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Even if Douglas H N was Douglas M's father you still need the birth cert in case it names his mother.

There is no other way to (hopefully) find out who she was - unless the Barnardos records name her.

I don't see what relationship is between Joan ML and the Carpenters in 1939, but it seems too much of a coincidence for there to be none.

I posted the wrong birth for her earlier.

This is the correct one:

CARPENTER, JOAN MARY LOUISE mmn SIMENSEN
GRO Reference: 1920 S Quarter in WILLESDEN Volume 03A Page 631


Joan M L Carpenter
in the 1939 England and Wales Register
Name: Joan M L Carpenter
Gender: Female
Marital Status: Single
Birth Date: 18 Aug 1920
Residence Year: 1939
Address: 16
Residence Place: Willesden, Middlesex, England
Occupation: Telephonist G P O
Line Number: 13
Schedule Number: 39
Sub Schedule Number: 4
Enumeration District: BXGK
Borough: Willesden
Registration district: 129-2
Inferred Father:
Eugene V Carpenter
Inferred Mother:
Esther L Carpenter
Household Members Age
Eugene V Carpenter 58
Esther L Carpenter 47
Edward L Carpenter 25
Joan M L Carpenter 19
Peter J M Carpenter 13

CARPENTER, EUGENE VICTOR mmn PEDDER
GRO Reference: 1881 S Quarter in WANDSWORTH Volume 01D Page 643


He's not with parents or siblings in any census. He was in the army.

A brother:

CARPENTER, ARTHUR JAMES mmn PEDDER
GRO Reference: 1874 M Quarter in SAINT SAVIOUR SURREY Volume 01D Page 76

Parents were George Carpenter and Marianne Pedder.


No sign of another brother with George as first or middle name born 1875 (as in 1939 with Douglas).

Hi thank you for all this info. Im going thru this now. I do have tree on ancestry but I'm not sure I have correct info on for farther wyatt... im doing all I can researching. Is there anyone named Betty or Betsy Blake as my nan mentioned possibly Douglas mum 1st name but can't be sure. Il have to order Douglas birth certificate. My nan did say she thinks Douglas farther was from Scotland because of MCDONALD name..
Maybe his mum didn't marry to doug farther. I'm wondering if Carpenter surname who Douglas was living with is any relation to him. BLAKE Is definitely Douglas mum maiden name.

I don't think Douglas h n wyatt is farther as the marriage is little late after giving up Douglas to a home? Curious what relation is with Carpenter though unless they fostered Douglas

Just tried to get Douglas Birth certificate and it can't find him?? But found death certificate

ArgyllGran gave the reference for the birth certificate on the first reply on this thread:-

Births Jun 1931 (>99%)
Wyatt Douglas M Blake Cuckfield 2b 205

Kath. x

Ok. Just managed to find and order. Thank you.

As already said, there is no Wyatt/Blake marriage - at least not in England, Wales, or Scotland.

His mother may have been married before, or else he may have been born illegitimately but registered under his father's surname.

The date of Douglas H N's marriage is irrelevant.

When the birth cert arrives, please come back and let us know what it says.

I'm wondering about this man - although only because of name, and locations - Sussex and Hampshire.


Marriages Mar 1933 (>99%)
Standing Laura E Wyatt Brighton 2b 358
Wyatt Douglas J Standing Brighton 2b 358


Douglas J Wyatt
in the 1939 England and Wales Register
Name: Douglas J Wyatt
Gender: Male
Marital Status: Married
Birth Date: 3 Apr 1909
Residence Year: 1939
Address: 98 Sawmill Woodhouse
Residence Place: Petersfield, Hampshire, England
Occupation: Head Cowman
Line Number: 9
Schedule Number: 163
Sub Schedule Number: 1
Enumeration District: EEPC
Borough: Petersfield
Registration district: 103 1
Inferred Spouse:
Laura E Wyatt
Inferred Children:
Lawrence A Wyatt
Household Members Age
Douglas J Wyatt 30
Laura E Wyatt 34
This record is officially closed.
Lawrence A Wyatt 2
Laurence A Short 18


Note birthplace of son Lawrence.

Births Jun 1937 (>99%)
Wyatt Lawrence A Standing Cuckfield 2b 213

Their other son (presumably the closed record) was born in 1932 in Brighton and named Douglas.

There's no previous marriage for Douglas J, but perhaps he had an unmarried relationship with a Blake. Just a wild suggestion.

We'll have to wait for the birth cert!



ADDED info, just in case:

???
Douglas John Wyatt
in the England & Wales, Civil Registration Birth Index, 1837-1915
Name: Douglas John Wyatt
Registration Year: 1909
Registration Quarter: Apr-May-Jun
Registration District: Steyning
Inferred County: Sussex
Volume: 2b
Page: 255


Douglas John Wyatt
in the England & Wales, Civil Registration Death Index, 1916-2007
Name: Douglas John Wyatt
Death Age: 67
Birth Date: 3 Apr 1908
Registration Date: Oct 1975
[Nov 1975]
[Dec 1975]
Registration Quarter: Oct-Nov-Dec
Registration District: Chiltern and Beaconsfield
Inferred County: Buckinghamshire
Volume: 19
Page: 1085

Re your mention of a possible Betty/Betsy -

another total stab in the dark - apart from name and location:

???
Marriages Mar 1934 (>99%)
Blake Alice E Wicks Cuckfield 2b 320
Wicks Charles J Blake Cuckfield 2b 320

There were three children of that marriage in the 1930s, registered in Cuckfield.


Ancestry suggests this is her baptism:

Alice Elizabeth Blake
in the London, England, Church of England Births and Baptisms, 1813-1917
Name: Alice Elizabeth Blake
Baptism Age: 0
Record Type: Baptism
Birth Date: 18 Feb 1917
Baptism Date: 18 Apr 1917
Baptism Place: England, Christ Church, Battersea, Wandsworth
Father: James Blake
Mother: Harriet Ruth Blanche Blake


Probably Alice E in 1939, with three closed records - and maybe DOB a little out:

Alice E Wicks
in the 1939 England and Wales Register
Name: Alice E Wicks
Gender: Female
Marital Status: Married
Birth Date: 17 Mar 1917
Residence Year: 1939
Address: [ Royal George Road on image ]
Residence Place: Burgess Hill, Sussex, England
Occupation: Unpaid Domestic
Line Number: 21
Schedule Number: 275
Sub Schedule Number: 1
Enumeration District: EJCA
Borough: Burgess Hill
Registration district: 76 - 3

[Three closed records with her ]
Charles probably in the forces.

??
Death:

WICKS, ALICE ELIZABETH 34
GRO Reference: 1951 S Quarter in BRIGHTON Volume 05H Page 130


Her husband Charles James Wicks, born 1915 in Lewes, died 2001 in Colchester.

Seems to have remarried in 1965 to BESSIE Mary Barber, who died in Colchester in 2001.

Thank you appreciate the help. Il keep u updated on birth certificate.

Hi. I have my grandad Douglas birth certificate. Mum Florence Emma Wyatt formerly BLAKE. Farther Douglas John Wyatt... residence West Highlands Cuckfield.

Can anyone help get any further info of the parents plz

Father's occupation?

Suggestion ONLY

First name(s) Douglas John
Last name Wyatt
Birth quarter 2
Birth year 1909
Mother's maiden name Wyatt
District Steyning
County Sussex

First name(s) Douglas John
Last name Wyatt
Gender Male
Birth day 3
Birth month 4
Birth year 1908
Age -
Death quarter 4
Death year 1975
District Chiltern & Beaconsfield
County Buckinghamshire

Discrepancy in birth year on death reg'n - but the info is only 'as known'

EDIT

I now see this has already been offered for consideration

Can't read well ...cowman on farm? Of ??? Villa

That's a match for 1939 register posted by AG on 10th March

How can I find that plz ?

Look at posts above dated 10th March

Thank you. Are there any living relatives?

Fmp take on the 1939 register.

98 Sawmill Woodhouse, Rowlands Castle, Petersfield R.D., Hampshire, England

Wyart household
(8 people)
First name(s) Last name(s) DOB Sex Occupation Marital status Schedule Schedule Sub Number
*Douglas Wyart 03 Apr 1909 Male Head Cowman Married 163 1
*Laura E Wyart 30 Aug 1905 Female Unpaid Domestic Duties Married 163 2

The record for this person is officially closed.

*Laurence A Short 14 May 1937 Female Under School Age Single 163 4
Laurence Short 16 May 1921 Male Cowman Single 163 5
-Douglas J Wyatt 30 Apr 1932 Male At School Single 163 3
-Douglas J Wyatt (Wright) 01 May 1905 Male Head Cowman Married 163 1

Looking at the register, there are only 5 people in the household. The last -2 names are not there and the first *3 names have been scored through and corrections put on another page.


So on another page we have Douglas J Wyatt 03/04/09 head cowman, Laura E Wyatt 30 Aug 05 and Douglas J Wyatt 30 Apr 1932 at school.