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Sorry for delay Thank you for the census

On James' Army Record he gives the address of 53 Russell Street. James was still in the Army when the 1921 Census was taken but the following is the entry for 53 Russell Street

First name(s) Last name Relationship to head Sex Birth year Age in years Birth place Occupation Employer
Harriet Garside Wife
Female 1885 36 Manchester, Lancashire, England Home Duty -
Walter Garside Son
Male 1909 12 Manchester, Lancashire, England Home Duty -
Frederick William Garside Son
Male 1912 9 Manchester, Lancashire, England Home Duty -
John Garside Son
Male 1914 7 Manchester, Lancashire, England Home Duty -

THank you for your help yes I think Sophia is the mother
Don't know where James was going but he kept coming back Sophia seemed to have 3 more children in the 1880s sadly all three died two james was a labourer and one he was down as a shop keeper but that was the middle one of the 3
so I can add this to my tree now

Thank you again

Could the child Sophia have been named after her grandmother?

The Army record also gives James' birth as 05/11/1884. Perhaps James lied about his age on the Marriage Cert as he would have been under age!

This date of birth ties in with the birth AG found ie
GARSIDE, JAMES MMN GILBERT
GRO Reference: 1884 D Quarter in CHORLTON Volume 08C Page 807

Looks like you are back on track, Slyann :-)

The children listed on the record are

Walter b 10/8/08 bap 25/8/08
Frederick William 11/6/10 bap 28/6/10
John b 6/9/13 bap 22/9/13

All the Baptisms took place at St Luke's

Sorry for the delay couldn't get on internet?? yes that is the marriage I've got every thing I've got leads up to them they had 6 children Harriet is my grandfathers sister.
one of their children Walter married Alice Hunter, alices gr grandfather was my 2 gr grandfather

children Lost the first 2
Sophia & James
Walter 1908-1985
Frederick W 1910-1951
John 1913 1988
Harriet 1916

Sylann, how did you get back to your James Garside?


Do you know that Harriet was actually his wife?


I have found an Army Record for a James Garside with a wife Harriet Turner who married at All Saints Registry Office, 4/12/1904 or 25/12/1904 is this the Certificate you have? Do you know the names of their children?

This is the James with mother Sophia:

GARSIDE, JAMES mmn GILBERT
GRO Reference: 1884 D Quarter in CHORLTON Volume 08C Page 807


Marriages Sep 1874 (>99%)
Garside James Manchester 8d 250
Gilbert Sophia Manchester 8d 250

Sophia Gilbert
in the Manchester, England, Marriages and Banns, 1754-1930 (Cathedral)
Name: Sophia Gilbert
Birth Year: abt 1855
Marriage Date: 12 Jul 1874
Parish: Manchester, St Mary, St Denys and St George
Father's Name: Luke Gilbert
Spouse's Name: James Garside [ carter ]
Spouse's Father's Name: John Garside
Archive Roll: 741

Address: 40 Bedford Street <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
But neither of them is at that address in 1871.

In 1891 and 1901, Sophia is listed as married - but there's no husband with her, only the children.

From Findagrave:

Sophia Garside
Birth unknown
Death 11 Jul 1907
Burial
Southern Cemetery
Chorlton-Cum-Hardy, Metropolitan Borough of Manchester, Greater Manchester, England
Plot
MConsecrated 564
Memorial ID
162226888 · View Source
Gravesite Details
"Death date" is burial date.


In spite of much hunting, I don't see any James Garside who is a greengrocer.
If your James is Sophia's son, perhaps he just said his father was a greengrocer because it seemed better than carter. Or maybe he was a carter for a greengrocer!

Although we only know who was at home on the census nights, and not what the situation was all the rest of each year, it does seem possible that James senior had left Sophia and the children.

Sorry having problems with my Chromebook
Don't know what to do now going of the marriage certificate That Baptism sounds good yet the other one sounded Ok with the witnesses for the marriage and Caroline's name being Garside

Thank you

????

Baptism: 19 Nov 1884 All Saints, Chorlton on Medlock, Lancashire, England
James Garside - [Child] of James Garside & Emma
Born: 5 Nov 1884
Abode: 25 Brook Str.
Occupation: Shop Keeper
Baptised by: Robt. Bee
Register: Baptisms 1884 - 1904, Page 4, Entry 43
Source: LDS Film 2112983

1881 Census for Family showing James as Father. Could James have left the family? Perhaps James didn't know his Father, just a thought

James Garside Head
Married Male 27 1854 Carter Lancashire, England
Sophia Garside Wife
Married Female 26 1855 - Wolverhampton, Staffordshire, England
Eliza Garside Daughter
Single Female 4 1877 - Manchester, Lancashire, England
Margaret Yates Lodger
- Female 26 1855 C twiner Manchester, Lancashire, England

Address:59, Mount Street, Chorlton upon Medlock, Chorlton, Lancashire, England

Caroline in 1901 Census. Although Mother Sophia states she is married still no husband

Sophia Garside Head
Married Female 45 1856 Laundress Wolverhampton, Staffordshire, England
Caroline Garside Daughter
Single Female 19 1882 Gaiter maker Manchester, Lancashire, England
James Garside Son
Single Male 17 1884 Errand boy coal yard Manchester, Lancashire, England
Frederick Garside Son
Single Male 6 1895 - Manchester, Lancashire, England

Address:7, Gray Street, South Manchester, Chorlton, Lancashire, England

IF Caroline was James' sister this is the 1891 Census

Name: Caroline Garside
Gender: Female
Age: 8
Relationship: Daughter
Birth Year: 1883
Mother:
Sophia Garside
Birth Place: Manchester; Chorlton on Medlock
Civil parish: Chorlton on Medlock
Ecclesiastical parish: All Saints
Residence Place: Chorlton on Medlock, Lancashire, England
Registration district: Chorlton
Sub registration district: Chorlton upon Medlock
ED, Institution or Vessel: 2
Neighbors:
Piece: 3182
Folio: 38
Household Members (Name) Age Relationship
Sophia Garside
36 Head Married (but no husband)
Eliza Garside
14 Daughter
Caroline Garside 8 Daughter
James Garside
6 Son

With regards to the Witnesses. David & Caroline Still, there is this marriage

Marriages Sep 1901

GARSIDE Caroline Chorlton 8c 1657
STILL David Chorlton 8c 1657

No Turners living at 24 Markham St in 1901; Wallace & Eliza Barendale and family are there

Thank you for that I have all that and it would appear James 1883 stayed at 23 Bedford until 1913 but The thing I can't find is James 's Father James and that address was 39 Bedford st

I can't find anything on James Garside father of James Garside 1883 on the marriage it has the address but that doesn't mean James sen lived there
All I've got is he was a greengrocer ?
The father I've got is James 1848 and an engine driver so clearly I've gone wrong
I think on GRO their are a few James born Manchester?

James
Country England
Last name Garside
Volume 8C
Marriage quarter 4
Volume as transcribed 8C
Marriage year 1904
Page number 1482
Registration month -
Record set England & Wales Marriages 1837-2005
MarriageFinder™ James Garside married one of these people
Harriet Turner, Agnes Royle
Category Birth, Marriage, Death & Parish Records
District Chorlton
Subcategory Civil Marriage & Divorce
District number -
Collections from Great Britain, England
County Lancashire

Walter
Country England
Last name Garside
Volume 8C
Birth quarter 3
Page 926
Birth year 1908
Record set England & Wales Births 1837-2006
Mother's maiden name Turner
Category Birth, Marriage, Death & Parish Records
District Chorlton
Subcategory Civil Births
County Lancashire

James
Country England
Last name Garside
Volume 8C
Birth quarter 1
Page 862
Birth year 1907
Record set England & Wales Births 1837-2006
Mother's maiden name Turner
Category Birth, Marriage, Death & Parish Records
District Chorlton
Subcategory Civil Births
County Lancashire

James
District Chorlton
Last name Garside
County Lancashire
Gender Male
Volume 8C
Birth day -
Page 484
Birth month -
Country England
Birth year 1907
Record set England & Wales Deaths 1837-2007
Age 1
Category Birth, Marriage, Death & Parish Records
Death quarter 2
Subcategory Civil Deaths & Burials
Death year 1908

This is the family living at 23 Bedford Street in 1911

James Garside Head
Married Male 27 1884 Hawker Manchester
Walter Garside Son
- Male 3 1908 - Manchester
Harriet Garside Wife
Married Female 25 1886 - Manchester
William Garside Son
- Male 1 1910 - Manchester
James Brown Lodger
Widower Male 32 1879 Pensioner army Manchester

There's nobody living at 23 Bedford Street in 1901.

Someone with a sub to FMP could easily find out who's at these addresses - ie - not me!
I'm sure someone will be along later.