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Hello, its me again (sorry). I'm not asking for any research (please don't waste your valuable time on this), but your opinion on the following would be very much appreciated:

I'm trying to help another friend, and have hit a very early brickwall. I have told him he ought to send for his parents' marriage certificate for be sure of his paternal grandfather's name, but so far I haven't been able to persuade him to do so, but I can't stop trying to find answers anyway.

His parents were (according to him) Alfred William Hillier and Violet F Burgess (born 1933), who married in Hastings in January quarter 1954. Violet has been easy to trace back, but not so AWF. All my friend remembers is that his paternal grandparents lived in Hastings Old Town.

A search for AWF birth produced several hits, but none in Hastings. I followed up on the others, but none of them had any connection to Hastings.

He then mentioned an aunt, Nel Peterson. I found a marriage between Florence Ellen Hillier and Arthur Peterson in Hastings 1944, her mmn Kent. Florence May Kent married Thomas Hillier in Hastings, January quarter of 1918. They had 6 children that I have been able to trace, no Alfred William but a William A, born 1927. Florence Ellen was born 1924.

Knowing how first names were switched for some reason, would you think it safe to accept the William A for the Alfred William I am looking for? The Thomas Hillier who married Florence May Kent is fascinating - English parents who went to Canada from Devon in the 1880s, Thomas joined the Canadian Overseas Expeditionary Force, then he and his parents moved to USA and in 1919 took up American citizenship. On his naturalization papers he names his wife as Florence, born and living in Hastings, England. He returned to England later in 1919, and their first child was born in 1920. I have discovered that the Canadian OEF was based in Hastings during WW1.

I am not asking for any research into any of these names, just your opinion as to whether I'm safe in assuming that William A is the Alfred William I'm looking for.

Without the marriage cert to check father's name, yes, I think its a reasonable assumption.

Ancestry thinks so too (not that that's necessarily worth much), and from the birth record it suggests these records:

Alfred William Hillier
in the UK and Ireland, Find A Grave Index, 1300s-Current
Name: Alfred William Hillier
Birth Date: 1927
Death Date: 1997
Cemetery: St Leonard Churchyard
Burial or Cremation Place: Hollington, Hastings Borough, East Sussex, England
Has Bio?: N

Unfortunately his gravestone doesn't give any info re relatives.

Does your friend know his father's birth and death dates?

Rose

Thanks for your prompt reply, I knew I could rely on you. Isn't it awful when you can't be sure, but still can't stop searching?

What do you mean by "Ancestry thinks so too"?

I haven't been able to find death record for Thomas Hillier, dob 30 July 1896 or 1897.

The family in 1939 - no help, as William/Alfred's a closed record:

Florence Hillier
in the 1939 England and Wales Register
Name: Florence Hillier
Gender: Female
Marital status: Married
Birth Date: 5 Dec 1897
Residence Year: 1939
Address: 95
Residence Place: Hastings, Sussex, England
Occupation: Unpaid Domestic Duties
Schedule Number: 106
Sub Schedule Number: 2
Enumeration District: EIAD
Registration district: 69 1
Inferred Spouse: Thomas Hillier
Inferred Children: Thomas Hillier
Household Members:
Name
Thomas Hillier - 30 July 1897
Florence Hillier
Thomas Hillier - 18 Dec 1920
[ Plus 4 closed records ]

Births Mar 1921 (>99%)
Hillier Thomas Kent Hastings 2b 29

Rose, Alfred William died in 1997

ArgyllGran, I've found these, on the assumption that the Thomas/Florence marriage is the correct one. I've based this on the Nel Peterson whom my friend named as his aunt.

When I say "Ancestry thinks so too", I mean that when I look at William A's birth on Ancestry, the death record is shown as a "Suggested Record" in the panel at the right hand side of the page.

Ancestry's suggestions are by no means foolproof, as they often include records of totally different people who happen to have the same or similar names.

However, with the birth year and death place, it seems like a fair guess.

But I'll repeat Rose's question:
"Does your friend know his father's birth and death dates?"

[EDIT: answered already, re death.]

There was an Alfred William Hillier born 1927 in Croydon.
An Alfred William Hillier died in Bury St Edmunds in 1995.

In the 1939 register, they were living at 95 High Street, Hastings, which is in the Old Town. When Thomas returned to England in 1919, on the ship passenger list he gave his address as 97 High Street Hastings.

I followed up on the Croydon one at great length, assuming at first that this was the correct one, but they had no connection at all with Hastings.

If this is the death it doesn't match with the 1927 birth in Hastings:

Name: Alfred William Hillier
Event Type: Death Registration
Registration Quarter: Oct-Nov-Dec
Registration Year: 1995
Registration District: Bury St. Edmunds
County: Suffolk
Event Place: Bury St. Edmunds, Suffolk, England
Birth Date (available after June quarter 1969): 05 Feb 1927
Volume: 7421A
Page: A15D


Rose

This birth was registered in the last quarter of 1927.

Births Dec 1927
Hillier William A Kent Hastings 2b 14

Rose

He definitely died in Hastings

Then this death?


Name: Alfred Hillier
Event Type: Death Registration
Registration Quarter: Jan-Feb-Mar
Registration Year: 1998
Registration District: Hastings & Rother
County: Sussex
Event Place: Hastings & Rother, Sussex, England
Birth Date (available after June quarter 1969): Nov 1927
Volume: 4561A
Page: A63A

Rose

He married as just Alfred too:

Marriages Mar 1954
Burgess Violet F Hillier Hastings 5h 538
HILLIER Alfred BURGESS Hastings 5h 538

Rose

Yes, death already posted.
But doesn't prove that he was (or wasn't) William Alfred at birth.



Re Thomas:

the 1920 incoming travel record gives his age as 24, therefore c1895, but 1939 says 1897.

[Edit: sorry, I meant 1919 - typo error.]

Is this his birth??

Thomas Hellier
in the British Columbia, Canada, Birth Index, 1851-1903
Name: Thomas Hellier
Gender: Male
Birth Date: 30 Jul 1897
Birth Location: Victoria
Registration Number: 1897-09-009022
BCA Number: B13812
GSU Number: 2134882

Yes - he died at the end of 1997, so registered early 1998.

If that's him, he's still Hellier in 1911,if this is the right family:

Thomas Hellier
in the 1911 Census of Canada
Name: Thomas Hellier
Gender: Male
Marital status: Single
Race or Tribe: English
Nationality: Canadian
Age: 13
Birth Date: Jul 1897
Birth Place: British Columbia
Census Year: 1911
Relation to Head of House: Son
Province: British Columbia
District: Nanaimo
District Number: 10
Sub-District: 8 - Saanich
Sub-District Number: 8
Place of Habitation: MT Toluni
Religion: Anglican
Occupation: NG
Other Occupation: NG
Can Read: Yes
Can Write: Yes
Language: E
Family Number: 158
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members:
Name Age
James Hellier 48
Martha Hellier 54
Sarah Hellier 18
Thomas Hellier 13


Parents both born in England.

I didn't find 1920 incoming travel, only 1919, which gives his age as 24, occupation Ship builder.

According to his application for USA citizenship in 1919, his dob is given as 30 July 1896.

They seem to switch easily between Hillier and Hellier. The early records I've found from Devon, before they went to Canada, are mainly Hellier. An obituary for Martha Hellier states that her son Thomas is in England.