Genealogy Chat

See below.

Peter Walker has helped me identify my Grandfather as being in the Artists' Rifles OTC (thanks Peter!) during WW1. While he checks it out, I wondered if anyone else had knowledge of this Regiment or ancestors who served in it. Would love to hear from you! Natalie

Hi Natalie Here are thous addresses www.spartacus.schoolsnet.*co.*uk/ARTrifles.htm A short history and some names to follow up www.ww1photos.*com/london28th.html photos of men that served in the rifels. www.1914-1918.net genral info on ww1 and the rifels and lots more. Pete

Thanks (again!) Peter. I'll check them out. Natalie

Hi Natalie My Grandfather was in the Artists Rifles. I have a photograph of him, taken at the Officers Training School, dated 1916. He then became an Officer in the 4th Loyal Lancs. They were sent to France where my Grandfather was wounded in the trenches and captured by the Germans. Because my Grandfather spoke fluent German and also because he was an Officer, instead of being treated in the field hospital, he was treated in a German Military Hospital. This saved both his leg and his life! The family legend had it that 'he was captured on the fifth day of the War, spent the rest of the War in a German Concentration Camp and his mother, thinking he was dead, died of a broken heart'. The records tell a different story! His military records are available to me for a price! but I havent yet got round to getting them. I must do this soon as there are several little mysteries which may be solved - the biggest of which is why he returned to Germany after he was released! My Grandfather was an Opera Singer, which is how he came to be in the Artists Rifles - I have this vision of him singing the enemy to death! Cheers Marjorie

Its me again, silly, I forgot to say that there is information on the National Archives site, including Officers Records. Marjorie

Of course the modern Artists' Rifles are a bit more secretive! MB

Martin Eh??? Do tell! Marjorie

Hello My great uncle was in the Artists Rifles from 5 July 1915 Discharged on being appointed 2/Lt on Prob 18th Bn “Arts & Crafts” 18th Service Bn Kings Royal Rifle Corps 8 March 1916 I found his service record at Kew. His was one of the 30-40% that survived a WW2 bomb after being moved to a 'safe place'! Occupation or employment in civil life: Hotel Proprietor Christine

Now 21 SAS (Artist's Rifles), senior of the three SAS regiments. MB

Marjorie some time in or around the start of WW2 they became part of the SAS.

Thanks everyone! I was wondering how my Grandfather ended up in the regiment, as he was a Bank Clerk and (as far as I know) didn't have any artistic skills! I am going to Kew on Saturday. Does anyone know which documents need to check out for Artists' Rifles WW1? If so, can I do a look up for any of you? Happy to do photocopies and send them to you if I find anything! Meanwhile, it was lovely to hear your stories of the regiment. I'm hoping to find out where my Grandfather served etc, although it is a very common name, so I'm not getting too hopeful! Thanks again! Natalie

I have visited Bisley, where there is, (amongst others)an 'Artist Rifles' Club. Many pictures are adorning the walls, but I never associated the 'rifles' with singers, I assumed that artists were 'Picture drawers' recording the scenes, as in photography. Bob, Head hung in shame......

Natalie, There is a famous painting, now at the Imperial War Museum, called 'The Kensingtons at Laventie' (I believe the Kensington battalion of the London Regt was known as the Atrists Rifles). The painter, Eric Kennington, was in the Artists Rifles and painted the soldiers in this picture from sketches of his comrades. He had been commissioned as an official war artist, but the painting showing exhausted troops resting out of the line, was not considered 'heroic' enough at the time. It is now regarded as one of the classics from this period. You can probably google search an image online. Ian.

Bob - I know how you feel, as I had two photographs of my Grandfather and on the back it said they were taken by the Photographer to the Artists' Rifles. I just assumed, like you, that he was a photographer FROM the Artists' Rifles. Took Peter Walker to point out that he was attached to the regiment that my Grandfather was most likely serving in: the Artists' Rifles. I felt very foolish, but glad to have learned something new! Ian: thanks for telling me about that Painter. The painting you mentioned is amazing. I've just had a look at this one and others by the artist. Very interesting. Now I've just got to track down my Grandfather at Kew Archives and confirm he was in that Regiment. Best wishes Natalie

Hi, I don't want to hi-jack this thread, but, Peter, could you try to identify a WW1 photo for me please? Thanks Anne

Is that photo at the Officers Training School in 1916 a group photo or a solo one? Depending on when it was (pre 6 March 1916, I suppose), if it were a group photo it might have my great uncle (ECR Christmas) in it! Christine

The photograph I have of my Grandfather is a solo photo, full length, looking very daft with sort of bandages round his ankles! Took us years to spot, in tiny writing at the bottom 'Artists Rifles OTC December 1916'. He is the spitting image of my brother! I havent really researched the Artists Rifles and just assumed he was in it because A. he was an Opera Singer and B. because his father was a wealthy freemason!!!(lol). He certainly couldnt draw for toffee, however, very oddly, his wife (my Grandmother) was a professional trained Artist. Shame on me, I also thought it was maybe a 'soft option' at the time because he certainly didnt volunteer - his War Service coincided with Compulsory Conscription. We even thought at one time that it was a 'mock-up' photograph because someone told me that there was a brisk trade in photographs of men in uniform, (who hadnt actually volunteered) to be displayed on the sideboard in case of nosey neighbours! Sorry, Grandad! Marjorie

Me again! Thanks for the info about the SAS - anyone less like an SAS type than my Grandfather you cannot imagine! Incidentally, if anyone's Artist Rifles relly ever got a tin of biscuits sent to them at the front - well, that was my Herbert's father, Willy. He was the big Pooh-bah at the Co-operative Wholesale Society in Manchester and was also on the War Food Committee and he organised tins of Coop biscuits to be sent to the ARs. Bet they werent all that thrilled though, because I still have his recipe book, written in exquisite copperplate writing and amongst the usual biscuit ingredients is the following: '10% make-weight may be substituted for flour'. He doesnt give the recipe for 'make-weight'! (However, he does give, in the same book, the recipe for Worcestershire Sauce - I know what the 'secret ingredient' is, and I am open to offers) Marjorie.

Marjorie, dont you dare! we will have your tongue cut out.........LOL