Genealogy Chat

Empey ...........

have you checked passenger lists (outgoing and incoming) on ancestry?

of course, he probably left more recently than those records, as ocean travel fell out of favour!

Thank you all. The family thinks the son may be in America. Apparently, he married an American. But I don't think they married in this country. I have a birth reg which may be him, in 1949, the same year in which his sister was killed. I need to tread carefully around this.
I do not have a world wide account with FMP, which I use as well as GR.

Empey ....

ignore that message.

It is possible that whoever sent the message thought that this should have been posted on Find Ancestors .............. but it really makes no difference!!

I did not post this earlier, but Empey mentioned a son who might still be alive.

There is such a birth in Hampstead in 1949, with mmn Phillips.

This of course does not prove that Olwen/Alwyn and Basil were married, but that Alwyn registered the birth as Mrs W, and it was then (as usual) assumed that the named "husband" was the father.

Who sent you the message Empey? Seems appropriate to post it here.

I'm still of the feeling that they never married. If Basil married Manuela Vidal, they either divorced or Manuela died. It's unlikely Manuela died as she is listed on the electoral registers. After the war she is living alone- so it's likely that she and Basil separated.

It was not the 'done thing' to have a child out of wedlock, so it's unlikely that the fact was broadcast- far easier to let people assume a marriage had taken place.

As a birth can't be found for Marian under Ward (mother's maiden name Phillips) I also wonder if Basil was her father? As a marriage can't be found it is also possible that Olwen was also previously married.

In short, I don't see a marriage for them either.

Have you tried tracing the son, Graham?

I have had a message indicating that I should not have posted this here. How do I transfer it to the correct place? And what is the correct place?

Thank you, all. I still haven't got a marriage for Olwen (or Alwyn) Mary Phillips and Basil Ward, or a birth reg for their child Marian, c1946. As Mary was in the forces, I am wondering if they married abroad?
Mary

Thank you, all. There is much to think about.

I don't think the Basil born 1913 in Yorkshire is correct-

I think this is the likely death for that Basil:

Name Basil Ward
Event Type Death
Registration Quarter Jul-Aug-Sep
Registration Year 1963
Registration District Bradford
County Yorkshire
Event Place Bradford, Yorkshire, England
Age 50
Birth Year (Estimated) 1913
Volume 2B Page 62

Thank you, all. Please keep up this good work. All info received gratefully.

Yes, I do know about Marian. She was killed by a neighbour who was convicted and sent to prison. It was in many newspapers at the time.

who killed marian?

There are many articles in the papers covering the murder of Alwyn's daughter Marian in 1949.

This is her death, but I don't see her birth:

First name(s) MARIAN
Last name WARD
Gender Unknown
Birth year 1946
Age 3
Death quarter 4
Death year 1949
District HAMPSTEAD
County London
Volume 5C Page 864

SUPPLEMENT TO THE LONDON GAZETTE, 30TH DECEMBER 1978

Alwyn Mary, Mrs. WARD, Leader, Young Adventurers' Club, Hampstead, London.

Electoral Roll

Manuela Ward 1939 Camden Hampstead 68 White

Manuela Ward 1946 Camden Hampstead 65 Belsize Park Mews

Manuela Ward 1947 Camden Hampstead 65 Leila


In 1939, Manuela is with Basil at 68 White

In 1946, Manuela is living with about 12 other women

In 1947, Manuela appears to be living in a large house/hotel/??with about 14 other women

I wonder if Manuela used her middle name ada

found this death

Ada Ward
England and Wales Death Registration Index 1837-2007
Name
Ada Ward
Event Type
Death
Registration Quarter
Jan-Feb-Mar
Registration Year
1972
Registration District
Pontefract
County
Yorkshire
Event Place
Pontefract, Yorkshire, England
Birth Date (available after June quarter 1969)
15 Sep 1911
Volume
2C
Page
1693
Line Number
113

IF Olwen did change the spelling of her name to Alwyn, as Mary indicates above, then this is Alwyn M Ward on the London Electoral Rolls from at least 1949

Alwyn M Ward 1949 Camden Hampstead 2500 Evelyn M.-J

Alwyn M Ward 1950 Camden Hampstead 12 Vale House

Alwyn M Ward 1951 Camden Hampstead 12 Well Walk

Alwyn M Ward 1956 Camden Hampstead 12 Weatherall Lc

Alwyn M Ward 1957 Camden Hampstead 12 Well Walk

Alwyn M Ward 1959 Camden Hampstead 12 Barrett, Michael

Alwyn M Ward 1960 Camden Hampstead 40 Denton

Alwyn M Ward 1960 Camden Hampstead 12 Denton

Alwyn M Ward 1960 Camden Hampstead 40 Denton

Alwyn M Ward 1962 Hampstead Hampstead 40 Whitestone Lane

Alwyn M Ward 1963 Hampstead Hampstead 40 The Wells House

Alwyn M Ward 1964 Camden Hampstead 40 Well Road



A Basil Ward is with her

Maybe this is the reason no marriage can be found!!

Basil Ward married A/M/J 1936 to Manuela Vidal in Hampstead V1a P1736 they can be seen on electoral rolls in the same area as Basil and Alwyn M Ward were when they were together.

Manuela ada Ward 1947 Camden Hampstead Belsize Park, I can't find a death or remarriage for her.

this could be her Manuela a Vidal born J/A/S 1911 in Steyning mum nee Thompson.
Ada A Thompson married 1906 Felipe Vidal , Ada was born 1883 died 1947

Basil born May 1913 died 2/4/1977of 40,The Wells Hampstead probate £8357

Alwyn Mary Ward 28/9/1924 of 237,Fordwych Road Hampstead died Aug 1986
Probate not exceeding £40,000

Maryb.

Name: Wilfred Ward
Mother's Maiden Surname: Kenefick
Date of Registration: Oct-Nov-Dec 1919
Registration district: Bradford
Inferred County: Yorkshire West Riding
Volume Number: 9b
Page Number: 210


Name: James Ward
Mother's Maiden Surname: Kenefick
Date of Registration: Apr-May-Jun 1918
Registration district: Bradford
Inferred County: Yorkshire West Riding
Volume Number: 9b
Page Number: 16

Name: Thomas Ward
Mother's Maiden Surname: Kenefick
Date of Registration: Jan-Feb-Mar 1916
Registration district: Bradford
Inferred County: Yorkshire West Riding
Volume Number: 9b
Page Number: 194

Name: Hannah Ward
Mother's Maiden Name: Kenefick
Registration Year: 1911
Registration Quarter: Oct-Nov-Dec
Registration district: Bradford
Parishes for this Registration District: View Ecclesiastical Parishes associated with this Registration District
Inferred County: Yorkshire West Riding
Volume: 9b
Page: 222

Births Sep 1875   (>99%)

KENEFICK
 Frances
 
 Bradford, Y.
 9b
107

Name: Frances Ward
Age in 1911: 35
Estimated birth year: abt 1876
Relation to Head: Wife
Gender: Female
Birth Place: Bradford, Yorshire
Civil Parish: Bradford
Search Photos: Search for 'Bradford' in the UK City, Town and Village Photos collection
County/Island: Yorkshire-West Riding
Country: England
Street address: 45 Malvern St Leeds Rd Bradford
Marital Status: Married
Registration district: Bradford
Registration District Number: 498
Sub-registration district: Bradford Central
ED, institution, or vessel: 28
Piece: 26747
Household Members:
Name Age
Joseph Ward 45
Frances Ward 35 says Irish parents
John Ward 2
Joseph Ward 1

married 2 years 2 children born