Genealogy Chat

if you are not sure of marriage index. You can find mothers maiden name against grandmothers birth index, so could be worth checking that.

Hello All

Thank you so much for all your efforts but I'm afraid it seems I have been following the wrong lead. I spoke to my Nan yesterday about this Charles V Hill and the household and she is insistant that it's not him. And given the information above it's clear that she's right. She says that he had 2 sisters called Ada and Gwen and that she's always been under the impression that his father was also Charles. My problem is that this is the only Charles Hill in Sheffield born in 1897/98 on the 1901 census. My Nan is sure that the family were from Sheffield so he probably wasn't born anywhere else.
I do have his death certificate and that is definately him as it gives his address - which is where his wife, my Great Gran, continued to live - South Road, Walkley. My Great Gran's name was Florrie Barras and I have her date of birth and parents so I hope that using this I can trace the marriage certificate? This may lead me to Charles. Also on his death certificate is his regiment and army number - Kings Own Yorkshire Light Infantry No 35892, and his date of death 23/06/18. He was aged 20 at this point. Does anyone know if I may be able to find out any birth information from any online army records I wonder?
Sorry this has been a wild goose chase but if it helps I've learned a lot from it! This is highly frustrating and very compelling at the same time.
Sarah

not having any luck with marriage yet. can you post info their children names/year of birth. Also Florrie's info.


from cwcg site is this what you have? which is his record of death in battle not a death cert.
HILL
Initials: C
Nationality: United Kingdom
Rank: Private
Regiment/Service: King's Own Yorkshire Light Infantry
Unit Text: 2nd/5th Bn.
Date of Death: 23/06/1918
Service No: 35892
Additional information: Husband of Mrs. F. Hill, of 339, South Rd., Walkley, Sheffield.
Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead
Grave/Memorial Reference: XXI. D. 9.
Cemetery: BIENVILLERS MILITARY CEMETERY


entry on Ancestry site with add. army number
Name: Charles Hill
Death Date: 23 Jun 1918
Death Location: France & Flanders
Enlistment Location: Sheffield
Rank: Private
Regiment: King's Own (Yorkshire Light Infantry)
Battalion: 5th Battalion
Number: 35892
Type of Casualty: Killed in action
Theatre of War: Western European Theatre
Comments: Formerly 48423, W. York Regt

Hi Jan

My Nan was their first born - 18 August 1916 - Audrey.

Florrie was expecting another child when Charles was killed - Connie was born on 2 October 1918.

I believe they were married only 4-6 months before Audrey was born and were still teenagers.

Florrie Barras was born in Sheffield 08/01/1898 to John Parker Barras and wife Elizabeth.

Thanks very much
Sarah

Oh yes forgot to say that the cwcg entry above exactly matches what is on the death certificate.

we needed another s on Barrass Here is marriage index so suggest you get the cert and then post details back on here. Interesting also has him as Charlie!!

Name: Florrie Barrass
Spouse Charlie Hill
Date of Registration: Apr-May-Jun 1916
Registration district: Sheffield
Registration county (inferred): Yorkshire - West Riding
Volume Number: 9c
Page Number: 1111

Could this be him?? not born in yorkshire but last child is!!

Name Relation Condition/
Yrs married Sex Age Birth
Year Occupation Where Born Original
census
image

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

HILL, Charles Head Married M 35 1876 Tool Fitter Warwickshire Smithwick Nr Birm VIEW
HILL, Sarah Wife Married
15 years F 36 1875 Warwickshire Smithwick Nr Birm VIEW
HILL, Charles Son M 13 1898 School Warwickshire Smithwick Nr Birm VIEW
HILL, Ada Daughter F 12 1899 School Warwickshire Smithwick Nr Birm VIEW
HILL, Frank Son M 8 1903 School Warwickshire Smithwick Nr Birm VIEW
HILL, Winnie Daughter F 7 1904 School Warwickshire Smithwick Nr Birm VIEW
HILL, Wilfred Son M 5 1906 School Warwickshire Smithwick Nr Birm VIEW
HILL, William Son M 2 1909 Sheffield York VIEW

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

RG number:
RG14 Piece:
27861 Reference:
RG14PN27861 RG78PN1594 RD510 SD1 ED13 SN50

Registration District:
Sheffield Sub District:
South Sheffield Enumeration District:
13 Parish:
Sheffield

Address:
198 Arundel ST County:
Yorkshire (West riding)



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

census search results 1911 address search redefine current search
© findmypast.co.uk

Hi Margaret

Hey that looks really likely! Nan mentioned a William and Wilfred but by the time she was old enough to know, Charles' mother was dead and Charles snr had installed a "housekeeper" and Nan assumed that they were her sons. So maybe they weren't. That's quite exciting. Got to go offline now but I'll look into that definately. Thanks very much.

Sarah

the sibling. could she have been a year older than you have been told.
this is the only index i can see in the same district,it would mean mother maiden name had been wrongly entered on index.Ihave not found a Hill/Carrass marriage to dismiss it yet
Name: Constance Hill
Mother's Maiden Surname: Carrass
Date of Registration: Oct Nov Dec 1917
Registration district: Ecclesall B
Registration county: Yorkshire
Volume Number: 9c
Page Number: 591



did you see marriage index i posted on page 2?

Hello Jan

Yes I've seen the marriage index thanks so much. I'm sure I have enough to get a marriage certificate now so I'm going to order one asap. Connie could have been born in 1917, I know there's not much between them and I could have got that wrong. I'll share all this info with my nan when I next see her and will come back to let you know the eventual verdict. I hope it doesn't take long I'm beside myself with curiosity now.

Sarah

do you know who Connie married / when she died as death index may give her date of birth.

Connie's still alive, though in no fit state to help me with my enquiries unfortunately. My Mum will set me right on the year she was born when I see her next. She married Alf Gatus, I don't know when. I sent off for the marriage certificate of Charles Hill and Florrie Barras, though it looks like 3-4 weeks wait.

Just for information...... Possible?

Marriage.... Constance Hill & Alfred Gatus
Sep. Q 1936 Sheffield

Alf Gatus Birth sep 1908....Died 1983

3-4 weeks? I sent for two a couple of weeks ago, they were here within 5 days. Where have you ordered them from?

Hello Margaret - yes that'll be Connie definately - Gatus isn't a common name, they were the only one in the Sheffield phonebook until their sons moved out - and I remember Alf dying when I was at primary school so 1983 will be right.

Madmeg- I ordered my certificate through the GRO website and the estimated despatch date given was 15 September. There was a more expensive option that would have had a quicker turnaround but I've just paid for my subscription on here so watching the pennies...

Thanks
Sarah

It must be the rotten British weather turning everyone to their computers.

Hi Sarah...... I find 90+ % of local offices will supply within the week....much quicker & they don't charge if they are unable to find correct one... given a phone no. they will phone to clarify details if needed..... having said that, there are a small percentage who do not do any certs. at all before c 1900... then you have to use GRO. A quick phone call is all that is needed to clarify, thus saving a few days. Hope you are lucky and recieve earlier.
(Google " register ofices, England & Wales " for addresses & phone nos.)
Margaret

Thank you Margaret worth noting. I've really learned from this thread and have been going great with other branches of the family. However I've just hit another dead end and will probably need to get another marriage certificate to move on with this so I'll look into what the Sheffield registry office do. Another case of too common names - what is it with my family and common names, why couldn't we be more imaginative!

just like my"Smith" but my husband says popular not common and i choose it he was born with it!!!!

Ha yes it's a Smith that I'm stuck with - the number of Annie Smiths is unbelievable - and coupled with a John Miller it makes it extra difficult. Still I'll look at it that way - I'm full of popular genes and not common in any way!

Just to go back to the original subject, in another branch of the family I'm looking for a maiden name again - only this time for someone born in 1787 and so her birth and marriage records will be outside the dates on websites I think. I've looked for her death but have choice of several to go at (Comm... I mean popular name again...). So am I right in thinking that I need to contact the registry office covering the area of her birth and marriage (Brill and Bicester respectively) to see if they are able to look up records this far back?

Thanks again.
Sarah