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Hi All

Am helping a 5th Cousin look for information on her grandfathers family.

He was born George McVay in 1942, Burnley Lancs.

His mother was Jane Hargreaves McVay (nee Sparks) and was married to Thomas McVay he died in 1932. They did not know Thomas was not the father of George until recently. I have told her to purchase the birth cert.

Jane and Thomas had two other children.
Zita McVay born 1931
Lawrence McVay born 1926
All in Burnley Lancs and both have passed away in 1993 and 2003. Jane died in 1990

I have access to the 1939 census but actually cannot see them there.

Could someone else have a look for me please

thanks

Deaths too recent to have been picked up

You can provide proof of death and have the records opened for those who were alive in 1939

Thomas and Jane were born 1906/7.

I can’t find them either. The birth certificate won’t necessarily tell you who George’s father was. He would have to be present at the registration ( or husband) to be named.
Edit: opening the 1939 entries is not going to solve the problem.

Marriages Mar 1926 (>99%)
McVay Thomas Sparks Burnley 8e 237 Scan available - click to view
Sparks Jane McVay Burnley 8e 237


Deaths Mar 1932 (>99%)*********************************************************
McVay Thomas 25 Burnley 8e 264

Buried 2nd March

I don't think the father will be recorded on the birth certificate as Jane gives her maiden name as McVay.

I can't find them on the 1939 register either unless she is living with someone else by 1939 and using his name??

Kath. x

As George was registered in the mother's maiden name, you've probably hit a brick wall

If the father had acknowledged the child, there would a 'double' birth registration, but there isn't

Kath. If he was present at the birth registration he could be named.

She obviously wasn’t married to him.

Perhaps she didn't give her actual maiden name then she hadn't told the person who was George's real father that she was already married. As it was war time there were lots of babies born out of wedlock. If her husband was dead by 1932 she could have just gone to the register office and registered the birth in her husband's surname and used her maiden name and no one would have been any the wiser.

Kath. x

Jane is in the workhouse on 1911 census, and boarding in 1921

Admission: 3 Oct 1907 Workhouse, Burnley, Lancashire, England
Jane Sparks -
Notes: Born [in the house] [Age not recorded]
More details available: Contact Lancashire Archives
Register: Inmates Nearest Known Relative or Friend 1879 - 1908
Source: Original Register at Lancashire Archives

Admission: 3 Oct 1907 Workhouse, Burnley, Lancashire, England
Jane Sparks -
Born: 1907
More details available: Contact Lancashire Archives
Register: Admissions Index Book J to Z 1906 - 1909
Source: Original Register at Lancashire Archives

Baptism: 6 Nov 1907 St Peter, Burnley, Lancashire, England
Jane Hargreaves Sparks - [Child] of Margaret Sparks
Abode: 8 Chaffer St.
Notes: [Father's name Arthur and occupation Coal Miner crossed out. Comment at bottom
of page] I find on investigation that Mrs. Sparks has no husband. [signed] A. J.
Feb 12th. 1908*****************************************************************
Baptised by: J Haythornethwaite
Register: Baptisms 1904 - 1907, Page 96, Entry 768
Source: Original Parish Register

Admission: 2 Mar 1908 Workhouse, Burnley, Lancashire, England
Jane Sparks -
Age: 5 months
More details available: Contact Lancashire Archives
Register: Inmates Nearest Known Relative or Friend 1879 - 1908
Source: Original Register at Lancashire Archives
Admission: 2 Mar 1908 Workhouse, Burnley, Lancashire, England
Jane Sparks -
Born: 1907
More details available: Contact Lancashire Archives
Register: Admissions Index Book J to Z 1906 - 1909
Source: Original Register at Lancashire Archives

Admission: 12 Oct 1909 Workhouse, Burnley, Lancashire, England
Jane Sparks -
Born: 1907
More details available: Contact Lancashire Archives
Register: Admissions J-Z 1909 - 1911
Source: Original Register
Admission: 30 Nov 1909 Workhouse, Burnley, Lancashire, England
Jane Sparks -
Born: 3 Oct 1907
More details available: Contact Lancashire Archives
Register: Admissions J-Z 1909 - 1911
Source: Original Register

Admission: 30 Nov 1909 Workhouse, Burnley, Lancashire, England
Jane Sparks -
Born: 3 Oct 1907
More details available: Contact Lancashire Archives
Register: Admissions J-Z 1911 - 1913
Source: Original Register at Lancashire Archives

Erika - he wasn't registered in his mother's maiden name (which was Sparks) but with the name McVay and mother's maiden name McVay.

Kath. x

Of course, Kathleen - it's been one of 'those' days :-S :-S :-S :-S

It's still extremely unlikely that there will be any info regarding paternity ;-) ;-)

Surely the family must have known that Thomas was not George's father if Thomas died in 1932 and George was not born until 1942.

Kath. x

Surely the father could still be named ( if present) but the child have the mothers surname - especially if they weren’t living together.

It is also possible that Jane gave Thomas as the father to hide the illegitimacy.

We won’t know any of the answers until the certificate arrives.

If Jane gave Thomas as the father why did she not give her real maiden name?

I think it more likely that she was trying to imply that she wasn't married.

Kath. x

It’s a strange one as you would think she would want to hide the fact that she wasn’t married to the father.

1921, although as George was the 'line' it has no connection whatsoever to the cousin's family

72, Hirst Street, Burnley, Lancashire, England

Thomas McVey Father Male 1860 61 Manchester, Lancashire, England Dataler Dattaler On Of Work At Present
Martha Jane Simpson Housekeeper Female 1879 41 Burnley, Lancashire, England Winder Winder Out Of Work
Annie Simpson Daughter Female 1901 19 Burnley, Lancashire, England Weaver Out Of Work
Joseph Simpson Son Male 1905 16 Burnley, Lancashire, England Cripple -
Thomas McVey Son Female 1906 14 Burnley, Lancashire, England Pit Brow Out Of Work Brooks & Brooks
Ellen McVey Daughter Female 1909 12 Burnley, Lancashire, England - -
Martha Alice McVey Daughter Female 1912 9 Burnley, Lancashire, England - -

Banns: St James, Burnley, Lancashire, England
Thomas McVay - B, 24 Sydney St. St James's
Jane Sparks - S, 24 Sydney St. St James's
First Reading: 31 Jan 1926; Read By: B. W.
Second Reading: 7 Feb 1926; Read By: B. W.
Third Reading: 14 Feb 1926; Read By: B. W.
Notes: Married. 15 Hampden St.
Register: Banns 1914 - 1927, Page 117, Entry 465
Source: Original Parish Register at Lancashire Archives

Marriage: 20 Feb 1926 St James, Burnley, Lancashire, England
Thomas McVay - 19, Pitman, Bachelor, 24 Sydney St.
Jane Sparks - 18, Weaver, Spinster, 24 Sydney St.
Groom's Father: Thomas McVay, deceased, Miner
Bride's Father: Arthur Sparks, Outdoor Worker
Witness: Harold Carroll; Geraldin Forton
Married by Banns by: B. Winfield, Vicar
Register: Marriages 1911 - 1927, Page 242, Entry 483
Source: Original Parish Register

??????

1911 Census For England & Wales
5 Croft Street Burnley, Burnley, Lancashire, England

Jane Wignall Head Widow Female 56 1855 Housekeeper Wigan Lancashire
John Wignall Son Married Male 21 1890 Carter general Burnley Lancashire
Mary Ann Wignall Daughter Married Female 19 1892 Cotton spinner Burnley Lancashire
James Thomas Wignall Son Single Male 12 1899 School Burnley Lancashire
Margaret Jane Howarth Grandchild - Female 10 1901 School Burnley Lancashire
James Nailer Lodger - Male 10 1901 School Burnley Lancashire
Margaret Sparks Lodger Widower Female 38 1873 Laundry warehouseman Mary Port Cumberland
Bessie Sparks Lodger - Female 1 1910 - Burnley Burnley

Margaret says she has had 5 children.....all living (claims to have been married for 15 years)
???
SPARKS Elizabeth Hooper SPARKS 1910 Burnley East Preston

If, as expected, the birth certificate doesn’t give the fathers name the next step to consider is a DNA test which might give some clues.

Here's Jane in 1939, with 2 closed records (presumably Zita and Lawrence ) , and name mistranscribed on Ancestry.
It's McVay on the image, when you know what you're looking for.:

Jane McNutt
in the 1939 England and Wales Register
Name: Jane McNutt [Jane Match] [Hatch ]
Gender: Female
Marital Status: Widow <<<<<<<<<<
Birth Date: 3 Oct 1907
Residence Date: 1939
Address: 5 Mary Street
Residence Place: Burnley, Lancashire, England
Occupation: Cotton Weaver
Line Number: 38
Schedule Number: 129
Sub Schedule Number: 2
Enumeration District: Nfaf
Borough: Burnley
Registration district: 472/1
Household Members (Name) Age
Margaret Fort 68
Jane McNutt 32
This record is officially closed. <<<<<<<<<
This record is officially closed. <<<<<<<<<<
Margaret Maroden 22




Marriages Mar 1968 (99%)
HATCH BERTIE MCVAY BURNLEY 10B 1708
MCVAY JANE HATCH BURNLEY 10B 1708


Deaths 1984 (>99%)
HATCH JANE 3OC1907 BURNLEY/PEN 40 1088