath approached me,
all tired from play.

He stood right before me with his head tilted down,
and said with great excitement,
"Look what I found!"

In his hand was a flower, and what a pitiful sight ...
with its petals all worn ... not enough rain,
or too little light.
Wanting him to take his dead flower
and go off to play,
I faked a small smile and then shifted away.

But instead of retreating, he sat next to my side
and placed the flower to his nose;
He declared with overacted surprise,
"It sure smells pretty and it's beautiful, too!
That's why I picked it.
Here ... it's for you!"

The weed before me was dying or dead,
not vibrant of colors ... orange, yellow or red;
But I knew I must take it,
or he might never leave,
So I reached for the flower, and replied ...
"This is just what I need."

But instead of him placing the flower in my hand,
he held it in mid-air without reason or plan.
It was then that I noticed for the very first time,
that weed-toting boy could not see ...
He was blind.

I heard my voice quiver; tears shone in the sun,
as I thanked him for picking the very best one.
"You're welcome," he smiled,
and then ran off to play,
unaware of the impact he'd had on my day.

I sat there and wondered how he managed to see
a self-pitying woman beneath an old willow tree.
How did he know of my self-indulged plight?
Perhaps from his heart,
he'd been blessed with true sight.

Through the eyes of a blind child, at last I could see,
the problem was not with the world ...
the problem was me.
And for all of those times I myself had been blind,
I vowed to see the beauty in life,
and appreciate every second that's mine.

And then I held that wilted flower up to my nose
and breathed in the fragrance of a beautiful rose;
I smiled as I watched that young boy,
another weed in his hand,
about to change the life
of an unsuspecting old woman.

~ Cheryl Costello-Forshey ~


I hope you all have a blessed Sunday Cx :-)

Loved the poem Cynthia, reminds me that we all have so much to be grateful for.

I have spotted Channel 5 on Saturday evening 9pm a programme called The Bible. Could be interesting, I'm glad this Christian drama is on a channel that is easily available to all.

Last week before Advent. Next Sunday starts the countdown.

Also, I note next Saturday (30th) is St Andrews Day. Is that special in Scotland? I know all about Burns on 25 Jan - as it is OH's birthday. :-) :-)

As you have giv'n, so we would give
Ourselves for others' healing;
As you have liv'd, so we would live,
The Father's love revealing.

(Charles Venn Pilcher 1879-1961). Born in Oxford, England, Venn Pilcher was Bishop Coadjutor of Sydney, NSW later in his life. :-)

Good morning everyone. :-)



I have been thinking along similar lines John.......next week is the first Sunday of Advent - this means that - yesterday was the last Sunday before Advent - also known as 'Stir-up' Sunday :-)


Traditionally, this was the day when the family took turns to stir the Christmas pudding whilst making a wish.

The name comes from the opening words of the Collect for the day from the Book of Common Prayer of 1549.

"Stir up, we beseech thee, O Lord, the wills of they faithful people;
that they, plenteously bringing forth the fruit of good works,
may of thee be plenteously rewarded; through Jesus Christ our Lord. Amen.



I wonder how many of us actually make our own Christmas puddings? Not me I'm afraid but, I'm sure someone has a story about making them.


Have a good day everyone Cx :-)

I well remember Stir-up Sunday and the excitement of helping Mum to stir the Christmas Pudding. We were taught to stir clockwise and never anticlockwise as this would stir in the devil...!!! We were allowed to stir and make a wish at the same time, then pass on the wooden spoon to my brothers ans sisters. A very magical time as this was the lead up to Advent and Christmas not too far away.

In one of our children's books was a poem relating to Stir-up Sunday written by
Eleanor Farjeon which my brother used to read while us littlies giggled.

STIRRING THE PUDDING

Stem the currants
Stone the raisins
Chop the peel as fine as fine
Beat the eggs and shred the suet
Grate the crumbs (no flour in mine)
Freely shake to make it nice
All the virtue of the spice.
Pour the brandy liberally
Stir and wish, then three times three.

It was interesting to hear poems by Eleanor Farjeon read out on Sunday's Songs of Praise. No mention of Stir up Sunday though, which I thought was a bit odd?

Question to ponder

1 Samuel Chapter 17


50 So David prevailed over the Philistine with a sling and with a stone, and smote the Philistine, and slew him; but there was no sword in the hand of David.

51 Therefore David ran, and stood upon the Philistine, and took his sword, and drew it out of the sheath thereof, and slew him, and cut off his head therewith. And when the Philistines saw their champion was dead, they fled.

If David slew Goliath in verse 50 why did he in v 51 have to take Goliath's sword and slay him again ..... just asking