Genealogy Chat

Thank you Cerynne, what a great tip! I had no idea about this, I looked at paperspast for the relative I mentioned earlier and found loads as he was quite well known. I found a press cutting of him welcoming comedian Jimmy Edwards (remember him?) to NZ, I'd never have known about it without your tip.
I can't wait till this evening to look at the other 1800 articles about him!

I have found paperspast extremely useful. NZ equivalent of the British Newspaper Archive, but it's totally free to use. Family notices usually give more information than you'll get from BDM for free - exact dates, and often the names of other family members.
https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers
If you also have Australian family members, there is also Trove
https://trove.nla.gov.au/
which is similar, also free, but I find a little less user-friendly than paperspast

There used to be a great website called Lincs to the past which no longer exists.
Luckily on the marriage of one of them he states he is from elsewhere on the county.
Oddly I’ve been more stuck of some of the non Smiths.
Maybe I ought to go back to it.

No but I did research a Jones family from Wales for a work friend. So I do know how you feel about your OH family.
Might I ask how far did you get with the research. ???

At least you’ve not a Lincolnshire Smith, like my OH.

Hi Nameslessone, yes I agree some people see a name and automatically think they're related without checking.
I'm beginning to think this person has done just that as we did a lot of research on our family in New Zealand and with a long relative living in Christchurch who had a lot of information, and we just didn't find any connection to this Henry Hand.

As I said I'm still waiting on this lady to let me know how she thinks we are related, when/if she replies I will post on here.

The extract from Charles K. Rawding's, 'The Lincolnshire Wolds In The Nineteenth Century' that you posted is very interesting, and is around the time Charles Wm Hand emigrated to New Zealand.

Interesting to understand why and how they moved. Thank you.

Other peoples trees can be very unreliable, so many seem to grab a name rather than check it out.
Have you looked into what the LincsFHS has to offer?
You may be interested in this extract from :
https://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/LIN/migration


Extract from Charles K. Rawding's, 'The Lincolnshire Wolds In The Nineteenth Century' (ISBN 0 902668 20 X) from the series: Studies in the History of Lincolnshire:

The Labourer's Unions sought actively to influence the labour market in other ways than by simple wage demands. Labourers were encouraged to emigrate.

In April 1872 the 'Lincolnshire Labour Emigration League' was established. Large numbers emigrated during the second half of the 1870's. For instance, between 1874 and 1879 the Laceby agent, John H. WHITE, recruited more than 2,000 men from the Wolds and Marsh of north Lincolnshire for emigration to New Zealand.

In May 1874, WHITE began recruiting for a ship to make the trip in the autumn. By mid-August, 50 people had enlisted from Laceby, 20 or 30 from Keelby, 20 or 30 from Ulceby, 20 or 30 from Binbrook, and about 100 from around Caistor.

Hi to everyone and thank you for all the information you have researched and posted on here.
It all ties up with the information I had found, but with more info about this family.

Unfortunately it still doesn't make a connection to my family, in particular:
Charles William Hand, born 1840 in Nettleton, Lincolnshire, England,
Married, Rebecca Bratley in 1st April 1863 in Grasby, Lincolnshire, England,

Parents of Charles are,
John Hand, born 1811 in Alvingham, Lincolnshire, England.
Married, Elizabeth Procter in 1838 in Louth, Lincolnshire, England.

Both families emigrated to New Zealand, 27 Dec 1874.

We have researched this family right up to the present day in New Zealand.

There is even a Street named after the Hand family for some work or contribution, I'm not quite sure of, I have it written somewhere.

This third person who sent me a screen shot of her husbands family tree shows Charles William Hand as her husbands Great Great Grandfather.

I'm beginning to doubt that this is correct, unfortunately this lady hasn't got back to me as yet to show where she or her late husband think the connection is.

If any of you can help.

1901/13550 Hand Veronica Rosalie Barbara Henry - Order Product
1896/15354 Hand Thomas Barbara Henry - Order Product
1905/18331 Hand Ellen Ameldia Barbara Henry - Order Product
1911/5531 Hand Teresa Eugene Barbara Henry - Order Product
1907/7745 Hand Annie Barbara Henry - Order Product
1915/26307 Hand Joseph James Barbara Henry - Order Product
1904/4368 Hand Edward Barbara Henry - Order Product
1894/15777 Hand Henry Barbara Henry - Order Product
1897/11215 Hand Frances Barbara Henry - Order Product
1898/9632 Hand Gertrude Constance Barbara Henry - Order Product
1893/14903 Hand Barbara Barbara Henry - Order Product
1892/16382 Hand Agnes Barbara Henry



1883/6294 Hand Mary Margaret Henry - Order Product
1877/9543 Hand NR Margaret Henry - Order Product
1886/11874 Hand Margaret Christina Margaret Henry - Order Product
1879/3540 Hand James Henry Margaret Henry

1876/2048 Margaret Gee Henry Hand
married Dunedin 26 Aug 1876. Margaret died aged 35 on 27 Jan 1890.

1891/1086 Barbara Walnoske Henry Hand
married St Mary's Roman Catholic Church, Milton on 25 May 1891


Henry Hand lived in Queen St, Milton with Margaret.
He also lived in Queen Street when he celebrated his golden wedding to Barbara in May 1941. They had lived their all their married life and had 11 of a family, 24 grandchildren and 2 g grandchildren.

from https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers

You say,
"I believe Henry's first wife is a Mary Gee, married 1876 in New Zealand.
I have Margaret born 1855 NZ died 1890NZ which ties up with Henry's second marriage."

I assume you mean Margaret Gee, not Mary?


Henry Hand
in the New Zealand, Civil Registration Marriage Index, 1840- 1901
Name Henry Hand
Marriage Date 1876
Marriage Place New Zealand
Marriage Registration Number 2048
Spouse Margaret Gee

Unfortunately no image of the marriage record on Ancestry.


Margaret Hand
in the New Zealand, Death Index, 1848-1966
Name Margaret Hand
Death Date 1890 Jan-Feb-Mar
Registration Place Tokomairiro, West Coast, New Zealand <<<<
Folio Number 497

Frances Hand
in the New Zealand, Birth Index, 1840-1950
Name Frances Hand
Birth Date Sep 1897
Registration Place Tokomairiro, New Zealand
Birth Quarter Jul-Aug-Sep
Folio Number 3379


Thomas Hand
in the New Zealand, Birth Index, 1840-1950
Name Thomas Hand
Birth Date Mar 1896
Registration Place Tokomairiro, New Zealand
Birth Quarter Jan-Feb-Mar
Folio Number 1103

Their siblings Henry, Barbara and Agnes also born in Tokomairiro.

Gertrude Constance Hand
in the New Zealand, Birth Index, 1840-1950
Name Gertrude Constance Hand
Birth Date Sep 1898
Registration Place Tokomairiro, New Zealand
Birth Quarter Jul-Aug-Sep
Folio Number 3392


Milton was formerly known as Tokomairiro, per Google.

Henry Hand
in the New Zealand, City & Area Directories, 1866-1954
Name Henry Hand [fishmonger]
Year 1898-1899
Residence Milton, Otago, New Zealand

Location of the burial associated with the death you mention (On Ancestry)

Henry Hand
in the New Zealand, Cemetery Records, 1800-2007
Name Henry Hand
Death Age 88
Birth Date abt 1855
Death Date 15 Jul 1943
Cemetery Fairfax
Burial Place Otago
Plots 160-161.
Barbara Hand, died 15th July 1943 aged 72 years. And Henry Hand her husband, died 15th July 1943 aged 88 years.


Barbara Hand
Birth
unknown
Death
15 Jul 1943
Burial
Fairfax Cemetery
Milton, Clutha District, Otago, New Zealand
Plot
Block 10, Plot 160-163
Memorial ID
231751415 ·

Inscription

Pray for the souls of Barbara HAND died 15th July 1943 aged 72 years and Henry HAND her husband died same day aged 88 years. Ever remembered. R.I.P.




Henry Hand
in the Australia and New Zealand, Find a Grave® Index, 1800s-Current
Name Henry Hand
Death Date 15 Jul 1943
Cemetery Fairfax Cemetery
Burial or Cremation Place Milton, Clutha District, Otago, New Zealand



Henry Hand
in the New Zealand, Civil Registration Death Index, 1840-1972
Name Henry Hand
Age 88
Birth Date abt 1855
Death Date 1943
Death Place New Zealand
Registration Number 22928

As I said before, if you are in the UK then check your library service to see if has free access to Ancestry Library edition which is more or less the same as the World edition.

Trees on Ancestry show Henry as being born in London and his father in Cambridgeshire. Mothers maiden name is Sheen. Use freebmd to find the birth of Harry and the marriage, in London, of his parents.

Once you have found the birth on freebmd you can use the details to confirm the mothers maiden name via the GRO.

Thank you for your replies, let me enlarge on my query.

Firstly I am already subscribed to Findmypast Plus, the basic version.
Secondly I have with the help of a distant relative researched our New Zealand family connection.

Now just recently another person has sent me information that she thinks we have another branch in New Zealand that is connected to my family that emigrated to New Zealand 27th December 1874, but I cant find the connection between this second person and my known family that moved to New Zealand.

Hence the question is it worth upgrading to the Pro and Premium versions of FMP, or is there a better option.
And yes I have tried Familysearch alongside FMP.

Now ErikaH, ok so this is what I am trying to find out.
This second person has sent me a screenshot of her myHeritage page that shows a
Charles William Hand is her late husbands Great Great Grandfather.

Charles William Hand, born 1840 in Nettleton Lincolnshire is my 1st cousin 3 times removed.
(This is proven, I have his wife, children, parents and all descendants to my line)

This second person has also sent me a copy of a wedding certificate for a Henry Hand, and his marriage to his second wife a,
Barbara Walnoske of German origin marriage date 25 July 1891, in Milton New Zealand.
The wedding certificate also shows Henry's father to be a,
James Hand and Henry's mother as a Mary Hand, maiden name appears to be Sh**han.

So I'm trying to tie up Henry Hand and father James Hand to my Charles William Hand.
I know Charles William and Rebecca had a son named Henry, born 1878 in NZ Died 1880 in NZ. So this can't be him.

All the information I've given up to this point is proven and correct.

The information I have found out below is my assumption from FMP and Familysearch New Zealand BMD searches.

I believe Henry's first wife is a Mary Gee, married 1876 in New Zealand.
I have Margaret born 1855 NZ died 1890NZ which ties up with Henry's second marriage.

I have Henry born 1855, (don't know where) Died 1943, again dont know as this is where FMP asks me to upgrade my subscription.

Children I have found for Henry with mothers name of Margaret are,
(No Name), born 1877
James Henry born 1879
Mary born 1883, (big gap so may have missed a birth)
Margaret Christina born 1886.

Then the children for a Henry and mothers name of Barbara are as follows,
Agnes born 1892
Barbara born 1893
Henry born 1894
Thomas born 1896
Frances born 1897
Gertrude Constance born 1898.

As I say these are best guess assumptions.

To finish, I cant find where or when Henry was born of where his father, James was born or married.
If it is Lincolnshire England then there is a good chance that they are related to my line.

Sorry there is so much to this message but you did ask for names and dates.

Best regards to you all, and thank you for the replies already posted.

Just one last point the lady that sent me a screenshot of her myHeritage page and Henry and Barbara's wedding certificate, I am waiting for her to get back to me to let me know how she thinks this line is connected.
Not sure if its acceptable to post on here the screenshot and wedding certificate.

Alan

Yes, the website Alviegal has already told you about in her reply. I found it by googling for a relative of mine. Excellent site.

Duncan

The most expensive version of FMP, which I use, has BMD info….obviously, I don’t know how comprehensive their coverage is, or what the basic version offers.

Post a name and birth year/place about which you are certain, and I’ll check if it’s transcribed……suggest you pick one from 19th century

You refer to info you can currently access……as we don’t know what that is, we can’t say whether any site has any more.

Family search which is free is a good site for your earlier search. British libraries often have free access to the fuller versions of Ancestry or FMP, or if you are lucky then both. You would need a world edition. The FMP website should tell you what you can access under the different levels. The Ancestry library version is similar to their world sub.

It is worthwhile checking out the free library access out before you take out extra subs. As you can see from Alviegals post more modern records are difficult to obtain. Other countries often don’t have anything akin to our Freebnd.