Genealogy Chat

I've had several replies saying it is best to update this thread by editing the opening post to bring everyone up to date, so this is the story so far. Should I delete the outdated replies?

We are trying to find more of what happend to our ancester Francis William Martin after he emigrated to Austraila. He was born in Walthamstow in 1907. His father was Charles John Martin and his mother was Frances. In the 1911 census they lived at 112 Longellow Road Walthamstow.

He set sail for Brisbane in April 1923 from London aboard the ship Esperance Bay and is shown was a farm worker on the ships passenger list which gives his address was 71 Gosport Road, Walthamstow, the family address at the time which confirms it is him. Joonie has given us some clues which we are trying follow up. If anyone can find more of what happend to Francis when he settled in Oz we would be very grateful.

Francis was only 16 at the time but we dont know who he travelled with. We understand his older brother Charles also emigrated there but does not appear on that same passenger list. There is a Charles Martin (born 1905, right age) who sailed on the Bendigo from London to Sydney in the February the same year. Can anyone find more about him?

Many thanks, stephen marden

????????

Name: George Martin
Event Type: Census
Event Date: 1911
County: Essex
Parish: Walthamstow
Sub-District: Walthamstow
Registration District: West Ham
Gender: Male
Age: 0
Birthplace: Walthamstow, Essex
Record Type: Household

?????????

Name: George Frank Martin
Event Type: Census
Event Date: 1911
County: Essex
Parish: Walthamstow
Sub-District: Walthamstow
Registration District: West Ham
Gender: Male
Age: 11
Birthplace: Walthamstow, Essex
Record Type: Household

??????????

Name: George William Martin
Event Type: Census
Event Date: 1911
County: Essex
Parish: Walthamstow
Sub-District: Walthamstow
Registration District: West Ham
Gender: Male
Age: 3
Birthplace: Walthamstow, Essex
Record Type: Household

?????????

Name: William Martin
Event Type: Census
Event Date: 1911
County: Essex
Parish: Walthamstow
Sub-District: Walthamstow
Registration District: West Ham
Gender: Male
Age: 5
Birthplace: Walthamstow, Essex
Record Type: Household

EDIT - think now that this is wrong.

Was Frances's maiden name Jackson?

If so could this be the younger brother of Charles:-

First name(s) WILLIAM D
Last name MARTIN
Birth year 1914
Birth quarter 2
Registration month -
Mother's last name JACKSON
District WEST HAM
County Essex
Country England
Volume 4A
Page 485

Kath. x

Looks like I may have been wrong with the post above.

Is the Francis Martin from the 1911 census actually the William you are mentioning. There is this birth (perhaps he used his middle name):-

First name(s) FRANCIS WILLIAM
Last name MARTIN
Birth year 1907
Birth quarter 1
Registration month -
Mother's last name -
District WEST HAM
County Essex
Country England
Volume 4A
Page 386

Kath. x

There is this entry in the passenger lists:-

First name(s) FRANCIS W
Last name MARTIN
Gender Male
Age 16
Birth year 1907
Occupation FARM WKR
Departure year 1923
Departure day 10
Departure month 4
Departure port LONDON
Destination port BRISBANE
Destination BRISBANE
State Queensland
Country AUSTRALIA
Destination country AUSTRALIA
Ship name ESPERANCE BAY
Ship official number 140148
Ship master's first name R
Ship master's last name MACKENZIE
Shipping line COMMONWEALTH GOVERNMENT
City LONDON
Ship destination port AUSTRALIA
Ship destination country AUSTRALIA
Ship registered tonnage 13850
Number of passengers 724
Record set Passenger Lists leaving UK 1890-1960
Category Travel & migration
Record collection Passenger lists
Collections from Australasia, Great Britain, Ireland, United States

Last address in England is 42 New Compton Street, Walthamstow.

Kath. x

well done Kath :-D

I've messaged poster informing there is info on here for him

Thanks for all your efforts but to recap:

This has nothing to do with Francis William Martin who was an uncle. Charles Martin was the eldest son (born 1905) of Charles John Martin and Frances Rosetta Day.

He also had a younger brother William who we understand was born after the 1911 census but have no details of him so far.

From what we can gather both Charles jnr and William emigrated to Australia but it is knot known if they went together or separately.

Regards, Stephen

There is a tree on Ancestry that has William Martin as born in Walthamstow in 1912, son of Charles and Frances. There is a photo of William and it says he died in Australia. But there are no sources given and I haven't been able to find a 1912 birth with mother's maiden name Day.

There are a couple of 1911 births that are possible but you would need to get the birth cents to check if either of them are right.

1911 on other 'Thread' relating below.

http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards/board/ancestors/thread/1330354

Chris :)

The tree on Ancestry is the one kept by my brother.

He knows William went to Australia but is not sure when. His date of birth was thought to be 1912 as it was after the 1911 census - so could have been later that same year.
Weve just discovered that Frances Rosetta Day was previously married to a James Moore in 1900 and didn't actually marry Charles until 1942 but we have the birth cert of one of their children which gives Frances's name as Day.

We've searched various outward passenger lists but cant find anything relating to either William or Charles.
I think pinning the 1911 possible birth is all we can try at the moment, thanks to all.

Stephen

I still think that the Francis W. Martin in the birth I posted above for 1907 could very well be the son of Charles and Frances (therefore the younger brother of the Charles born 1905 and possibly using his middle name William).

His age and birthplace also match up with the Francis W. Martin on the pasenger list going to Brisbane, Australia in 1923.

You say in your reply that Francis William was an uncle. Whose uncle?

Kath. x

just to shed a little light here :-)

Stephen knows where and who his family are in 1911, no need for guessing

this is just so we can see the data in the form we're used to


1911

Name: Charles Martin
Age in 1911: 6
Estimated birth year: abt 1905
Relation to Head: Son
Gender: Male
* Birth Place: Hoxton, London, England

Civil Parish: Walthamstow
County/Island: Essex
Country: England
Street address: 112 Longfellow Rd, Walthamstow
Registration district: West Ham

Charles Martin 32 born Hoxton
Frances Martin 29
George Martin 28 * brother born Walthamstow
Charles Martin 6
Francis Martin 4 born Leyton
Lily Martin 2 born Leyton
Frances Martin 6/12 born Walthamstow

* so Stephen you're saying that it should be
Charles born Walthamstow
George born Hoxton (like his brother Charles Sr)


Do you have any idea what age they were when they would have gone to Australia?

the names are just so very common to be searching for ...



oh ...... I had skipped over Chris Ho's post about the previous thread, 4 pages long in 2013

I'm afraid I'm not going to read it all to see what info has already been discussed and how it might relate to this one ...........

I tend to agree with Kathleen

Births Mar 1907 (West Ham covers Leyton)
MARTIN Francis William W. Ham 4a 386

that child was born before the census date and so would have been 4 in the 1911 census, as Francis in the 1911 household was

since his mother was Frances and he had a younger sister Frances, it would not be surprising if he were called William

on the other hand it might be odd for the couple to have a child William when they already used that name for this child's middle name


and I agree that the FWM on the passenger list is rather too perfect a match by name, age and address in England


just to surmise a little ... the best match in Australian electoral rolls, assuming that he stayed in Queensland, is, using 1936 for example

Francis William Martin, labourer
Walker St West,
Townsville, Herbert

also at that address

Irene Martin, home duties


a search at Queensland BMD

https://www.qld.gov.au/law/births-deaths-marriages-and-divorces/family-history-research/

finds a 1927 marriage of Francis William Martin and Irene Miskin

and that would be the right timing for your William to have married

Irene Miskin was born in Queensland in 1906, daughter of John Francis and Odavia Hannah Lashbrooke

searching for information about those names could lead to something that would confirm or deny this being your William

in fact there are numerous family trees at Ancestry that show Odavia Hannah Lashbrook (not Lashbrooke) with daughter Irene, but no info about Irene (or private info)

contacting some of those people might be useful

thanks very much it was francis william martin,who we think was known as bill who sailed to brisbane on the esperance bay,his address at 71 gosport rd walthamstow is also correct it was his parents house once again many thanks stephen marden

I am Stephen's brother Dave. I have a family tree on Ancestry and we share all the info we get. Just to add my thanks to all for the great job you did on tracking down "Bill" Martin who emigrated to Austraila. As Stephen says, everything fits to him being Francis William Martin with the confirmatrion of his home address at Gosport Road Walthamstow. All we had to go on was a photo of "William Martin" from Australia and we now know that he and Francis were the same person.

We are told that his older brother Charles also went to Australia and I have found a Charles Martin aged 18 (fits as he was born 1905) also sailing to Australia in February 1923 aboard the vessel Bendigo from London to Sydney.. Could be his brother but his address is St Johns Wood and will have to check that out.

Again, thanks for your help, much appreciated, Dave

Joonie.

Thanks for the info on Francis William Martin and wife Irene in Austraiia. That all seems very promising and I'll do my best to contact some of those trees.

Stephen