Genealogy Chat

There is also a Martha Motherwell married to a Archibald Foster (Glasgow)
2 Children James b 1857 and Ebenezer b 1859..dont know who she belongs to...

Chris.Dontknow where we are going with this but just for ref..
Mary Payne married William Laird 1848 Glasgow...
among other children they had "Robert Payne Laird" b 1866 Milton Glasgow.
Cant find any other Rbt.and Martha children born after Marie (Mary)...1841 Census would help but I cant access it...

Here you go...

MARIA PAYNE Pedigree
Female


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Event(s):
Birth:
Christening: 02 APR 1826 High Church, Paisley, Renfrew, Scotland

Death:
Burial:


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Parents:
Father: ROBERT PAYNE Family
Mother: MARTHA MOTHERWELL

So if they came over from Ireland it was earlier than thisor they commuted...(

Have your tea Christine - you need energy to help me solve that one

I will be having words with the Ma...she will insist on going back 2/300 years...

Do you know how many Motherwell families there were in Greenock let alone any where else.
Equally the Motherwell surname as I have said before can also be found in a number of Counties in Ireland....
Thats my supper out the window..!!
We could try for Euphemia...she was in Co Donegal as well as Greenock..!!

Hello all

something new. Susan Motherwell had two daughters called Martha - one my G Grandmother. He older sister died before she was born (obviously ). So the obsession my Ma has is - find the name Martha in the past and you find the key to the mystery. So .............................

My latest snippet is a reply to a GR match from Alex N who posted sometime ago and i have just unearthed it .....

HE REPLIES TO ME ASKING IF THERE IS A LINK TO JAMES

It's possible. All I know of Martha Motherwell is gleaned from a Scottish death record for William Payne, who was her son and was born in 1811 somewhere in Ireland (no specific placename given) .

The death record gives the names of his father and mother (Robert Payne and Martha Motherwell) and states his father's profession as 'Farmer'. William and his wife Margaret settled in Glasgow, and on the Census record from 1851 onwards, and William was a spirit merchant.

Given the dates and lack of preceding records, it would appear that they and their family came over from Ireland sometime in the 1840s, maybe as a consequence of the famine and/or the economic situation in Ireland.

If you think there is a connection and could shed any further light on their origins in Ireland, that would be wonderful.


So - any thoughts

Hi Erin (is it Erin?)

I have Catherine Watson's two MCs and Samuel Watson was on the MC and not deceased. I have his MC.

catherine watson daughter (to her first husband) - Susan Motherwell McFadyen married James Dawson in 1898. I have traced her grandaughter through GR - but she has no intel - she lives on Isle of White. I have yet to get the DC for her but i know she died of breast cancer. She was the same age as the Martha Watyson (but Martha was her Aunt). Her half sister was Edith May. It is likley that Catherine Watson lived with Edith in birkehead.

The Martha who married Robert is my G Grandmother. She is the probably the youngest of Susan Motherwells children. She was the second Martha Watson that Susan Motherwell had - the first died in 1879 (b1872) - as was the fashion/havbit at the time - subsequent children were named after dead children - bizarre!!!!

What's your thinking on this oh wise one

Morning Christopher....A couple queries...Re:

Catherine Watson who married Alex McFadyen..

Was Samuel (father ) deceased on her MC...?
What happened to Susan Motherwell McFadyen b July 1881?

Martha Watson..daughter of Susan Motherwell and Samuel Watson married a Robert Templeton Campbell Wylie Nov 1905 Greenock.

What date do you have for Samuel Watson snrs.death.

William ROBINSON married Sarah Motherwell in Taughboyne 1853 and 1860 Census shows a son John b abt 1852 NY...it is "possible" I suppose that he may have been born at a later date for his birth but they were then back in the Co Donegal for all their other children.

It was highlighted that the marriage record showed Robison but all childrens Baptisms show Robinson.

The censuses don't give maiden names, and yes I have ancestry worldwide

Maura - have you got Ancestry worldwide access?

Thanks Maura - i suppose there is no detail on what Sarah's maiden name was from the census?

Thanks Maura - i suppose there is no detail on what Sarah's maiden name was from the census?

1860 United States Federal Census
about William Robison Name: William Robison
Age in 1860: 35
Birth Year: abt 1825
Birthplace: Ireland
Home in 1860: Bethlehem, Albany, New York
Gender: Male
Post Office: Bethlehem Center
Value of real estate: View image
Household Members: Name Age
William Robison 35
Sarah Robison 25 Ireland
John Robison est. birth year 1852 N.Y.

Final thing - to be 100 per cent - to get a look up are sure it is ok to edit the heading as suggested and save - and this will create a new post with all the information still there?

Erin

to add - my Mum met a Church of Ireland person by chance - and she will check Church databases that may not be on the web

Hi Erin

I have found the will on PRONI and emailed them for some help (detail on the will entry which is scant) - it is the will of William Alexander Motherwell (but again his link to Susan Motherwell is highly circumstantial)

Re Catherine Watson - i have MCs for her wedding to Alexander McFadyen (or MacFadyen) - his DC - and her MC to a guy called May in 1886. As outlined she moved on from Greenock (presumably following Mr May) and as far as i can gather ended up in Birkenhead. I am presuming she died in England - but haven't tried finding her DC. She was born in 1861 (that comes from her wedding certificate

In terms of strategy my main lines of inquiry now are:

1. Find relatives of Catherine Watson - i have Edith May's (her daughter) BC - evidence of marriage of Edith to Edward Alexander Mair. This family is reputed to have done work on this and own the family bible. the key is someone called Deborah Williamson b1961 - who is on GR but hasn't responded to my GR message ;
2. Find any relatives of John Motherwell or Caldwell Motherwell to see if they have done any work on the tree.
3. Find any more relatives on GR who have links to the Children of Susan Motherwell and Samuel Watson

I am also preparing a word document which is collating and embedding all links/documents and lines of inquiry (to be more structured.


This may sound stupid - but I am presuming that there may be people in the states who may have links who are not on GR (I am only on GR)

Try and track down

Yes...I would imagine so...I am not familiar with US data ...may be there was also a Census around that time...
Cant remember if the James you note was listed for on Passenger Record...seem to remember seeing it somewhere....
If he died of Ship Fever seems to me he was either just arriving or died en route.

I have discovered from LDS

James Motherel
Pennsylvania, Philadelphia City Death Certificates, 1803-1915

death: 21 Jul 1847 —Philadelphia, Philadelphia, Pennsylvania

record title: Pennsylvania, Philadelphia City Death Certificates, 1803-1915
name: James Motherel
death date: 21 Jul 1847
death place: Philadelphia, Philadelphia, Pennsylvania
gender: Male
death age: 50 years
estimated birth year: 1797
digital folder number: 4009819

THEN - on the Donegal site they have a transcribing from the announcements which says:

September 18 1847
July 21st, at Philadelphia, United States, America, of ship fever, MR JAMES MOTHERWELL, late of Greenhill, near Carrigans, county Donegal, aged 55 years

Location is near to the general Motherwell activity. Any ideas on how i might get more detail - is this asking for a lookup from somebody who has ancestry worldwide?

Yes Christopher...we know that but it doesnt help identify where James and said Susan parents of Susan et al. were....

Have you had a look at the Wills...you can see them on PRONI...

I still have not identified a Catherine daughter of Susan and Samuel...cannot locate anything about her... Do you have actual Primary Source info.relating to her or is it just from "Family Members"....

If you have then let me have details