Genealogy Chat

Jan

I think you could be right - she was probably illegitimate, and Patrick Cameron was made up. I've noticed that there are a number of Friggieri and Gauci appearing in Cardiff - there are also some Friggieri in Stepney/Hackney - who appear in trees on here.

Looked for deaths too - for Samuel and Emily Gauci - not found anything yet

Also wondering if Hugh Cameron was in Stepney looking for Emily to get the divorce sorted out - so he would be able to say he knew where she lived.

Following the bigamy trail might turn something up too.

Janet

...

It looks like she used the name Patricia.

From the 1945 & 6 Electoral Rolls Samuel, Emily & Joseph Gauci are at 3 Ludens Place Stepney. In 1949-1958 Samuel and Patricia are at 10 Bicknell House, Berner Street..

In 1961 & 2 Emily P and Samuel are at 11 Drewett House, Christian Street.

Nice find Kense!
Just going back to those Gauci/Cameron births, I think the son is on 192.com. Now, what anybody would do with this info is tricky to say! Have also looked for Samuel and Emily/Patricia. but there are a few so very hard to pin down. Certainly can't find deaths or re-marriages for either of them.
Jan

Just to fill a couple of gaps:
1947 & 1948 Emily & Samuel are at 46 Swedenborg Street. (Anthony Gauci is also there in 1947).

The Ancestry OCR transcriptions are not always accurate and even if they are in the index, you have to look at the images to make sure that the address is correct.

You were all up far too late for me last night!

I think possibly we need to check the Scottish Births for Emily or Patricia?
I also can't find either of them in the Death Index so maybe they were still alive in 2006 or went to Scotland at some point after 1965.

It always amazes me how someone suddenly changes their christian name so late in life.

I couldn't see anything on the Newspapers online, but I am also looking for a man under the same circumstances about 10 years earlier than this one, we solved that because he registered one of his children in his original name, but they are very hard to prove, you just have to try all angles and hope for a lucky break.

Whatever happens Emily P needs to be ruled in or out somehow.

Kind regards
Amanda

Thank you Jan/Amanda/Jannie Anne - this is all amazing, ive answered some of the questions below:

My grandfather - Hugh Cameron remained in London the rest of his life - he remarried in 1948 and had 2 sons - at the time of this marriage he stayed in a hostel in Willesden and then is Stepney with his new wife. Hugh was 24 years old when he married Emily and to my knowledge she was English.

Emily Woods left her husband and son and it was my grandfather who brought his son (my dad) to Glasgow to be raised by his mother.
I do believe it is too coincidental that Samuel was the co respondent on the divorce certificate and my uncle can tell me that my grandfather spoke about the police calling about the bigamy, they divorced in 1947 and Emily P married Samuel in 1943.

The plot thickens!!

Hi all,

Just wanted to add, my aim is to find any living relatives on my paternal grandmothers side (Emily Woods), however, my dad has never shown any interest, he is now 72 and recently indicated he may be interested in what became of her, however, i think now that i am digging he's not so sure!

I think they key is knowing if Emily Woods and Emily P Cameron are the same person, is it transpires that they are then there are 6 children registered that i know,also, if she changed her christian name to Patricia there may be more. When my grandfather told my Dad he knew where his mother was the story was she had 8 more children.

I appreciate all the help from members of the site.

Thanks

Marion

Evening everyone,

Yes, interesting finds KenSE for Samuel/Emily. As to Emily using Patricia as a name maybe it was her name, but she didn't use it on her first marriage to Hugh Cameron. Is it possible that she was born as Patricia Emily? I did try a search but did not turn up anything that looked as if it fitted. Maybe she just liked the name (perhaps someone famous had the name and she took a fancy to it). I also tried a search for deaths - nothing. So either they are still alive (I don't think so!) or maybe if Samuel was from Malta could they have returned there?

If there is a potential offspring that could be a valuable source of information - but obviously care would be needed, depends where you want to go with it I suppose - any chance there is a relative with a tree on here or another site?

Or there is another route - but it would cost - getting a birth cert for one of the Emily/Samuel offspring, which may turn up nothing and be a waste of money - unless there is a baptism record somewhere?

Marion, I asked the questions on an earlier post to try to see if perhaps there was another connection in Willesden, seems nothing to pursue there though, thanks for filling in the gaps (in my mind). Also if your Dad isn't sure he wants to know, you could just make your enquiries as the grand-daughter of Hugh Cameron.

Still following with interest.....

Hi All,

The 6 children that i found to Emily P and Samuel Gauci are as follows:

Jacqueline M - 1945
Josephine M - 1949
Jennifer M - 1950
Gary P - 1953
Barbara A - 1954
Jeanee M - 1955

The only further information i found that could be linked to any of these people is a marriage in 1982 in Stepney between Gary P Gauci and Kingkao Tonyun?
If anyone can find trace of any of the above that may help. Although, i'm not sure that her new family will have any knowledge of her 1st child so it may be a bit tricky, the fact she changed names etc perhaps she didn't want to be found?

Jacqueline M Gauci married Brian Kennedy Q2 1963 at Stepney

Josephine M Gauci married John P Farrow Q2 1966 at Chatham.

Jeanee M Gauci married Vernan G Gannon Q1 1975 Stepney (Vol 15 Page 0208)

Jennifer M Gauci married James Adams Q4 1984 Ashford (Vol 16 71)

I don't knoow if they are all the same Gary P:

Name: Gary P Gauci
Spouse Surname: Tonyun (Kingkao)
Date of Registration: Jul-Aug-Sep 1982
Registration district: Stepney
Inferred County: Middlesex
Volume Number: 15
Page Number: 0226


Name: Gary P Gauci
Spouse Surname: Taylor (Tracy)
Date of Registration: Sep 1987
Registration district: Ogwr
Inferred County: Mid Glamorgan
Volume Number: 27
Page Number: 267



Name: Gary P Gauci
Spouse Surname: Vassoulieva (Inga)
Date of Registration: Mar 1995
Registration district: Redbridge
Inferred County: Essex
Volume Number: 247
Page Number: 628


I couldn't find a relevant Barbara and I haven't searched for remariages for the JM's.

Thanks Ken

I will see if i can find any offspring from the above marriages:)

There seem to be four Kennedys, 1 Farrow, 1 Gannon but no Adams.

That should be Gannon not Cannon in my post above which I will now correct.

I found Brian Kennedy (born 1938)in a tree owned by Jane which is one of the daughters of Brian and Jacqueline Gauci, i have requested access to her tree, will keep everyone posted, thanks

Marion, sorry to interfere, but I don't think requesting access to her tree is the way to go to be honest. She will want to know why for starters! And you can't ask for access without giving access to your tree first. If I were this person I think this request might seem very strange to me.
I would be inclined to send her a message and explain that you have reason to believe Emily Cameron might be related, and that this depends on her having been married previously.
Just a suggestion!
Jan

Hi Jan, I did include a cover email saying i was trying to identify if Emily Cameron was related to me, but i get your point, if she looks at my tree and doesn't know anything about this it may raise a lot of questions.

I will remember that future.

Hi Marion,

Having been involved in one of these situations,( it wasn't something I chose to do, it was discovered along the way) but telling possible rellies that their parent comitted a crime,and they are therefore illigitimate, is not a path to tread lightly.
If it was 100 years ago, no one would be hurt by the information coming to light.

We don't know yet if it is the right Emily, she might not have even been a Woods, personally I would follow the paper trail of your Grandad's records in WW2.

I mean this with the best of intentions.

Kind regards
Amanda

Hi Amanda,

Thanks for the advice. I hadn't considered the fact that her subsequent children would be illegitimate if she married before she divorced, i'm fairly inexperienced at all of this!

What would i hope to find in the WW2 records of my grandfather that would help me to identify if Emily Woods is the same person as Emily P Cameron?

Thanks

Marion