Genealogy Chat

Having shamefully used your brains earlier, I thought I might push my luck with this piece of confusion from my mother's side of my tree. 1861 Census - London E1 James Goodchild (b1831) Steeple Morden, Cambs Margaret Goodchild (b1838) Liverpool Mary Ann Goodchild (b1860) St Lukes, London 1871 Census - London E1 John Lukes (b1837) Thorpe, Essex Margaret Lukes (b1837) Liverpool Mary Ann Evans (b1861) St Lukes, London (Step D) Joseph G Evans (b1863) Lambeth John Evans (b1865) Whitechapel 1881 Census - London E1 Lucas Lukes (b1845) Hertfordshire Margaret Lukes (b1836) Liverpool Mary Ann Goodchild (b1861) St Lukes, London Joseph Goodchild (b1863) Lambeth John Goodchild (b1865) Whitechapel ** My Great Grandfather (John's future wife, Ellen Marshall appears to be living next door with her family). 1891 Census - London James Lukes (b1838) Sussex Margaret Lukes (b1834) Liverpool Joseph Goodchild (b1864) St George in the East Jospeh Goodchild Evans (Birth) Dec 1862 Lambeth John Goodchild (Birth) Mar 1866 Whitechapel Mary Ann Goodchild (Birth) Sep 1860 St Lukes John Goodchild Evans (Marriage) Sept 1886 to Ellen Marshall I can trace the original James Goodchild from Steeple Morden back to 1625. Please tell me what you make of this, because it totally confuses me. I guess the logical thing is for Margaret to have Evans as her maiden name although I can find no marriage record for James Goodchild and Margaret or for that matter any of the 3 Lukes men and Margaret. I have sent for certs for the Goodchild/Evans siblings and for John's marraige to Ellen. Be interested in your thoughts on this. Cheers

may I please My Goodchild's are not !!! Having shamefully used your brains earlier, I thought I might push my luck with this piece of confusion from my mother's side of my tree. 1861 Census - London E1 James Goodchild (b1831) Steeple Morden, Cambs Margaret Goodchild (b1838) Liverpool Mary Ann Goodchild (b1860) St Lukes, London 1871 Census - London E1 John Lukes (b1837) Thorpe, Essex Margaret Lukes (b1837) Liverpool Mary Ann Evans (b1861) St Lukes, London (Step D) Joseph G Evans (b1863) Lambeth John Evans (b1865) Whitechapel 1881 Census - London E1 Lucas Lukes (b1845) Hertfordshire Margaret Lukes (b1836) Liverpool Mary Ann Goodchild (b1861) St Lukes, London Joseph Goodchild (b1863) Lambeth John Goodchild (b1865) Whitechapel ** My Great Grandfather (John's future wife, Ellen Marshall appears to be living next door with her family). 1891 Census - London James Lukes (b1838) Sussex Margaret Lukes (b1834) Liverpool Joseph Goodchild (b1864) St George in the East Jospeh Goodchild Evans (Birth) Dec 1862 Lambeth John Goodchild (Birth) Mar 1866 Whitechapel Mary Ann Goodchild (Birth) Sep 1860 St Lukes John Goodchild Evans (Marriage) Sept 1886 to Ellen Marshall I can trace the original James Goodchild from Steeple Morden back to 1625. Please tell me what you make of this, because it totally confuses me. I guess the logical thing is for Margaret to have Evans as her maiden name although I can find no marriage record for James Goodchild and Margaret or for that matter any of the 3 Lukes men and Margaret. I have sent for certs for the Goodchild/Evans siblings and for John's marraige to Ellen. Be interested in your thoughts on this. Cheers

may I please My Goodchild's are not !!! Having shamefully used your brains earlier, I thought I might push my luck with this piece of confusion from my mother's side of my tree. 1861 Census - London E1 James Goodchild (b1831) Steeple Morden, Cambs Margaret Goodchild (b1838) Liverpool Mary Ann Goodchild (b1860) St Lukes, London 1871 Census - London E1 John Lukes (b1837) Thorpe, Essex Margaret Lukes (b1837) Liverpool Mary Ann Evans (b1861) St Lukes, London (Step D) Joseph G Evans (b1863) Lambeth John Evans (b1865) Whitechapel 1881 Census - London E1 Lucas Lukes (b1845) Hertfordshire Margaret Lukes (b1836) Liverpool Mary Ann Goodchild (b1861) St Lukes, London Joseph Goodchild (b1863) Lambeth John Goodchild (b1865) Whitechapel ** My Great Grandfather (John's future wife, Ellen Marshall appears to be living next door with her family). 1891 Census - London James Lukes (b1838) Sussex Margaret Lukes (b1834) Liverpool Joseph Goodchild (b1864) St George in the East Jospeh Goodchild Evans (Birth) Dec 1862 Lambeth John Goodchild (Birth) Mar 1866 Whitechapel Mary Ann Goodchild (Birth) Sep 1860 St Lukes John Goodchild Evans (Marriage) Sept 1886 to Ellen Marshall I can trace the original James Goodchild from Steeple Morden back to 1625. Please tell me what you make of this, because it totally confuses me. I guess the logical thing is for Margaret to have Evans as her maiden name although I can find no marriage record for James Goodchild and Margaret or for that matter any of the 3 Lukes men and Margaret. I have sent for certs for the Goodchild/Evans siblings and for John's marraige to Ellen. Be interested in your thoughts on this. Cheers

Sorry, the point of that is ????

so its easier to read first reply always comes out jumbled i think had a hiccup thats why twice Jeanette

Jess just pressed her enter button twice by accident. GR squashes up the initial post making it hard to follow, so she was just spreading it out a bit! Don't worry, this is a regular thing - pity GR won't sort out their formatting!! Merry

Thanks Jess, Thanks Merry - I'm new to this board. Sorry if my post was long winded and drawn out !! I'll remember next time. Jeanne

I see the problem now! (a nightmare?!) But have to go out......... Back to see if it's solved later on! Merry

Am supposed to be working, so will make this brief. My guess would be that Margaret lived with James Goodchild. He died, or the relationship broke down. She moved south of the river and met up with a Mr Evans. When THAT relationship broke down, she moved back to where she had friends (or if she and James had married she might have been returned to her legal parish of settlement). It seems extremely unlikely that the three 'Lukes' were brothers. They sound more like uncles for her children. Unless they have the same distinctive occupation, I'd suspect that they were living under assumed names. Workhouse records may well answer a few queries. Good luck!

Thanks Pheonix. Are workhouse records accessible - forgive my ignorance please!! I have Ancestry & BOrigins - are they any good for a workhouse search ? Cheers, Jeanne

I think Margaret was nee Evans and lived with Mr Goodchild (hence the two ''surnames'' for the children at birth). Then she got herself mixed up with the Lukes. I doubt there were really three of them!! I was going to suggest you tried for the birth certs of the Lukes children which you haven't mentioned in your initial post (I don't think).....Kate and Patrick Lukes....but I can't see registrations for them. Mind you, I'm having so much trouble getting any sites to work for me this evening, I have given up trying to find them with the alternative surnames!! Merry

Thanks Merry - I am beginning to think that you are right and that my John is not the son of James Goodchild. I have sent for the borth certs, but I will be absolutely gutted if it proves to be true. Been to the cemeteries at Steeple Morden and Guilden Morden in Cambs, and visited Goodchild graves - my mum isn't around any longer to ask, although I doubt if Margaret's activities would have been banded about.......... I so carefully traced the Goodchild's back to the early 1600's and it all might be in vein....I could scream. Thanks, Jeanne

Well I'll place by bet that John IS the son of James Goodchild, as otherwise he wiuld have been named plain John Evans. Whether James G is named on the birth cert though, is another matter!! Maybe his baptism might provide more evidence? Merry

I would get that from the IG Index ? My friend sent me a link to that, but it is 3 years old now.

Just been onto Origins Network and there appears to be documentation for a marriage between Goodchild and Evans (I put in exact spelling only) on 21 Sept 1850 - I have sent for this but because I have only just joined this site - have I interpreted the entry right ? Very much appreciate someone having a look. Thanks.

Jeanne, The IGI record of the baptism may not tell you everything that is in the Parish registers. You would need to source the original entry at the County record Office. Dr Who, The marriage you have found something for looks to be this one: Marriages Sep 1850 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- EVANS Thomas Hendon 3 221 Goodchild Harriett Hendon 3 221 Merry

Hi Merry Just to make matters even worse - I have now found an entry on Family Search (IGI ?) that has a marriage between James Evans Goodchild and Margaret Irving on 19 Feb 1860 at St Giles Cripplegate. I can't find this entry anywhere else, can I get a copy cert of this without the Vol and page nos ? Jeanne

Merry - oh well, another £10 down the drain. You are probably right with that entry. Thomas and Harriet are wrong.

The Guilden Morden registers are not at the Record Office, they are still with the parish. I have supposed rellies there and was up there a couple of weeks ago. I didn't have time to get the registers out and go through them so will be going back ASAP.

The 1860 marriage is 1860 Q1 East London 1c 51 (I'm vaguely confused by that one - but it looks impressive, so i would buy it - it's easier when it's your money!!) (Took me this long to realise you changed your name!!) Merry