Genealogy Chat

Hi

I am relatively new to all this - well, I have dabbled on my side and one of my husband's and been blessed with relatively straightforward lines. Anyway, I have a bit of an issue with my husband's mother's line. She knows little about her tree except I do have a marriage certificate for her grandfather's marriage in 1910.

So Edwin Treadwell married Annie Seal in July 1910 at Bordesley, Birmingham. Both were 23 living at 5 Beech Grove, Miles Street (I would like to know why both are listed as living at the same address at the time of marriage if anyone knows as I have found this to be quite common among my family too!) Edwin's father was listed as another Edwin Treadwell doing an occupation I - unfortunately - can't read.

So, Edwin Jnr was born c 1887 - looking at the census returns would you say that 'my' Edwin is:

1901:
Name: Edward Treadwell
Age: 16
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1885
Relation: Son
Father's Name: Edward
Mother's Name: Mary
Gender: Male
Where born: Birmingham, Warwickshire, England

Civil Parish: Aston
Ecclesiastical parish: Ward End St Margaret
County/Island: Warwickshire
Country: England

Registration district: Aston
Sub-registration district: Erdington
ED, institution, or vessel: 40
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 189
Household Members: Name Age
Edward Treadwell 38
Edward Treadwell 16
Harry Treadwell 14
Mary Treadwell 34
Nellie Treadwell 8
Ruth Treadwell 8 months


I know nothing else about the family and want to make sure that I follow the right line. I would be grateful if you guys could have a look and see if I have overlooked anything obvious.

Many thanks in advance

Jo

Hi Jo

Take another look at cert you have..does it come even close to butcher?

According to 1891 & 1901 census the Edward Treadwell you have found is a Butcher / Butcher Assistant...could also possibly be 'sausage maker' to describe this trade.

If you would like a 2nd opinion and can scan cert in let me know and will send you my home email address. Would be glad to look for you.

Sue

On the 1901 census both Edward and his father Edward are butcher's assistants. Could that be what it says on the marriage certificate?
Margaret

This is only Edward (Edwin) Treadwell registered 1885(+/-1) in Birmingham:

Edward Treadwell
Year of Registration: 1885
Quarter of Registration: Apr-May-Jun
District: Birmingham (1837-1924)
County: Warwickshire
Volume: 6d
Page: 62

You can try ordering cert...see if father / occupation matches marriage cert.

Sue

Hi

Hmmmm ... doesn't look like butcher (or anything like it!) If I could take you up on your kind offer please Sue. Please can you pm me your email address and I will send it to you.

Many thanks to both you and Margaret. All help is gratefully received (after all, I don't even know for sure that he was from Birmingham and am not sure where to go next!)

Ah ... that explains it. All my lot were labourers so that definately would have explained it!

Thanks for the answer.

Jo

The occupation looks like:

Brars-Caster ... although Annie's dad was listed as a Carter so the second part could be carter I guess.

Edwin Jnr's occupation was given as Barman. Not sure if that helps at all ...

Hmmm ... could be Brass Carter, I guess .... Would that be an occupation???

I didn't know that, Jolly Sailor!
That explains why some of mine gave the same address. I could never understand why.
Guess I'm still not too old to learn.
Thanks,
Margaret

Not having seen it I can't say for sure but that sounds remarkably like Brass caster.
That is an occupation.

You sure that one wasn't in the foundry industry?

Sue

Hi Sue

Yes, I think that is it! OK, that means my Edwin's & Edward's weren't the same as the ones I found in the census ... now where are they then ...?

Back to the grindstone ...

Thanks for making me read the certificate correctly!

Hi

I did see that one - but how can I know for sure (will I ever?) I was just wondering what the chances of the father's name on the marriage certificate being wrong. The copy I have is from the GRO. Is there anywhere else I could double check the father's name?

Thanks

Looking at the 1901 decoder I have I can see an Edwin aged 14 (coal carter) living in Aston, Warwickshire.

There is an older Edwin aged 57 in Warwick St Mary who is a general labourer.

Why were you looking for Edward when they are both Edwin?

There are a few others but in different counties.

Sue

Only because I think Edwin and Edward are / can be interchangable.

My SIL wrote down all the info she could glean about the family from various sources (non of them attributed and she can't remember which were which now!) but she had Edwin Snr as Edward Charles Treadwell. I can only imagine it was a birth certificate - but she hasn't got it anymore! The fact she had a middle name too made me think it was more than likely right. (They have no idea of any other family middle names!)

Sorry, not much to go on ...

Just been looking at 1891.

I think it could be that Henry too.

Odd. I wonder if Henry/Edwin are the same man.

The odd thing is that in 1861 there are brothers Edwin and Henry Treadwell in Warwickshire of the right sort of age.

I wonder if you've uncovered a little family scandal here.

Sue

1891

TREADWELL, Henry Head Married M 45 Casters Labourer Leamington
Warwickshire VIEW

TREADWELL, Margaret Wife Married F 44 Gateshead
County Durham VIEW

TREADWELL, John H Son Widower M 23 General Labourer Newcastle On Tyne
Northumberland VIEW

TREADWELL, Sarah E A Daughter Single F 21 Enameller Newcastle On Tyne
Northumberland VIEW

TREADWELL, William E Son Single M 19 Enameller Birmingham
Warwickshire VIEW

TREADWELL, Florence Daughter F 16 Tin Solderer Birmingham
Warwickshire VIEW

TREADWELL, Alice M Daughter F 10 Scholar Birmingham
Warwickshire VIEW

TREADWELL, Frederick Son M 7 Scholar Birmingham
Warwickshire VIEW

TREADWELL, Edwin A Son M 4 Scholar Birmingham
Warwickshire VIEW

________________________________________
RG number:
RG12 Piece:
2412 Folio:
117 Page:
43

Registration District:
Aston Sub District:
Deritend EnumerationDistrict:
67 Ecclesiastical Parish:
St Basils

Civil Parish:
Bordesley Municipal Borough:
Birmingham Address:
7, Westley Street, Bordesley, Birmingham County:
Warwickshire


1861
________________________________________
TREADWELL, Charles Head Married M 44 Tailor Warwickshire VIEW

TREADWELL, Caroline Wife Married F 40 Dressmaker Warwickshire VIEW

TREADWELL, Charles Son Unmarried M 19 Gas Fitter Warwickshire VIEW

TREADWELL, Edwin Son M 17 Labourer Warwickshire VIEW

TREADWELL, Henry Son M 11 Scholar Warwickshire VIEW

TREADWELL, Theophilus Son M 11 Scholar Warwickshire VIEW

________________________________________
RG number:
RG09 Piece:
2225 Folio:
149 Page:
10

Registration District:
Warwick Sub District:
4 Warwick EnumerationDistrict:
10 Ecclesiastical Parish:
St Pauls

Civil Parish:
St Mary Municipal Borough:
Warwick Address:
Theatre Street, St Mary, Warwick County:
Warwickshire



Sue
x

Births Sep 1886
Treadwell Edwin Albert Aston 6d 285

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Births Dec 1886
Treadwell Edward Thomas C Warwick 6d 587

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Births Jun 1887
Treadwell Edward Lambeth 1d 326

What I like about the 1861 family that Sue found is that the father is Charles which ties in with your S-I-L's info about Edwin Snr.




Ozi.

IGI Individual Record

EDWIN TREDWELL
Christening: 22 MAR 1844 Saint Mary, Warwick, Warwick, England
Parents:
Father: CHARLES TREDWELL
Mother: CAROLINE
Source Information:
Batch No.: C041531
Dates: 1782 - 1808, 1813 - 1876




IGI Individual Record

HENRY TREADWELL
Christening: 01 JUL 1849 Saint Nicholas, Warwick, Warwick, England
Parents:
Father: CHARLES TREADWELL
Mother: CAROLINE
Source Information:
Batch No.: C041541
Dates: 1813 - 1861

Just had an inspired thought.

What if Edwin jnr is the son of Edwin senior but Edwin snr dies and little Edwin is adopted by his uncle Henry.

That would make him both son to Edwin and Henry.

We need to find burials to see if an Edwin dies after marrying and having a son. Perhaps someone could find parish records to find a marriage and burial for an Edwin plus any children.

All just guess work but might make sense of the facts we've seen.

Sue