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Dionne, the marriage that Brenda found could well be Dorothea's brother, not her father.

Dionne

Yes, more than likely to be the marriage of her brother.

Will get a copy of the service records for you - no problem!

Hello everyone.

Thankyou so much Ann. I cant wait to see what you might unearth.

Brenda thankyou for the PM I have eplied to you.

Dionne
x

just nudging this thread up... don't want to lose track of it..
Jennifer

Dionne, you have probably already looked at these websites for Dorothea's birth certificate:

http://www.southafricahouse.com/Consulate.htm

WHO MAY APPLY AND UNDER WHAT CONDITIONS CAN AN APPLICATION BE MADE

Any person may apply for a copy of a Birth Certificate provided the particulars have been registered with the South African Government.

The person who is making the application must state clearly the reason for the application.

Says its only 4 pounds but can take about 5 months!

South African High Commission,
Home Affairs, Consular Section,
15 Whitehall, London, SW1A 2DD.

Telephone No:
020 7925 8900
020 7925 8901
020 7925 8910

Might be worth giving them a call


http://home-affairs.pwv.gov.za/documents.asp

Just thinking aloud here (again) but has anyone traced the marriages of Edwin's sisters? I think they were Florence and Annie? I've sort of lost the plot now.

Selena

Selena

I know what you mean - I've just had to read back to check the 3 sisters names that I found on his Army record! Anyway, they were Edith, Annie and Florence. If I can't find anything else at Kew, then it would be a good idea to trace these 3 forwards

Just in case you don't have them?

Births Mar 1890
Livermore Alice Maud Maldon 4a 507

Births Jun 1886
LIVERMORE Florence Emily Maldon 4a 456

Not sure about these, dates are a bit late

Marriages Mar 1912
Handley Charles E Livermore Gravesend 2a 843
Livermore Alice M Handley Gravesend 2a 843

Marriages Mar 1924
Livermore Alice M Tott Edmonton 3a 884
Tott George H Livermoore Edmonton 3a 884

Marriages Mar 1925

Bloomfield Joseph E Livermore Colchester 4a 1031
Livermore Florence E Bloomfield Colchester

Thankyou for the information Selena.They could possibly be the marriages of Edwins sisters.

As for South Africa House.i do have the details and I also downloaded the forms.You have to book an appointment to go and apply for a copy of a birth certificate. My brother was going to go for me but he run out of time.

Although it is only in London we live on the Isle of Wight and is costs a small fortune to get there.But I am hoping my brother is returning to London in a few weeks time.So fingers crossed.

Dionne

Ann, are you sure it was 3 sisters = ie Edith, Annie, Florence? His stepsister was called EDITH ANNIE Harvey who I believe was later known as Livermore.

Marriages 3rd qtr 1903
Harvey Leonard Cecil Colchester 4a 1308
>>>>>>>Livermore Edith Annie Colchester 4a 1308
>>>>>>>Smith Charles Colchester 4a 1308
Yell Ada Maria Colchester 4a 1308

Edith Annie's daughter?
Births 3rd qtr 1911
Smith Ruth Livermore Maldon 4a 1456

Besides Edith Annie, there was Florence Emily & Alice Maud

Brenda

Hi Brenda

Are you saying that edith Annie was married twice as you have a daughter with the name Smith.

You are also correct on the daughters there were only two.
Alice Maud and Florance Emily.
Edith Annie was the stepdaughter.

Dionne

No Dionne, I am not saying that. Edith Annie stepdaughter of William Liverrmore was born:

Births 1st qtr 1877
Harvey Edith Annie Maldon 4a 326

but on her marriage she was married as Livermore therefore taking on the name of her stepfather.

Marriages 3rd qtr 1903
Harvey Leonard Cecil Colchester 4a 1308
>>>>>>>Livermore Edith Annie Colchester 4a 1308
>>>>>>>Smith Charles Colchester 4a 1308
Yell Ada Maria Colchester 4a 1308

She then had a daughter :

Births 3rd qtr 1911
Smith Ruth mmn Livermore Maldon 4a 1456

On page 22 I have listed Edith Annie's mothers ancestry that I believe is hers.

It would appear that her mother (wife of William Livermore) was known as Sarah Ann in all the census except for one. Cannot find her birth though in 1859.

Sarah Ann's mothers marriage:(Edith Annie's grandmother)

Marriages 3rd qtr 1840
Bunn Harriet Blofield 13 35
HARVEY James Blofield &c. 13 35

Her mothers remarriage:
Marriages 3rd qtr 1866
COOK John Maldon 4a 321
HARVEY Harriett Maldon 4a 321

Deaths 2nd qtr 1887
Cook Harriet age 66 Maldon 4a 225

There are several deaths in Maldon for James Harvey and wouldn't like to hazard a guess as to which one is the correct one.

Brenda

Hi Brenda.

You must think I am really stupid.I re read what you sent and realised my mistake. I returned to work today and have come home shattered.
Thants my excuse and I an sticking to it,lol.

Thankyou Brenda.
Dionne

I know that feeling well! With everything that has been going on in your ancestry you can be forgiven for getting confused.

Brenda

I am only repeating what was on the Army records I found - 3 sisters. This was before we all looked at the census and saw that 1 was a stepsister, but Army record just said 3 sisters.

I expect the army just heard Edith, Annie & Florence and assumed they were three sisters. I wasn't criticising you Ann - hope you don't think that I was? Your visit to Kew was the opening that was needed on this tree.

Brenda

marriage for Ruth Smith

Ruth Smith..... Herbert G Springett
Maldon
4th qtr 1933
vol 4a page 1832

Death
SPRINGETT, Ruth born 18 July 1911 died Chelmsford 1996 February
District No 4682
Reg No F26
Ent No 242
Dor 296

Births 2nd qtr 1907
Springett Herbert George Maldon 4a 784

death
SPRINGETT, Herbert George born 2 May 1907 died Chelmsford 1993 May
District No 4681B
Reg No B48G
Ent No 264
Dor 593

possible children of Ruth & Herbert:
Not that sure about the first two!

Marion J Springett mmn Smith
Braintree
1st qtr 1936
vol 4a page 1294

Maureen W Springett mmn Smith
Braintree
1st qtr 1940
vol 4a page 2121

this one is more likely:

Ruth M Springett mmn Smith
Chelmsford
4th qtr 1944
vol 4a page 858

marriage
Ruth M Springett.....Ansis A Mezits
Maldon
3rd qtr 1966
vol 4a page 2473

.............................................................

From: Chelmsford,Essex
To: Maldon,Essex
Distance: 10.3 miles

From: Chelmsford,Essex
To: Braintree,Essex
Distance: 12.6 miles

From: Maldon,Essex
To: Braintree,Essex
Distance: 14.3 miles


Brenda

Moody Blue

No, I know you weren't having a go at me, it's OK!

Hi Brenda

Thankyou for all of these leads.The Ruth Springett born 1944 looks really promising.I have searched for a death for her and have not been able to find one.So I am hoping that is another good thing.
I have done a tree search for the names but nothing so far.
I will do a search for a possible address for this Ruth.
I will be back again tomorrow after work but have to go now as family are waiting to go out.
Many Many thanks
Dionne