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Good Morning
I wonder if anyone could help me find someone on the 1861 and 71 census

GEORGE KEEN
born 1851 Betley Staffordshire

His mother was ELIZA KEEN
no known father

He had a sister mary who i think might have been his twin

On the 1851 Census he is living with his mother, sister and grandmother MARY KEEN

George married HANNAH JONES in 1880 but I can't seem to find him or his family on the 1861 and 1871 census

Any help with theses would be very much appreciated

Thank You

1851 Census

Mary Keen Head Widow Female 75 1776 - Betley, Staffordshire, England
Eliza Keen Grand daughter Unmarried Female 19 1832 - Madeley, Staffordshire, England
Mary Keen - - Female 0 1851 - Betley, Staffordshire, England
George Keen - - Male 0 1851 - Betley, Staffordshire, England


I have George and Hannah with their family from the 1881 census up to the 1921 Census were they were living in Leigh Lancashire

Ancestry's transcription of 1851 census, for our reference.

Note ages of George and sister Mary, compared with above.

Mary senior is his great-grandmother - not his grandmother:

Geo Keen
in the 1851 England Census
Name: Geo Keen
Age: 3
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1848
Relation: Great Grand Son
Gender: Male
Where born: Betley, Staffordshire, England
Civil Parish: Betley
Phillimore Ecclesiastical Parish Maps:
View related Ecclesiastical Parish
Town: Betley
County/Island: Staffordshire
Country: England
Street Address:
Occupation:
Condition as to marriage:
Disability:
View image
Registration District: Newcastle Under Lyme
Sub-registration District: Whitmore
ED, institution, or vessel: 1
Neighbors:
Household Schedule Number: 15
Piece: 2001
Folio: 469
Page Number: 4
Household Members:
Name Age
Mary Keen 75
Eliza Keen 19
Mary Keen 3 Mo
Geo Keen 3


I don't see birth records for either of the children.

No sign of Eliza or the children in 1861 or 1871.

Also for our reference:

Hannah's name was Heywood at marriage in 1880.

Her first marriage:

Marriages Dec 1871 (>99%)
HEYWOOD Joseph Newcastle L. 6b 118
JONES Hannah Newcastle L. 6b 118


George Keen
in the Staffordshire, England, Church of England Marriages and Banns, 1754-1900
Name: George Keen
Marriage Age: 29
Record Type: Marriage
Birth Date: abt 1851
Residence Place: Leycett
Marriage Date: 23 Oct 1880
Marriage Place: Madeley, Staffordshire, England
Spouse:
Hannah Heywood
Religion: Anglican
Page number: 239


George Keene
in the 1881 England Census
Name: George Keene
Age: 31
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1850
Relationship to Head: Head
Spouse: Hannah Keene
Gender: Male
Where born: Bettley, Staffordshire, England
Civil Parish: Madeley
County/Island: Staffordshire
Country: England
Street Address: Leycett 11
Marital status: Married
Education:
Employment status:
View image
Occupation: Coal Miner
Registration District: Newcastle Under Lyme
ED, institution, or vessel: 25
Neighbors:
Piece: 2701
Folio: 111
Page Number: 15
Household Members:
Name Age
George Keene 31
Hannah Keene 27
George Haywood 8
Eliza Haywood 2


HEYWOOD, ELIZA mmn JONES
GRO Reference: 1879 M Quarter in LEIGH Volume 08C Page 295

looks like gmother died 1861

Mary
County Staffordshire
Last name Keen
Country England
Birth year 1777
Archive reference D3479/1/7
Age 84
Register type Burial
Death year 1861
Page 101
Death date ? ? 1861
Record set Staffordshire Burials
Burial year 1861
Category Birth, Marriage, Death & Parish Records
Burial date 08 Sep 1861
Subcategory Parish Burials
Denomination Anglican
Collections from England, Great Britain
Place Betley, St Margaret

Ancestry's transcription of 1851 is inaccurate. George's age is 3 MONTHS

Oh yes, so it is.

As his age was originally written in the "females" column by mistake, and then corrected so that the "3" is in the "males" column, I was thinking that the enumerator had just forgotten to score out the "Mo" - but of course if he was 3 years old, he would have been listed before his sister.

Thank you everyone for looking

If his mother married some time after his birth could he be recorded on the 1861 and 1871 under the name of his step-father and then used his correct surname at his marriage?

No help with 1861/71, but....................????????

1841 England, Wales & Scotland Census
Betley Common, Betley, Newcastle under Lyme, Staffordshire, England
William Keene Male 60 1781 Staffordshire, England
Mary Keene Female 60 1781 Staffordshire, England
John Keene Male 25 1816 Staffordshire, England
Joseph Johnson Male 30 1811 Staffordshire, England
Eliza Dopson Female 9 1832 Staffordshire, England*****************

???

George Bailey
in the 1871 England Census
Name: George Bailey
Age: 20
Estimated Birth Year: 1851
Relation: Son
Gender: Male
Where born: Betley, Staffordshire, England
Civil parish: Betley
Town: Cracow Moss
County/Island: Staffordshire
Country: England
Registration district: Newcastle Under Lyme
Sub-registration district: Audley
ED, institution, or vessel: 11
Household schedule number: 165
Piece: 2837
Folio: 65
Page number: 32
Household Members Age Relationship
James Bailey 38 Head - widower
George Bailey 20 Son <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< TWIN
Mary Bailey 20 Daughter - Betley <<<<<<<<<< - TWIN
Betsey Bailey 14 Daughter - Betley
Louisa Bailey 9 Daughter - Englesea Brook, Cheshire
Charles Bailey 6 Son - Betley
Eliza Bailey 4 Daughter - Betley



BAILEY, LOUISA mmn KEEN
GRO Reference: 1862 J Quarter in NANTWICH Volume 08A Page 325

BAILEY, HANNAH ELIZA mmn KEEN
GRO Reference: 1866 J Quarter in NEWCASTLE UNDER LYME Volume 06B Page 75


Betsey:

Elizabeth Bailey
in the England, Select Births and Christenings, 1538-1975
Name: Elizabeth Bailey
Gender: Female
Baptism Date: 12 Mar 1857
Baptism Place: Betley,Stafford,England
Father: James Bailey
Mother: Elizabeth
FHL Film Number: 426484



Charles Bayley
in the England, Select Births and Christenings, 1538-1975
Name: Charles Bayley
Gender: Male
Baptism Date: 24 Jul 1864
Baptism Place: Betley, Stafford, England
Father: James Bayley
Mother: Eliza
FHL Film Number: 1040822
Reference ID: 162



EDIT:
BUT -

???
BAILEY, CHARLES mmn COOPER
GRO Reference: 1864 S Quarter in NEWCASTLE UNDER LYME Volume 06B Page 61

BAILEY, ELIZABETH mmn COOPER
GRO Reference: 1857 J Quarter in NEWCASTLE UNDER LYME Volume 06B Page 59



If Eliza Keen was James Bailey's wife/partner -

her death??

Deaths Mar 1871 (>99%)
Bailey Eliza 40 Newcastle L. 6b 55

Following that 1871 family back to 1861 - but George should be 10, though image does say 6 -


James Bailey
in the 1861 England Census
Name: James Bailey
Age: 27
Estimated Birth Year: 1834
Relation: Head
Spouse's Name: Eliza Bailey
Gender: Male
Where born: Betley, Staffordshire, England
Civil parish: Madeley
County/Island: Staffordshire
Country: England
Registration district: Newcastle Under Lyme
Sub-registration district: Newcastle Under Lyme
ED, institution, or vessel: 21
Neighbors:
Household schedule number: 80
Piece: 1918
Folio: 79
Page number: 15
Household Members Age Relationship
James Bailey 27 Head
Eliza Bailey 28 Wife - Madeley
Mary A Bailey 10 Daughter - Betley
George Bailey 6 Son - Betley
Elizth Bailey 4 Daughter - Betley
William Bailey 2 Son - Betley


BAILEY, WILLIAM mmn KEEN
GRO Reference: 1858 S Quarter in NEWCASTLE UNDER LYME Volume 06B Page 60

Eliza Dobson
in the Staffordshire, England, Church of England Marriages and Banns, 1754-1900
Name: Eliza Dobson
Marriage Age: Full age
Record Type: Marriage
Residence Place: Knutton Heath
Marriage Date: 16 Sep 1856
Marriage Place: Wolstanton, St Margaret, Staffordshire, England
Father: John Dobson
Spouse: James Bailey
Religion: Anglican
Page number: 61


1841, as previously posted by ErikaH:

Eliza Dopson
in the 1841 England Census
Name: Eliza Dopson [Dobson]
Age: 9
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1832
Gender: Female
Where born: Staffordshire, England
Civil parish: Betley
Hundred: North Pirehill
County/Island: Staffordshire
Country: England
Registration district: Newcastle under Lyme
Sub-registration district: Audley
Neighbors:
Piece: 986
Book: 14
Folio: 14
Page number: 23
Household Members Age
William Kun 60 [KEEN on image ]
Mary Kun 60 [KEEN ]
John Kun 25 - [KEEN ]
Joseph Johnson 30
Eliza Dopson 9

??? Note the name Johnson in 1841 above:

William Keen
in the England, Select Marriages, 1538-1973
Name: William Keen
Gender: Male
Marriage Date: 19 Jun 1809
Marriage Place: Betley, Stafford, England
Spouse: Mary Johnson
FHL Film Number: 1040822
Reference ID: 183


But Ancestry suggests this is that Mary in 1851 - if so, she can't be the one with Eliza and children:

Mary Keene
in the 1851 England Census
Name: Mary Keene
Age: 78
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1773
Relation: Wife
Spouse's Name: William Keene
Gender: Female
Where born: Glascote, Warwickshire, England
Civil Parish: Betley
Phillimore Ecclesiastical Parish Maps:
View related Ecclesiastical Parish
County/Island: Staffordshire
Country: England
Street Address:
Occupation:
Condition as to marriage:
Disability:
View image
Registration District: Newcastle Under Lyme
Sub-registration District: Whitmore
ED, institution, or vessel: 1
Neighbors:
Household Schedule Number: 158
Piece: 2001
Folio: 485
Page Number: 36
Household Members:
Name Age
William Keene 74
Mary Keene 78


BUT Ancestry's assumptions/suggestions are often wrong, so the Mary with Eliza in 1851 may well be the one who married William!

???

Eliza Dobson
in the England & Wales, Christening Index, 1530-1980
Name: Eliza Dobson
Gender: Female
Christening Date: 22 Mar 1835
Christening Place: Madeley, Staffordshire, England
Father: Joseph Dobson
Mother: Hannah Dobson [ nee Hollins, per marriage details ]

EDIT -
No, wrong child.
Her marriage record says her father's name was John.

Joseph and Hannah are together in later censuses.

sorry for late reply. Thank you so much for looking.
Just received George and Hannahs marriage certificate it has no fathers name for George.
So Eliza must have been unmarried when she had George and Mary in 1851

We already knew that Eliza was unmarried.

Although she's listed as Keen in 1851 - possibly because she had been brought up by Mary Keen, who may or may not have been her grandmother as stated in 1851 - her birth name was Dobson, as shown above.

She married James Bailey under her birth name of Dobson, but the Bailey children have mmn Keen, so she seems to have used both names at different times.

Births of the twins:

DOBSON, GEORGE -
GRO Reference: 1851 M Quarter in NEWCASTLE UNDER LYME Volume 17 Page 94


DOBSON, MARY -
GRO Reference: 1851 M Quarter in NEWCASTLE UNDER LYME Volume 17 Page 93


I can't find the marriage of Eliza's parents, who were ostensibly John Dobson and a female Keen - IF Mary Keen was indeed her grandmother.
But maybe they didn't marry.

For all we know, maybe "grandmother" is just a courtesy title for Mary if she had brought Eliza up - or an assumption by the enumerator.
And in fact we don't know that the Keen family did bring her up.
All we know is that she was with Mary on the census dates in both 1841 and 1851.

Eliza was UNMARRIED on the1851 census you posted in your OP

So Eliza 's real surname was Dobson and her married surname was Bailey .

Her twins were registered in her maiden name of Dobson as she only married 5 years later.

She lived with the Keen family but I wonder what the connection was. It must have been a strong one as George is known as George Keen all his life

The age of the twins on the 1861 census are Mary 10 and George 6 ?

I think I will look into Mary Keen/Dobson who was georges sister and see if she turns up anything.

George is my brother in laws great grandfather

Thank you all once again for your help

Looks like Mary kept the surname Bailey, and never married:


Mary Bailey
in the 1891 England Census
Name: Mary Bailey
Gender: Female
Age: 40
Relationship: Sister
Birth Year: 1851
Birth Place: Betley, Staffordshire, England
Civil parish: Stoke upon Trent
Ecclesiastical parish: St Peter
Residence Place: Boothen, Stoke upon Trent, Staffordshire, England
Registration district: Stoke Upon Trent
Sub registration district: Stoke upon Trent
ED, Institution or Vessel: 15
Neighbors:
Piece: 2177
Folio: 76
Household Members Age Relationship
Chas Bailey 25 Head
Betsey Bailey 25 Wife
Mary Bailey 40 Sister
Elizabeth Bailey 6/12 Daughter


Mary Bailey
in the 1901 England Census
Name: Mary Bailey
Age: 48
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1853
Relation to Head: Sister
Gender: Female
Birth Place: Hanley, Staffordshire, England
Civil parish: Hanley
Ecclesiastical parish: Shelton St Mark
County/Island: Staffordshire
Country: England
Registration district: Stoke upon Trent
Sub-registration district: Shelton
ED, institution, or vessel: 27
Neighbors:
Piece: 2607
Folio: 83
Page number: 26
Household schedule number: 159

Also listed are brother Charles, his wife Betsey, and children Mary E 11, Lily 9, and William H 5.



Mary Baily
in the 1911 England Census
Name: Mary Baily
Age in 1911: 60
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1851
Relation to Head: Sister
Gender: Female
Birth Place: Betley, Staffordshire
Civil Parish: Stoke Rural
Country: England
Street Address: 16 High St, Bucknall, Stoke On Trent
Marital status: Single
Registration District Number: 361
Sub-registration District: Stoke Rural
ED, institution, or vessel: 03
Piece: 16611
Household Members:
Name Age
Charles Baily 46 - Head, Betley
Betsey Baily 44 - wife
Mary Baily 60 - sister
May Baily 20
Lily Baily 18
William Baily 14
John Baily 6
George Baily 3


???
Mary Bailey
in the England & Wales, Civil Registration Death Index, 1916-2007
Name: Mary Bailey
Death Age: 74
Birth Date: abt 1852
Registration Date: Jan 1926[Feb 1926] [Mar 1926]
Registration Quarter: Jan-Feb-Mar
Registration District: West Bromwich
Inferred County: Staffordshire
Volume: 6b
Page: 967


Charles's marriage:

Charles Bailey
in the Staffordshire, England, Church of England Marriages and Banns, 1754-1900
Name: Charles Bailey
Marriage Age: 24
Record Type: Marriage
Birth Date: abt 1864
Residence Place: Church St
Marriage Date: 8 Apr 1888
Marriage Place: Hanley, St John, Staffordshire, England
Father:
James Bailey <<<<<<<<<<
Spouse:
Betsy Smith
Religion: Anglican
Page number: 196


1921:

Charles
Bailey
1864
Staffordshire, England
Stoke Rural
Stoke upon Trent
Staffordshire

He's with Mary Bailey 1851, WH Bailey 1897, John Bailey 1905, George Bailey 1907, and Maggie Bailey 1895

Charles's death - with that mystery mmn Cooper again, as in his birth record:

Charles Bailey
in the Staffordshire, England, Birth, Marriage and Death Indexes, 1837-2017
Name: Charles Bailey
Record Type: Birth
Birth Date: 1864
Birth Place: Staffordshire, England
Mother: Cooper


EDIT: NO, sorry - that's the birth record !