Genealogy Chat

there is a death for a lucy c baker in sleaford

Lucy Carrie Baker
England and Wales Death Registration Index 1837-2007

Name:
Lucy Carrie Baker
Event Type:
Death
Registration Quarter:
Oct-Nov-Dec
Registration Year:
1891
Registration District:
Sleaford
County:
Lincolnshire
Event Place:
Sleaford, Lincolnshire, England
Age:
8
Birth Year (Estimated):
1883
Volume:
7A
Page:
261
Affiliate Line Number:
374

Julie ............

there might also have been one or more births after the youngest that you know about. It's worth considering, anyway.

Sylvia, thanks for this tip, not a situation that I had considered. With Clark(e) being a very common surname in Lincolnshire, I think I need to home in on the gap between the youngest and next oldest I have first. I should be able to eliminate some deaths by referring back to identify related birth regns where MMN's are not Wilson/Willson. That exercise will keep me busy for a while ! The process will obviously be less time consuming in other cases where the surnames are less common.

Julie ..............

It sometimes happened that a child died very shortly after birth ......... hours or days ........... but the birth was not registered while the death was registered.

The mother had 6 weeks after birth to register the child, and what seems to happen is that in all the confusion and upset, she or her representative forgot to register the birth, but did go and register the death.

Have you carefully checked the deaths for any possibly missing children. The GRO Index gives the ages of the dead person, which helps ......... although they have not solved the problem with children.

0 to 12 can mean hours, days, months or years ........ which has to be solved by buying the certificate. But I've found it easy to work out with my own family what the numbers do represent because I know the families so well .......... as you know yours.

Plus of course, there is often a burial to be found

Oh, bother!

The 2 possible marriages above don't pan out, I've found register scans for both on FMP and the ladies ages don't fit . Mary Ann was born 1865 and both ladies were 26 when they married in 1881 & 1883.

ArgyllGran, Thanks, it could be related - having checked the excellent Lincolnshire Marriages Index, the bride's father is stated as John. Will do a bit more digging on this.

Or this marriage, for that matter?

Marriages Dec 1881 (>99%)
Baker Charles Sleaford 7a 863
Wilson Mary Ann Sleaford 7a 863


Possible child:

BAKER, LUCY CAROLINE mms CLARK
GRO Reference: 1883 D Quarter in SLEAFORD Volume 07A Page 437

I can't see this couple later either, with or without the child.

Julie -

have you investigated this marriage?

Marriages Jun 1883 (>99%)
CLARK Mary Ann Sleaford 7a 707
Clearey James Sleaford 7a 707

I can't find this couple, so far, in later censuses.

A child of the marriage:

CLEARY, JOHN mms CLARKE
GRO Reference: 1884 S Quarter in SLEAFORD Volume 07A Page 467

Malyon -
Mary Ann was born Wilson, as shown in Greyghost's post.

She was shown as Clarke in 1871 and 1881, and was with her parents and siblings in both those censuses..

could this be mary ann

England and Wales Census, 1881
Name:
Mary Ann Clarke
Event Type:
Census
Event Date:
1881
Event Place:
Wainfleet St Mary, Lincolnshire, England
Registration District:
Spilsby
Gender:
Female
Age:
16
Marital Status:
Single
Occupation:
Gen Serv (Domestic)
Relationship to Head of Household:
Niece
Birth Year (Estimated):
1865
Birthplace:
Firsby, Lincolnshire, England
Page Number:
16
Registration Number:
RG11
Piece/Folio:
3254/102
Affiliate Record Type:
Household
Household Role Sex Age Birthplace
George Clarke Head Male 37 Thorpe, Lincolnshire, England
Sarah Ann Clarke Wife Female 35 Thorpe, Lincolnshire, England
George Clarke Son Male 5 Wainfleet, Lincolnshire, England
Sarah Jane Clarke Daughter Female 1 Wainfleet, Lincolnshire, England
James Epton Boarder Male 75 Wainfleet, Lincolnshire, England
Mary Ann Clarke Niece Female 16 Firsby, Lincolnshire, England
George Lancaster Boarder Male 19 Wainfleet, Lincolnshire, England
Images Available

perhaps mary ann was wilson and her name not changed

greyghost - no, in fact i know that 8 of the 10 were alive as of the 1911 census, i haven't beeb able to trace what happened to the oldest Mary Ann, but I have a possible death for Charles.

England and Wales Census, 1871
Name:
Wm Clarke
Event Type:
Census
Event Date:
1871
Event Place:
North Kyme, Lincolnshire, England, United Kingdom
Enumeration District:
2
Gender:
Male
Age:
4
Relationship to Head of Household:
Son
Birth Year (Estimated):
1867
Birthplace:
North Kyme, Lincolnshire
Affiliate Image Identifier:
GBC/1871/3347/0108
Household Role Sex Age Birthplace
John Thos Clarke Head Male 23 Billinghay, Lincolnshire
Ann Clarke Wife Female 25 Digby, Lincolnshire
Mary Clarke Daughter Female 6 Sleaford, Lincolnshire
Wm Clarke Son Male 4 North Kyme, Lincolnshire
Charles Clarke Son Male 2 North Kyme, Lincolnshire

lucy Clarke
England and Wales Census, 1901

Name:
Lucy Clarke
Event Type:
Census
Event Date:
31 Mar 1901
Event Place:
Leadenham, Lincolnshire, England, United Kingdom
County:
Lincolnshire
Civil Parish:
Leadenham
Ecclesiastical Parish:
Leadenham St Swithin
Sub-District:
Leadenham
Registration District:
Sleaford
Gender:
Female
Age:
11
Occupation:
SCHOLAR
Relationship to Head of Household:
Daughter
Birth Year (Estimated):
1890
Birthplace:
Byard'S Leap, Lincolnshire
Schedule Type:
122
Page Number:
15
Household Role Sex Age Birthplace
John Thomas Clarke Head Male 55 Billinghay, Lincolnshire
Ann Clarke Wife Female 54 Digby, Lincolnshire
Wilson Clarke Son Male 20 Rosholm, Lincolnshire
Lucy Clarke Daughter Female 11 Byard'S Leap, Lincolnshire

I know you have these, but laying them out to see where the possible gaps are. Certainly not seeing any registrations in the obvious gap / s.

The 10 shown here all appear on census, so it might follow that any further births and deaths were between census.

How many alive in 1911?

Have you found 5 deaths of the 10 named?

Or where they are in the census following their last "appearance" and by 1911


Name: Mother's Maiden Surname:

WILSON, MARY ANN -
GRO Reference: 1865 S Quarter in SLEAFORD Volume 07A Page 387

CLARKE, WILLIAM WILSON
GRO Reference: 1867 S Quarter in SLEAFORD Volume 07A Page 379

CLARKE, CHARLES WILSON
GRO Reference: 1869 M Quarter in SLEAFORD Volume 07A Page 430

CLARKE, JOSEPH WILSON
GRO Reference: 1871 D Quarter in SLEAFORD Volume 07A Page 407

CLARKE, EMMA WILSON
GRO Reference: 1874 J Quarter in SLEAFORD Volume 07A Page 453

CLARK, MARTHA WILSON
GRO Reference: 1877 M Quarter in SLEAFORD Volume 07A Page 482

CLARKE, ELIZABETH WILSON
GRO Reference: 1878 D Quarter in SLEAFORD Volume 07A Page 464

CLARKE, WILSON WILSON
GRO Reference: 1880 D Quarter in SLEAFORD Volume 07A Page 431

CLARKE, JOHN WILSON
GRO Reference: 1882 D Quarter in SLEAFORD Volume 07A Page 439

CLARKE, LUCY WILSON
GRO Reference: 1889 D Quarter in NEWARK Volume 07B Page 410

Chris, you are pointing to my presence on geneanet and the family concerned.
I'm familiar with freereg, but it doesn't help as the family were non-conformist, so no C of E baptisms, and the possible burials registers haven't been transcribed (or lodged with the Lincs Records office). In any case if we are dealing with live births followed by death soon after and they were treated as if stillbirths, there won't be any burial register entries. plus a proper burial would have required a death certificate to be produce I believe.

In addition to my post above:

"A new study of the University of Cambridge anatomy collection suggests that the bodies of foetuses and babies were a “prized source of knowledge” by British scientists of the 18th and 19th centuries, and were dissected more commonly than previously thought and quite differently to adult cadavers."

https://tinyurl.com/yxkahrvg



"The bodies of some children who died in infancy were sold to the anatomists by their desperately poor mothers"

https://tinyurl.com/h4hllq9

https://gw.geneanet.org/jools105?lang=en&pz=julie+dawn&nz=perkins&p=john+thomas&n=Clarke

Is that the family above? (from google) Below has some Lincs. Parishes.

https://www.freereg.org.uk/

Chris :)

I've just seen an article on line that suggests that treating a case as a stillbirth would have avoided the cost of obtaining both a birth and a death cert, and that as a result poor families might well have not registered these events correctly. The inference also is that stillborn babies were often placed in the coffin of an adult being buried, thus the costs of burial would be avoided or at least reduced. Perhaps these are the reasons for my difficulties in finding birth registrations in some cases? Does this fit with what anyone else has found/might be aware of?