Genealogy Chat

Hi. Im not sure if they had kids. It dont show they did but then im not there either.
I can check usuing her name again.
Its not my uncle. Its my dad....
Trying to see if my dad is her real dad and not this
Other man who we have been told about
As he is nowhere
Nowhere at all.
Will keep searching but find myself coming to a blank wall each time....
Have a lovely new years eve night tonight
Xxxxc :-)

If they divorced, your dad's first wife might have married again, or she might have reverted to her maiden name ...... lots of divorced women did that.

yes ive looked at all possible names..
the search continues. xxxx

As your paternal side of the family & his first wife were of Indian origin, might they have moved back to the ancestral country? That could be why there are no records.

Was your Dad's first marriage in the UK? If so, the witnesses on the certificate might give you leads to follow up. Additional information might be found on the historical Electoral Roll for his declared address.
Although your aunts and uncles, if any can be found, may not wish to discuss what happened, their children (your cousins) might be more forthcoming.

hello, my dad was indian born in india, came here in 1956 and stayed
, his 1st wife was irish born in ireland.
they married in london.
the witness on the certificate? where do i find that. ?
yes my aunt i have contact with but will not know, or if he does would not say.
my cousins r the same age as me so no good.
ive been on the net all night, paying out for different things just to come up with the same thing. she is prob the onle one who can help me.my sister said today that she will phone dwp.
but doubt they will tell her anything.
xxxxx

Serena just backtracking, in case you want to make sure you exist :-)

you can do a free search at Ancestry that will show you results, just not details

http://search.ancestry.co.uk/search/db.aspx?dbid=8782

put your name there with your mum's birth surname and you'll find yourself

you just haven't been transcribed by the volunteers at freebmd yet


to get a birth, marriage or death certificate, you order it here:

http://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/certificates/

using the info from the record at freebmd (the 'GRO reference' info)

name (of one spouse)
year of marriage
quarter of marriage (jan-mar, apr-jun, jul-sep, or oct-dec)
registration district
volume number
page number

the certificate will tell you the actual details like the exact date, the place, the spouses' ages, their fathers' names and occupations (if they gave that info), and the witnesses' names


Serena, don't go paying money for things willy-nilly

many things are availble free of charge (like at freebmd or at familysearch.org)

and for other things, people here who pay for subscriptions will help if we can (by sending you private messages if it is too personal to put on line here)

for instance, I'll send you your birth registration info from Ancestry just to illustrate :-)

about your dad's first wife

I too don't find her marrying or dying under either her birth surname or your dad's surname

and I don't see any children born with those two surnames

do you know for sure that the name she married under was her birth surname? could she have been married before? in that case, any children's births would show her own birth surname, not her first married surname

might she have gone back to Ireland?

another possibility is that she partnered with someone else after separating from your dad but did not marry, and uses her partner's surname (and possibly her death, if she has died, was under that surname)

it might be a good idea to get your dad's first marriage certificate to see what it tells you about her (her age, her marital status ...)

don't be paying for 192.com when you can use
http://www.freeelectoralroll.co.uk
free of charge

when you find a listing there, you can double-check it at 192.com on a free search to see whether it is for a current year, and check who else is in the household

(if you use up your free searches in a 24-hour period at 192.com, just go to the cookies in your browser and delete the 192.com cookies, and start over!)


also just a note, do stick to this thread for questions about your family or you will have too many people answering the same questions :-)

http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards/board/general_chat/thread/1357044

Serena, I just took the DNA question to a forum about that and received an answer from one of the most knowledgeable people in the field

I asked about a test of what is called 'autosomal DNA', the DNA that a person gets from both parents.

he says the results would be straighforward and definitive

this is how it works

this test would show whether you and your sister are half sisters or full sisters, by showing whether you share enough DNA that you share the same parents.

full sisters would have, very roughly, about 50% the same; half sisters would have, again very roughly, about 25% the same ... so it would be immediately apparent which you and your sister are

this would not tell you anything about who her father is, if it turned out you were half sisters

but it is always possible (if not highly likely) that a match for her DNA (that did not match you) might turn up in the database where you tested, whether now or at some later date ... if she matched but you didn't, then the match would seem to be on her father's side

I use and recommend Family Tree DNA, and in fact I have just ordered an autosomal test for myself to pursue some genealogical questions I hope DNA will help solve (as it already has, although it has raised more questions)

this is the link for ordering that test if you and your sister want to consider it (remember that not everyone wants the answer to these questions)

https://www.familytreedna.com/family-finder-compare.aspx

that doesn't give a lot of info but it works basically as I described

the cost is 99 USD per test and you would each test

it involves ordering a kit and taking a scraping from the inside of your cheek that you return to the lab

the company then notifies you of matches, but you also get raw data that you can have someone help interpret for you

I can try to explain anything else about it that isn't clear

Your father is possibly listed on the 1962/ 1963 electoral register living with his first wife (although her middle initial is T and not F as on the marriage index).

Have inboxed u hun. I am really greatfull for yr help....





Her middle name begins with a t????
Could the f be a mistake?

Cant bwlieve the kind help im reciving xxxx :-)

the F could be a mistake

the GRO index (image at Ancestry) does say F, but it could have been incorrectly transcribed from the certificate to the index


I did request access to your keepsafe as you suggested so if I can make anything out of the name I will post it!

so u think the t is correct? i saw it i did.....
hmmmm ...

i dont understand about the keepsake. sorry im so new to this xxx

sorry, I got myself confused in my inbox :-) that was a different message! ignore the 'keepsafe'

and I checked the GRO index image and amended my post above

I'm not sure about the T and F business, but one or the other, the electoral roll or the GRO index, could be an error, certainly

ahhh lol ok. hehe
why would 1st wife not be found anywhere on the electoral roll after 1963.
not on death record or anywhere. do u think i should give up. the dwp
is the only people left but they will not help. . also the 1st wife would be the only one who would know everything xxxx

the dna testing is very interesting xxxx

the DNA testing would absolutely answer the question of whether you two have the same dad, for a one-time price to get a yes or no answer

if so, question settled! if not, you never know what might turn up ...


as for first wife, first question is what your dad's marital status was when he married your mum, on his marriage certificate

widowed or divorced?

(and of course ... did he tell the truth ...)

possibly they separated, she returned to Ireland, she died there, possibly under her birth name

or remarried there if they were divorced

the fact that they do not seem to have children could mean the marriage was short-lived

think the dna testing is the best way to go with this.

and yes at least we would know.
im really not sure what it said on dads mc
yr prob right she prob went back to ireland.
have mentioned to my sister about the dna testing just waiting to see what she says
xxx

just for info, your dad is with first wife on 61, 62 and 63 electoral rolls, all at the same address
(in 1963 the search doesn't find him for some reason; I had to find the image and check the address)

and is listed with someone else, at a different address, on 64 and 65 electoral rolls (not your mother ... ?)

your parents married 10 years later ?

it seems as though he and first wife separated and he immediately began living with someone else, who used his surname but was not married to him ?

the same could be true of first wife, still living in England after 1963 but with a different partner and under another surname



okay, here's a fun bit

I searched for the 61/62 address on later electoral rolls

in 1964, your father and first wife are at the same address as in 1961, 62, 63
and they are still there in 1965 also (the last available year)

... but they are listed by their middle names !!

he is Clement, she is Finhoola

just their little joke ??

but he (or someone with his unusual name) was listed with the other woman in 1964 at a different address

your father by his middle name is listed in 1958 and 1959 at the same address as in 1961 etc, but alone

I can't find him or the address in 1960


the dwelling next door (#14) to the 1959-65 address (#12) is occupied by a Lord and Lady

I wonder whether the address where your dad and first wife lived, where there were always several other unrelated people, was servants' quarters

if you look on google streetview, 14 Ladbroke Road Kensington is rather grand, 12 is plain and square (and seems to be one room deep ...)

in 1957, the Lord and Lady are at 14, but no one at all is at 12, so possibly the only servants present were not eligible to vote

(I can't find the Lord and Lady in 1960 either, so I suspect there is something missing at Ancestry)



edit 7 Jan to add for the record and for anyone reading in future who might be connected

http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards/board/living_relatives/thread/1357136

for info this seems most likely to have been first wife's birth

https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:F1WQ-621

so dob late 1935


I understand you do know when your dad died ... his name is misspelled in the deaths index at Ancestry, no access to the GRO image there to check

Ohhhh my so much info. Wow.
I dont know about him living with another woman. Have no idea...
Used their middle names? In india people did use their middle nane instead of their first so I can defo relate to this.
Ohhhh I dont know about the servant quarters but dad did come from a well of place in india.


So he was staying at 2 adress at the same time??? R u sure its him......
What does it all mean.......
This is fab info. I have also msg u.....xxxx :-)