General Chat

[and it dunnit twice ...]

I do think Australia should ban the wearing of kilts - all those hairy legs and knobbly knees. Ugh!!

Sue xx

"If I talk with someone face to face, then that's what I expect to see, their face!"

Your choice, Whirley. If a woman wears a burqa, you don't have to talk to her.

If there's some legitimate reason for restricting her freedom to choose what to wear in public, do offer it (and respond to counter-arguments already offered, of course).

"this kind of dress wear isn't part of our 'natural' culture as such"

I guess Australia needs to ban the wearing of kilts by men in public ... not part of the "natural" culture, it ain't.

Perhaps you meant "national". Same answer.


I understand if you're just raising these as discussion points, and not offering them as grounds for a ban. Since they aren't. ;)

Barcelona, France, Belgium ...


Funny how most of the time we just hates those Europeans and we don't wanna do anything they do. But when it comes to scapegoating them Muslims, it's follow the leader time!

I must be honest, the whole outfit frightens me maybe because I'm not used to seeing women in these outfits. I respect other religions etc but this kind of dress wear isn't part of our "natural" culture as such. If I talk with someone face to face, then that's what I expect to see, their face!

I dunno, Jupiter Joy, do you think maybe you can answer your own question? -- "why a rule for one and a rule for the other"

I think you probably can. Maybe because the two things are not remotely similar?

"why is it offensive to suggest that anyone could wear a burka[which is true]thats not being offensive thats called common sense ,mores to the point some have .??"

Maybe you know what that means, but I sure don't.

From what I can tell, you are prentending that I said it is offensive "to suggest that anyone could wear a burka". Which, as I said, makes no sense.

Try reading what I said.

I said it is offensive to compare
- a burqa worn by a woman who is neither a criminal nor a terrorist
to
- headgear worn by a criminal terrorist.


Fairy, there actually are women in the world who do not measure their value by the size of their breasts, and who have no desire to wear string bikinis anywhere ever, no matter what kind of body they have. Hard to believe for some, maybe, but true.

But never mind the string bikinis. What I asked about was going topless, and specifically about being forced to do so. Good thing for you to be forced to do? Surely other people are *entitled* to see your breasts if you want to go out in public ...

Barcelona has become the first large Spanish city to announce a ban on the wearing of full Islamic face-veils in some public spaces.

The ban was designed to include any head-wear that hindered identification, officials said.

At least two towns in Catalonia, the region that includes Barcelona, have already announced bans.

Belgium and France have both recently taken steps towards restricting the use of full veils in public.

right im off .will look more later

France is apparantly considering a ban on the Burqua and the Niqab in any state property or transport system, they decided that a total ban will not be considered at the moment. Is this a sensible idea or will it lead to extremism on both sides. More importantly does it contravene the ECHR ?

i can remember years ago a big thing being made of it.it could have been around the time of the bombings in london where they targeted a hotel mps were staying in.theres comments about france and australia talking about banning it.ive not got the time to look yet.im busy will look later

Being an efficient terrorist in terms of planting bombs requires that you are 'invisible', that you blend in with the look of the people around you, not that you stand out because you are covered head to toe in black cloth.

IRA bombers didn't wear balaclavas while planting bombs in broad daylight did they ... they just looked 'like everyone else'. I don't actually remember balaclavas being banned? I can find no reference to that...other than that they were not to be worn at Republican funerals obviously..because that was a 'political statement' .

It's when 'they' (terrorists) look just like 'us'...that one has to worry. The nutter who you don't notice, far more dangerous! ( yes there is a sliver of irony in that sentence...just incase someone doesn't recognise it!)

well i think maggies hit the nail on the head there .the balaclava being banned..........which in a way makes sense .so my point is why a rule for one and a rule for the other.
why is it offensive to suggest that anyone could wear a burka[which is true]thats not being offensive thats called common sense ,mores to the point some have .??

It's been legal for women in Canada to go topless in public -- anywhere in public -- for, oh, 10 years now.

The only ones who ever have, other than the few equality activists who started it and took the matter to court, are a few street hookers. And a few beach volleyball tournament players. That tired soon, in both cases.

A lot of us wanted the ban on women going topless in public -- i.e. the law that made it possible to punish women for doing that -- struck down.

You'd think that since the law was discriminatory, and we wanted it struck down because of that, we'd have rushed to run around town with nothing on top. Particularly in the weather we're having.

I'm pretty sure if someone tried to ban us from wearing tops in public, we'd be taking *them* to court.

But hey, that's US, and we're the only ones who count.


The theological arguments among Muslims as to what constraints their religion places on what people wear are none of anyone else's business. Just as whatever argument may have gone on in the RC church as to what nuns should wear was none of anyone else's business.

So frankly, I don't care what some Muslim woman the Daily Mail dredges up has to say.

I do not feel entitled, or compelled, to tell anyone else what their religion requires or does not require. Not my business.

But to compare an item of clothing that someone does associate with their religion, as they interpret it and are free to interpret it, or even associates with their cultural tradition, to the headgear worn by someone else for criminal purposes ... wow, that's just offensive.

Let's get the view of a Moslem woman:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-1195052/Why-I-British-Muslim-woman-want-burkha-banned-streets.html

The total covering of a moslem woman is not a religious concept - the Qu'ran only states (as does the Bible) that women AND men must dress modestly - and the views of modesty have changed an awful lot over the past 2000 years (the Bible) or 1400 years (Islam)

As for taking the burqa off when they get home, there's a moslem comedienne who ONLY wears the burqa when she visits her parents - it's all a matter of choice - unless you live in a fundamentalist country.

Does anyone remember when the balaclava (mainly worn by men) was banned?
That was because of Irish Terrorists.
I don't remember hearing much fuss then, and, to be honest, Irish terrorists were in the minority!!!

janey with all respect....my main idea for adding this was for others to give there views.which is cool.
but you suspect an awfull lot concidering we have,nt met.as for the main conversation .....i feel they should be banned or allow everyone the same right.that includes motorcycle helmuts hoodies .or a bag over the head if prefered.
it should cut both ways.
as for women being degrading if they flop um about ...each to there own.like stinky said .if ya got it flaunt it.
but as for suspecting i am this and that ..you got it wrong.

Sorry Janey , but i think if woman had huge bust they should show em off , ;o)
( not completely lol ) but if u got it flaunt it x

Karen in their own country thats Kool no problem , but here Muslim men do wear shorts.. and on a whole the woman just dont look happy , i bet they wish they could wear a thong bikini and strut their stuff lol i just dont think its right in this country but hey ho who am i ? my dad fort
the war lost an arm for this to be a free country , so what will be will be xxxx
rosex

Jupiter Joy, it just doesn't matter a crumb what anybody's reason for wearing or not wearing anything is. Yours, mine, hers, theirs.

The question is whether there is a legitimate reason to make a rule requiring someone to wear something, or prohibiting someone from wearing something.

What you or I or the woman in the moon think about wearing or not wearing anything just matters not.

I suspect you actually like it that way. Because I suspect you do not want someone, anyone, telling you what you may and may not wear. No matter what very good reason they have for it.

(I think I have very good reason for telling women not to walk around in public with large portions of their breasts exposed, for instance. They invite degrading comments and actions from men, and they contribute to the degradation of women, just as much as any burqa-wearing woman does. But *I am not* proposing to prohibit women from doing that.)

You just don't think that other people deserve the same consideration.

Fairy,

They dress like that out of modesty and respect for themselves, tradition and custom. The custom is that no male outside the immediate family must see the female form or face, so they cover when out in public . They just don't show a lot of bare flesh, that's their way, they are FAR more modest than we are. Not even the men go around in shorts.

OK when it's boiling hot at 31c you wear as little as possible. But do you go to the office in a bikini? Why? Perhaps you'd feel you'd gone a bit too far with flashing the flesh? You might feel uncomfortable that you were attracting stares and unwanted attention. Well, that's how one of those women who wears a burqa would feel if she went out without it.

There are tribes in Africa where women wear nothing but a grass skirt. But if I went there I don't think I'd feel comfortable dressing the same way.

It's what our traditions and customs dictate isn't it?

K x :-)

thats what i meen Karen why would anyone want to wear 1 set of clothing then the burka when its 31 degrees ? when its 31 digrees here i wear light clothing and never a coat lol x

well janey you can wear the burka ,and i,ll stick to what i believe in.
on the link you sent .the woman in question hated the burka .she could,nt see properly.[driving a car comes to mind]it was also suggested that the men in the family prefer this or at least some do.
they put up with rude comments from other people,so in all i dont think its a good thing at all.
kind of a man thing really.or a religion thing.