Genealogy Chat

Hi all,

I just got a marriage cert from 1859 between Mary Evans 20, and Thomas Hamer, 23.
Mary Hamer is down as a spinster but her fathers name is down as Richard Humphreys, Farmer.

What could be the reason for this? Is it likely to be her step-dad, or a mistake on the certificate, or an invented father to cover up her being illigitimate? Which would be most likely?

Witness names on the cert are James Humphreys and David Lewis.

Thanks for any help.

Clair.
xx

I would have thought if she'd invented a father she'd have used her own surname.

Have you looked for a previous marriage? I know she says she's a spinster but it's worth looking just in case.

Failing that - if you can find her and Richard Humphreys in 1851 that might clarify it.

At the moment I'm thinking he was more than likely her stepfather.

Jill

Hi Jill, I haven't looked for them in 1851 yet as I need to go to the library to use ancestry.

I will have a look for another marriage for her though - if she started off as Mary Humphreys and married an Evans it should be easy enough to find due to her age.

Thanks.
xx

Thanks BPC, you're right, that possibility hadn't even occurred to me.
Thanks for your suggestion, much appreciated.

xx

That's true - she would have been very young.

I did have a quick look in 1851 - England and Wales - there are a couple of pages of Mary Evans' and the place names don't mean a lot to me - hope you're familiar with the area!

Jill

Good one BPC - I should have remembered that one - it happened to one of mine so yes, very useful.

Good luck with it all!

Jill

I'm not at all familiar with the area but i'm sure I will muddle thru! :-))) Some of the places are becoming familiar through research - and there's always google!

Thanks again,

xx

So where were they married then?

They were married in Rhayader in the counties of Radnor and Brecon. Both were living in Abbeycwmhir before the marriage.

xx

for ref is this them in 1861
Name: Mary Hamer
Age: 22
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1839
Relation: Wife
Spouse's Name: Thomas
Gender: Female
Where born: St Harmon, Montgomeryshire, Wales

Civil Parish or Township: Abbey Cwmhir
County/Island: Radnorshire
Country: Wales Name: Thomas Hamer
Age: 24
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1837
Relation: Head
Spouse's Name: Mary
Gender: Male
Where born: St Harmon, Montgomeryshire, Wales

Civil Parish or Township: Abbey Cwmhir
County/Island: Radnorshire
Country: Wales


Name: Thomas Hamer
Age: 1 Mo
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1861
Relation: Son
Father's Name: Thomas
Mother's Name: Mary
Gender: Male
Where born: Abbey-Cwmhir, Montgomeryshire

found 1 James Humphreys in that area in 1851
Name: James Humphreys he is a blacksmith
Age: 31
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1820
Relation: Head
Spouse's Name: Mary
Gender: Male
Where born: Llandinam, Montgomeryshire, Wales
Civil Parish or Township: Clas
County/Island: Radnorshire
Country: Wales
Household Members: Name Age
James Humphreys 31
Mary Humphreys 24
David Ingram 33 serv
David Milton 21 lodger
David Thomas 21 lodger

there are a few David Lewis in that area

1841 there is this one if its the right area (i'm not sure about place names in Wales)
Name: Mary Humphreys
Age: 1
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1840
Gender: Female
Where born: Montgomeryshire, Wales

Civil Parish: Kerry
Hundred: Montgomery
County/Island: Montgomeryshire
Country: Wales
she is transcribed by herself but looks like she could be in the household with this family
Richard Evans
Hannah Evans
plus other Evans children

Hi all, thanks for your responses.

I will work through them as soon as i get myself sorted out.

I found this for Richard Humphreys in 1861 which would be only two years after the marriage.

RG9 4237 1 1

Cold Oak (maybe Gold Oak) Abbeycwmhir

Richard 48 farmer 30 acres b montgomeryshire
Sarah 39 farmers wife b radnorshire
Richard 16 b abbeycwmhir
Mary Wozencroft 83 (MIL) b radnorshire.


That was the only Richard Humpreys I could find in that area at that time.

xx

And then i found possible marriage -

JUN 1846

Richard Humphreys
Sarah Wozencraft

Rhayader 26 511

There were a few other names on the page though so it isn't a definate.

Where do i go now though? I feel a little confused and brainachy and can't order my thoughts.

xx

Clair did you get the 1851 I sent you because looks like it is the same Richard as you have on 1861

Yes, I did, thanks Linda. That's how I found the 1861 entry.

It looks as though that is the right Richard Humphreys (I couldn't find another living in Radnorshire) but I don't know how to link them now to Mary Evans?

xx

Sorry had to shut down thunder storm!

Need to look at births then see if we can find Mary
Sent you an image possibility Mary in Rhayder

Born Rhayder Jul/Aug/Sep 1849 ref XXVI 272

Thanks Linda,
Would she have been born Mary Humphreys though? I haven't been able to find another marriage for her before the Thomas Hamer one and as she married as Mary Evans,spinster I would've thought she'd be on the birth register as Mary Evans.
.
If she was born Mary Evans there's every chance I'll never find her unless I win the lottery and buy a LOT of certificates.

Most of my Welsh rellies are giving me a headache at the moment. :-((

xx

Just going for tea will check this thread when I get back

Some of mine are Welsh too and Montgomery and never been able to find one birth cert even though have the marriage and death certs!

I live in Wales.
xx

I used to live in Merthyr - and truth be told I really miss Wales.
Whereabouts do you live?

Birth certs are hard to get due the popularity of the names. My G G G grandad Evan Jones throws up far too many possibilities to even contemplate!

I wonder if I should order the marriage cert for Richard Humphreys and see if that throws up any clues? It can't do any harm and might bring enlightenment!!

What do you think?

xx