Genealogy Chat

Could I ask a huge favour and check a marriage for me. I thought I had found it, and applied for the certificate. The GRO have emailed me back to say there is no trace of it in the indexes. Strangely, I can see it, so don't know whether it is mine or their error.

Here is the marriage that I am looking for:

Horace Rogers and Ethel L Johnson 1919 April/May/June quarter.

Thank you

Joanne x

Marriages Jun 1919
Brittle Harry S Miller Pontypool 11a 483
Dicker Mary E Steer Haverfordwest 11a 483
Herbert Margaret A Evans Pontypool 11a 483
Johnson Ethel L Rogers Haverfordwest 11a 483 <<<<<<<
Miller Hannah Brittle Pontypool 11a 483
Rogers Horace J Johnson Haverfordwest 11a 483 <<<<<<<
Steer Thomas Dicker Haverfordwest 11a 483

Are you giving them too much information? If there is the tiniest thing not the same, GRO will say they haven't got it.

Thank you for looking for me.

This is a portion of the email received from GRO:

Marriage certificate : Horace Rogers and Johnson 1919 J 11a 483 Haverfordwest

We have not produced a certificate as there is no trace of the above mentioned person at the reference you quoted.

Perhaps you should leave out Haverfordwest as there seems some Pontypool. Just put the Vol & page number.

Although the images for both Horace & Ethel are Haverfordwest 11a 483

Yes, good idea. I was thinking of reapplying for cert with Johnson as the principle name as opposed to Rogers.

I should email them back and appeal to them. After all, they have kept £3 for the look up.

I think that's a good idea. Email them, say the image is Haverforwest 11a 483 so what should you do about it.

It's worth a try.

I think you have to list the district as part of the reference otherwise you pay more.

I'd appeal and if that doesn't work contact :

The Register Office, Tower Hill, Haverfordwest, SA61 1SS.
Tel: 01437 775176. Fax: 01437 779357.
E-mail: [email protected]

Rose

Thank you again. At least I know that it's not me reading it wrong.

Joanne xx

Thank you Rose. I will appeal first as the certificate was ordered from the GRO website. If I have no joy, then I will certainly contact the Welsh office. Thank you for supplying the address and phone numbers

Joanne xx

I think the problem is because the volume and page numbers are not unique for that district. The other Haverfordwest page numbers are 4 digits.

Rose

I would not pay a penny more. The reference is correct as far as I can see. In fact perfect. Horace J Rogers married Ethel L Johnson Jun quarter 1919, Haverfordwest, ref 11a/483. I have checked both entries independently on Find My Past.

Email them and complain if you feel you entered the right infomation.

I did this recently with a certificate for a marriage where I had spelt the woman's name with one "m" when it should be two "m"s. Emerson or Emmerson. I suggested a simple degree of logic should have been applied and I hoped the new certificate would arrive by express mail. Two copies appeared the following day at no extra cost.

Hi Madmeg

I most definately will appeal against this. Like you, I checked both entries which confirmed the reference. I used Ancestry to do this.

I will update with any further news.

Joanne xx

Do explain the volume and page numbers aren't unique as they should be. It could be there was a filing error all those years ago and they might never be found.

All the other Haverfordwest marriages have page numbers in the 3000s.

Rose

Ok Rose, I'll explain it in the email.

Joanne xx

Please let us know, through this thread, how you get on.

Ozi

The liklyhood is that you have quoted too much detail - this is a trap that many fall into thinking more is better, whereas the opposite is often true.

The index shows Horace J, so if you quoted Horace, without the J this may have caused the rejection. Just quote Rogers with no christian name and nothing for the spouse (I'm assuming you are certain Horace Rogers is correct)

Secondly there is no point in writing to Haverfordwest Register Office if you have ordered from the GRO. They wouldn't know anything about your cert order. You could order separately from the but the GRO references would be of no relevance.

Finally I can't see why there should be any confusion over reference numbers. If you look at the image of the index on Free BMD it is clearly Haverfordwest 11a 483

I have now received a reply from the GRO. I wrote and told them that the reference number had been confirmed by fellow genealogists. This is their reply:

*****************************

Marriage certificate : Horace Rogers & Ethel Johnson J 1919 11a 483 Haverfordwest

We have been unable to issue a certificate because the reference you found in the indexes is incorrect. This is due to an error which was made when the indexes were compiled.

In the circumstances a full refund has been credited to your account by World Pay.

If you have any questions concerning this order or would like further information, please contact us by e-mail [email protected]

***************************************

This happens to be a longstanding brick wall which could finally topple with this certificate.

What should I do now?

Joanne xx

Hi Joanne,

It's exactly as I thought then. There were 4 or 5 marriages that were affected and didn't have page numbers in the 3000s.

As I explained earlier, you can still email or phone Haverfordwest Register office. They will have their own copy of it in their books.

Rose

Marriages can be difficult if you apply to a local office. If you know a likely location, even the correct village, it will help. Not all offices have their records on computer yet, so searching for a marriage anywhere within a registration area is not easy.
I would appeal to them for help, explaining your difficulties with GRO.
If you know address in 1911, that may be a clue to marriage location.
Good luck.

Gwyn

Joanne



I had a request returned with a similar message recently. After having ordered a good 500 certificates properly, I stupidly put the correct information but in the wrong boxes, I think the District where the Year should be, and vice versa. The District was York, so it fitted into the 4 digits allowed for the Year (I complained that it shouldn't be possible enter alpha characters where numeric ones were required, and I note they have amended their screen).

Might you have done something similar?

The order of information for a certificate is Year, Quarter, District, Volume, Page.

I note the GRO say:

Horace Rogers and Johnson 1919 J 11a 483 Haverfordwest

So I wonder if you switched something?