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Pauline
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28 Dec 2020 19:27 |
THANK YOU SO MUCH EVERYONE FAR MORE THAN I EXPECTED
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ArgyllGran
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27 Dec 2020 17:20 |
Harry's birth (John Harry) posted above.
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ErikaH
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27 Dec 2020 16:19 |
Charlotte says when she married that her 'deceased' father was Charles, a Printer/Compositor
Charles Barkshire Head Married Male 48 1813 Printer Compositor Reading, Berkshire, England Mary Ann Barkshire Wife Married Female 39 1822 Dressmaker Weybridge, Surrey, England Leah Ellen Barkshire Daughter Unmarried Female 11 1850 Scholar Clewer, Berkshire, England Thomas W Barkshire Son Unmarried Male 11 1850 Scholar Clewer, Berkshire, England Catherine Barkshire Daughter Unmarried Female 8 1853 Scholar Clewer, Berkshire, England Louisa Barkshire Daughter Unmarried Female 4 1857 Scholar Reading, Berkshire, England Jane Barkshire Daughter Unmarried Female 2 1859 Scholar Reading, Berkshire, England
Name: Charlotte Barkshire Gender: Female Baptism Date: 8 Apr 1866 Baptism Place: Saint Giles,Reading,Berkshire,England Father: Charles Barkshire Mother: Mary Ann
1871 Name: Charlotte Barkshire Age: 4 Estimated Birth Year: 1867 Relation: Inmate Gender: Female Where born: Chargeable to Reading Reading And Wokingham Disri Court School Civil Parish: Wargrave Town: Wargrave County/Island: Berkshire Country: England Registration District: Wokingham
???Brother
Name: Harry Barkshire Age: 8 Estimated Birth Year: 1863 Relation: Inmate Gender: Male Where born: Chargeable to Reading Civil Parish: Wargrave Town: Wargrave County/Island: Berkshire Country: England Registration District: Wokingham
Name: Charles Berkshire Estimated Birth Year: abt 1812 Registration Year: 1868 Registration Quarter: Apr-May-Jun Age at Death: 56 Registration District: Reading
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ErikaH
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27 Dec 2020 15:57 |
The Barkshire child's birth doesn't fit with the child's age in 1891, or, indeed, in subsequent years. It's too early.
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ErikaH
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27 Dec 2020 15:22 |
No baptism record for Maud on FMP - under any surname
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ArgyllGran
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27 Dec 2020 14:47 |
Pauline -
do you have Robert Reginald 1884's birth cert, to confirm the details, such as father's name?
His brother Lionel was born in Reading in 1886, as already posted, and the family we have followed appears to be the correct one (I think!), even though RR's birthplace is given as Reading in the censuses, and not Christchurch. (1891 says Bournmouth.)
Robert Reginald Fleming in the 1911 England Census Name: Robert Reginald Fleming Age in 1911: 26 Estimated Birth Year: abt 1885 Relation to Head: Servant Gender: Female Birth Place: Christ Church, Hampshire, England Civil Parish: Coulsdon County/Island: Surrey Country: England Street Address: Cane Hill, Lunatic Asylum Coulsdon, Surrey Marital status: Single Occupation: Asylum Attendant Registration District: Croydon Registration District Number: 39 Sub-registration District: Coulsdon ED, institution, or vessel: 10-11 Piece: 3281
Your opening post is rather confusing, because the first sentence is about Robert Reginald (the son), with typo of 1864 as his YOB instead of 1884. Then the rest of your post refers to RR's father, who married Charlotte, but didn't. die in 1901.
" I am looking for the parents of Robert Reginald Fleming born 1864 Christchurch Bournmouth His wife was Charlotte Birkshire He died in 1901 and had a son with the same name"
However - there is no birth of a Robert Reginald in 1864 or thereabouts . The Robert we've found, who married Charlotte, has no middle name at marriage or death, and he seems to have been born c1861, if the 1886 death is the correct one. . The only place he's called Robert Reginald is on his son Lionel's marriage cert in 1914 - but as he died when Lionel was only a few months old (assuming the 1886 death is the correct one), maybe Lionel wasn't sure of his father's correct name, and assumed it would be the same as his brother Robert.
Maud 1889 can't be Robert 1861's daughter, as born 3 years after his death, although she does seem to be Charlotte's.
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Maddie
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27 Dec 2020 13:03 |
full name Maud Lilian Dorothy Last name Fleming Age 40 Birth year 1890 Residence 37 Bath Rd Death year 1930 Burial year 1930 Burial date 31 Jan 1930 Church Henley Rd Cemetery (Caversham) Place Reading County Berkshire
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ArgyllGran
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27 Dec 2020 12:34 |
Still on the trail of Maud Fleming (possibly registered as Barkshire) - she doesn't seem to be the daughter of either of Charlotte's brothers - John Henry (Harry) or Thomas William:
Charlotte Barkshire in the England, Select Births and Christenings, 1538-1975 Name: Charlotte Barkshire Gender: Female Baptism Date: 8 Apr 1866 Baptism Place: Saint Giles,Reading,Berkshire,England Father: Charles Barkshire Mother: Mary Ann FHL Film Number: 1040566
Charles Berkshire in the England & Wales, Civil Registration Death Index, 1837-1915 Name: Charles Berkshire Estimated Birth Year: abt 1812 Registration Year: 1868 Registration Quarter: Apr-May-Jun Age at Death: 56 Registration District: Reading Inferred County: Berkshire Volume: 2c Page: 196
Charlotte Barkshire in the 1871 England Census Name: Charlotte Barkshire Age: 4 Estimated Birth Year: 1867 Relation: Inmate Gender: Female Where born: Chargeable to Reading Civil Parish: Wargrave Town: Wargrave County/Island: Berkshire Country: England Registration District: Wokingham Sub-registration District: Wargrave ED, institution, or vessel: 1 Household Schedule Number: 2 & 3 Piece: 1288 Folio: 7 Page Number: 5 Household Members: Name Age
Harry Barkshire 8 Charlotte Barkshire 4 (and many others)
Address: Reading and Wokingham District School
BARKSHIRE, CHARLOTTE mmn PIKE GRO Reference: 1866 S Quarter in READING Volume 02C Page 333
BARKSHIRE, JOHN HARRY mmn PIKE GRO Reference: 1861 D Quarter in READING Volume 02C Page 327
Marriages Sep 1847 (>99%) Berkshire Charles Strand 1 421 PIKE Mary Ann Strand 1 421
Harry John Barkshire in the England, Select Births and Christenings, 1538-1975 Name: Harry John Barkshire Gender: Male Baptism Date: 8 Apr 1866 Baptism Place: Saint Giles,Reading,Berkshire,England Father: Charles Barkshire Mother: Mary Ann FHL Film Number: 1040566
Maud Lilian 1889 can't be Harry's daughter - he married Isabella Triggs in Plymouth in Apr-Jun qr 1888.
Other siblings of Charlotte:
Charles Barkshire in the 1861 England Census Name: Charles Barkshire Age: 48 Estimated Birth Year: 1813 Relation: Head Spouse's Name: Mary Ann Barkshire Gender: Male Where born: Reading, Berkshire, England Civil Parish: Reading St Lawrence Ecclesiastical parish: Oxford Town: Reading County/Island: Berkshire Country: England Street Address: Occupation: Condition as to marriage: View image Registration District: Reading Sub-registration District: St Lawrence ED, institution, or vessel: 3 Neighbors: Household Schedule Number: 56 Piece: 747 Folio: 53 Page Number: 10 Household Members: Name Age Charles Barkshire 48 Mary Ann Barkshire 39 - Weybridge, Surrey Leah Ellen Barkshire 11 Thomas W Barkshire 16 Catherine Barkshire 8 Louisa Barkshire 4 Jane Barkshire 2 James Richardson 58
Her brother Thomas married Elizabeth Simmonds in Reading in 1877, so Maud's not his child either.
Thomas Barkshire in the 1881 England Census Name: Thomas Barkshire Age: 30 Estimated Birth Year: abt 1851 Relationship to Head: Visitor Gender: Male Where born: Windsor, Berkshire, England Civil Parish: Clewer County/Island: Berkshire Country: England Street Address: Gas House Lane 2 Goswell Place Marital status: Married Education: Employment status: View image Occupation: Shoemaker Registration District: Windsor ED, institution, or vessel: 13 Neighbors: Piece: 1324 Folio: 83 Page Number: 35 Household Members: Name Age Edwin H. Charlton 29 Catherine E. Charlton 28 Elizabeth Charlton 5 Alice Charlton 3 Edwin Charlton 1 Henry Barkshire 20 - visitor, unmarried, journeyman Charlotte Barkshire 15 - visitor, unmarried Thomas Barkshire 30 - visitor, married, shoemaker Elizabeth Barkshire 24 - visitor, married, shoemaker's wife
Elizabeth's death:
Elizabeth Barkshire in the England, Select Deaths and Burials, 1538-1991 Name: Elizabeth Barkshire Gender: Female Age: 44 Birth Date: 1859 Death Date: 15 Nov 1903 Burial Date: 17 Nov 1903 Burial Place: Reading, England FHL Film Number: 1849544 Reference ID: it 7 43425
Thomas Barkshire in the 1911 England Census Name: Thomas Barkshire Age in 1911: 60 Estimated Birth Year: abt 1851 Relation to Head: Father Gender: Male Birth Place: Windsor, Berkshire, England Civil Parish: Caterham County/Island: Surrey Country: England Street Address: 9 London Road, Up Caterham, Surrey Marital status: Widowed Occupation: Painter and Decorator Registration District: Godstone Registration District Number: 38 Sub-registration District: Godstone ED, institution, or vessel: 03 Piece: 3246 Household Members: Name Age Edward Evans 25 - married 2 years Gertrude Evans 21 Gertrude Evans 1 Thomas Barkshire 60 - widowed
Marriages Dec 1908 (>99%) BARKSHIRE Gertrude Jane Godstone 2a 461 EVANS Edward George Godstone 2a 461
But possibly Maud Fleming isn't Maud Barkshire (though it does seem a coincidence), and her birth registration may just have disappeared like Robert 1861's
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Maddie
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27 Dec 2020 11:44 |
his father
Robert Last name Fleming Age 72 Birth year 1817 Residence Friar St Death year 1889 Burial year 1889 Burial date 06 Nov 1889 Church London Rd Cemetery (consecrated) Place Reading County Berkshire Country England
mother Sarah Last name Fleming Age 72 Birth year 1828 Residence 2 Friar St Death year 1900 Burial year 1900 Burial date 04 Sep 1900 Church London Rd Cemetery (consecrated) Place Reading County Berkshire
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ErikaH
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27 Dec 2020 11:08 |
Robert’s burial date was 2nd December 1886. He is in London Road, Cemetery, Reading
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ArgyllGran
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26 Dec 2020 22:28 |
Possible birth of the child Maud L Fleming who is with Sarah in 1891,1901 and 1911???
BARKSHIRE, MAUD LILIAN HISSEY mmn PINFOLD GRO Reference: 1889 S Quarter in READING Volume 02C Page 353
The child is listed as Charlotte's daughter in all the censuses - perhaps Charlotte adopted a niece ??
I don't see a Barkshire/Pinfold marriage anywhere.
Her death??
Deaths Mar 1930 (>99%) Fleming Maud L D 40 Reading 2c 432
Maude Heming in the 1911 England Census Name: Maude Heming Age in 1911: 20 Estimated Birth Year: abt 1891 Relation to Head: Daughter Gender: Female Birth Place: Reading, Berkshire, England Civil Parish: Reading County/Island: Berkshire Country: England Street Address: 15 Connaught Rd, Reading Marital status: Single Occupation: Book Keeper Clerk Registration District: Reading Registration District Number: 121 Sub-registration District: St Mary ED, institution, or vessel: 10 Piece: 6565 Household Members: Name Age Charlotte Heming 41 Maude Heming 20
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ArgyllGran
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26 Dec 2020 18:48 |
Births of the other children in 1871 census - but I can't see Robert's:
FLEMING, SARAH mmn LINNELL GRO Reference: 1864 M Quarter in READING Volume 02C Page 365
FLEMING, LUCY mmn SINNELL GRO Reference: 1867 S Quarter in READING Volume 02C Page 337
FLEMING, WILLIAM mmn LINNELL GRO Reference: 1870 D Quarter in READING Volume 02C Page 335
FLEMING, JAMES mmn SINNELL GRO Reference: 1859 D Quarter in OF READING Volume 02C Page 327
FLEMING, FANNY mmn LINNELL GRO Reference: 1858 J Quarter in READING Volume 02C Page 325
FLEMING, MARY mmn LENNELL GRO Reference: 1856 J Quarter in READING Volume 02C Page 343
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Pauline
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26 Dec 2020 18:39 |
Thats wonderful thank you
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ArgyllGran
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26 Dec 2020 18:36 |
That birth record Shirley posted for Lionel 1884 , with middle name Linnel, proves that the 1871 and 1881 censuses posted above are for the correct family.
The mother Sarah was born in Northamptonshire, per the censuses.
This is Sarah's marriage:
Marriages Sep 1854 (>99%) Fleming Robert Daventry 3b 172 LINNELL Sarah Daventry 3b 172
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Pauline
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26 Dec 2020 18:28 |
Sorry it seems not to be correct My mistake thank you for putting me right
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ArgyllGran
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26 Dec 2020 18:25 |
Robert Fleming in the 1881 England Census Name: Robert Fleming Age: 19 Estimated Birth Year: abt 1862 Relationship to Head: Son Father: Robert Fleming Mother: Sarah Fleming Gender: Male Where born: Reading, Berkshire, England Civil Parish: Saint Lawrence County/Island: Berkshire Country: England Street Address: 3 Friar St Education: Employment status: View image Occupation: Coach Builder Registration District: Reading ED, institution, or vessel: 4 Neighbors: Piece: 1305 Folio: 64 Page Number: 1 Household Members: Name Age Robert Fleming 63 Sarah Fleming 53 Fanny Fleming 22 Robert Fleming 19 Lucy Fleming 13 William Fleming 11 Emily Starey 17
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safc
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26 Dec 2020 18:24 |
Record Transcription: 1881 England, Wales & Scotland Census
3, Friar Street, Reading St Lawrence, Reading, Berkshire, England
Sarah Fleming
Household Members Members that resided in the household at the time of the census. First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Sex Age Birth year Occupation Birth place Robert Fleming Head Married Male 63 1818 Corn Factor & Coach Builder Employing 15 Men & 3 Boys Wokingham, Berkshire, England Sarah Fleming Wife Married Female 53 1828 - Daventry, Northamptonshire, England Fanny Fleming Daughter Single Female 22 1859 Teacher Of Music Reading, Berkshire, England Robert Fleming Son Single Male 19 1862 Coach Builder Reading, Berkshire, England Lucy Fleming Daughter Single Female 13 1868 Scholar Reading, Berkshire, England William Fleming Son Single Male 11 1870 Scholar Reading, Berkshire, England Emily Starey Servant Single Female 17 1864 Servant (Dom) Reading, Berkshire, England
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ArgyllGran
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26 Dec 2020 18:24 |
As Charlotte was a widow in 1891:
?? Robert Fleming in the England & Wales, Civil Registration Death Index, 1837-1915 Name: Robert Fleming Estimated Birth Year: abt 1861 Registration Year: 1886 Registration Quarter: Oct-Nov-Dec Age at Death: 25 Registration District: Reading Inferred County: Berkshire Volume: 2c Page: 222
If that's his death, he has no middle name at either marriage or death.
EDIT: I see now that safc has already posted this death, and it is definitely the right one. EDIT AGAIN: On closer inspection, I'm not sure what safc posted (26 Dec, at 18:18 ). It seems to be an amalgam of marriage, death, and 1871 census.
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safc
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26 Dec 2020 18:21 |
????
Record Transcription: 1871 England, Wales & Scotland Census
Friar Street, St Lawrence, Reading, Berkshire, England
Sarah Fleming
Sarah Fleming
Household Members Members that resided in the household at the time of the census. First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Sex Age Birth year Occupation Birth place Robert Fleming Head - Male 53 1818 - Berkshire, England Sarah Fleming Wife - Female 43 1828 - Northamptonshire, England Mary Fleming Daughter - Female 14 1857 - Berkshire, England Fanny Fleming Daughter - Female 12 1859 - Berkshire, England James Fleming Son - Male 11 1860 - Berkshire, England Robert Fleming Son - Male 9 1862 - Berkshire, England Sarah Fleming Daughter - Female 7 1864 - Berkshire, England Lucy Fleming Daughter - Female 3 1868 - Berkshire, England William Fleming Son - Male 0 1871 - Berkshire, England Hannah Butler Servant - Female 20 1851 - Hampshire, England Eliza Cole Servant - Female 15 1856 - Northamptonshire, England
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ArgyllGran
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26 Dec 2020 18:18 |
Where did you find the info re Robert 1864's birth?
I don't see any record of it.
One tree on Ancestry has him, but with no proof of DOB or birthplace
It claims this is his burial:
London, England, Deaths and Burials, 1813-1980 Name: Robert Fleming Record Type: Death Death Date: 26 Apr 1901 Death Place: Islington, Islington, England Register Type Parish Register
However, that's in a list of deaths in the St John's Road Workhouse, and the man was aged 74, therefore born 1827, and therefore NOT the elusive Robert Reginald 1864.
The death on GRO website: FLEMING, ROBERT 74 GRO Reference: 1901 J Quarter in ISLINGTON Volume 01B Page 122
I hope you're not assuming that info on someone's tree is necessarily correct!
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