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Thanks everyone. Ill send for marriage certificate. Merry Christmas to all.

jen

veline Worner
England and Wales Census, 1901


Name:
Eveline Worner
Event Type:
Census
Event Date:
31 Mar 1901
Event Place:
Curry Rivel, Somerset, England, United Kingdom
County:
Somersetshire
Civil Parish:
Curry Rivell
Ecclesiastical Parish:
Hambridge
Sub-District:
Curry Rivell
Registration District:
Langport
Gender:
Female
Age:
38
Relationship to Head of Household:
Wife
Birth Year (Estimated):
1863
Birthplace:
Droitwich, Worcestershire
Schedule Type:
56
Page Number:
9
Household Role Sex Age Birthplace
Albert Worner Head Male 51 Long Load, Somersetshire
Eveline Worner Wife Female 38 Droitwich, Worcestershire
Ethel Worner Daughter Female 13 Long Load, Somersetshire
Ada Worner Daughter Female 11 Long Load, Somersetshire
Edith Worner Daughter Female 11 Long Load, Somersetshire
Elsie Worner Daughter Female 10 Hambridge, Somersetshire
Albert Worner Son Male 8 Hambridge, Somersetshire
Walter Worner Son Male 6 Hambridge, Somersetshire
Harold Worner Son Male 4 Hambridge, Somersetshire


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Evelyn Worner
England and Wales Census, 1911





Name:
Evelyn Worner
Event Type:
Census
Event Date:
1911
Event Place:
Curry Rivel, Somerset, England, United Kingdom
County:
Somersetshire
Parish:
Curry Rivel
Sub-District:
Langport
Sub-District Number:
2
District Number:
307
Enumeration District:
8
Registration District:
Langport
Gender:
Female
Age:
48
Marital Status:
Widowed
Marital Status (Original):
WIDOW
Number in Family:
7
Birth Year (Estimated):
1863
Birthplace:
Droitwich Ter, Worcestershire
Relationship to Head of Household:
Head
Schedule Type:
57
Page Number:
1
Registration Number:
RG14
Piece/Folio:
113
Affiliate Record Identifier:
GBC/1911/RG14/14336/0113/1
Household Role Sex Age Birthplace
Evelyn Worner Head Female 48 Droitwich Ter, Worcestershire
Maud Worner Daughter Female 25 Long Load, Somersetshire
Elsie Worner Daughter Female 20 Hambridge, Somersetshire
Albert Worner Son Male 18 Hambridge, Somersetshire
Walter Worner Son Male 16 Hambridge, Somersetshire
Harold Worner Son Male 14 Hambridge, Somersetshire
Fredrick Worner Son Male 9 Hambridge, Somersetshire

Photo of Albert and Eveline's gravestone at the bottom of this page:

http://www.maryjane-sue.co.uk/hambridge/ham.w.htm

But the person who added the details to the right of the photo has assumed Eveline's name at marriage was her maiden surname.

Happy New Year Ladies!
I Now have the marriage certificate of Albert Worner aged 35 years a butcher bachelor (son of John Worner deceased) and Eveline Lizzie Medlicott aged 23 (pinster crossed out) widow (daughter of Charles Freeman a brewer.
Eveline has signed her name Eveline Lizzie Freeman (crossed out) Medlicott
Both lived at Martock (no further address details.
On 13th August 1885 at Crist Church Yeovil.
Does this help in finding out where this lady originated from?
regards,
jennifer

No, not so far!

Can't see a Charles Freeman, brewer, in Droitwich area 1861-71

Can't see a Charles Freeman, brewer, born 1837 +/- 10 years, anywhere at all in 1881.

The closest in occupation is a licensed victualler in London, born Cambridgeshire, but he's nowhere near Droitwich or Somerset in any census.


It's possible she didn't know who her father was, and invented one.

Who were the witnesses?

Rose

Hello Rose. The witnesses ere George GEAR and either Henry or Terry VINCENT RODBER.

regards

Jennifer

henrys father was the supt of registers so he probably assisted as a witness

Henry Vincent Rodber was an accountant in 1891 and 1901, though only an apprentice in 1881. In 1911 he was a clerk in Union office.

He didn't marry until 1922, and died in 1933. No children.
I don't think he's related to either Eveline or Albert.

Only posting 1891 as example;

Henry V Rodber
in the 1891 England Census
Name: Henry V Rodber
Gender: Male
Age: 28
Relationship: Brother
Birth Year: 1863
Mother: Matilda H Rodber
Birth Place: Yeovil, Somerset, England
Civil Parish: Yeovil
Ecclesiastical parish: St John
Residence Place: Yeovil, Yeovil, Somerset, England
Registration district: Yeovil
Sub registration district: Yeovil
ED, Institution or Vessel: 2
Neighbors:
Piece: 1898
Folio: 32
Household Members:
Name Age
John E Rodber 38
Martyn V H Rodber 7
Andrey C Rodber 7
Matilda H Rodber 63
Henry V Rodber 28
Lydia Morris 17

George Gear was a gardener - so either a friend, or else someone dragged in to be a witness.

George Gear
in the 1881 England Census
Name: George Gear
Age: 32
Estimated birth year: abt 1849
Relationship to Head: Head
Spouse: Elizabeth Gear
Gender: Male
Where born: E Coker, Somerset, England
Civil Parish: Yeovil
County/Island: Somerset
Country: England
Street address: No 95 Park Street
Marital status: Married
Education:
Employment status:
View image
Occupation: Gardener Domestic Serv
Registration district: Yeovil
ED, institution, or vessel: 7
Neighbors:
Piece: 2393
Folio: 37
Page Number: 8
Household Members:
Name Age
George Gear 32
Elizabeth Gear 33
Alice M. Gear 9
Arthur G. Gear 7
Nellie P. Gear 6
Bessie A. Gear 4
Annie M. Gear

Thanks for that. But we still don't know where the mystery daughter came from and maybe we never will - unless someone else in that tree knows.

The only Charles Freeman born 1842/3 in Droitwich appears on the 1851 census with his family who were salt makers. After that the family disappeared from later census. A I wonder if they went abroad. Unlikely but not impossible.

If that Charles Freeman isn't on the 1861 census, it's unlikely (though not impossible, I suppose - maybe he managed to avoid the census-taker) that he's the father of a child born in 1863.

The tree owner doesn't know anything about Eveline's parents.

ErikaH. I think that could be the one I need. People did juggle their Christian names in those days. I'm sending for that marriage cert to be sure. Thanks for your help.
Regards
Jennifer

Re the Robert Medlicott/Elizabeth Freeman marriage posted by Erika (I assume that's the one you're sending for) -

the banns record says Robert was "of Holy Trinity, Smethwick" and Elizabeth was "of this parish" - ie - Hampton in Arden.

Bachelor and spinster.

I've also hunted for them in 1881 with no luck.

With Smethwick in mind, there's this family in 1871:

Elizabeth Freeman
in the 1871 England Census
Name: Elizabeth Freeman
Age: 8
Estimated birth year: 1863
Relation: Daughter
Gender: Female
Where born: Tipton Staffordshire England
Civil Parish: Harborne
Ecclesiastical parish: St Paul
Town: Smethwick
County/Island: Worcestershire
Country: England
Registration district: Kings Norton
Sub-registration district: Harborne
ED, institution, or vessel: 17
Household schedule number: 83
Piece: 3088
Folio: 65
Page Number: 17
Household Members:
Name Age
Charles Freeman 28 - drayman, railway station.
Margaret Freeman 30
Elizabeth Freeman 8
Margaret Freeman 3
Esther Freeman 1


Draymen were mainly in the pub/brewing trade.


Elizabeth isn't with them in 1881:

Charles Freeman
in the 1881 England Census
Name: Charles Freeman
Age: 39
Estimated birth year: abt 1842
Relationship to Head: Son in Law
Spouse: Margaret Freeman
Gender: Male
Where born: Droitwich, Worcestershire, England
Civil Parish: Sedgley
County/Island: Staffordshire
Country: England
Street address: 109 High St
Marital status: Married
Education:
Employment status:
View image
Occupation: General Labourer Unemployed
Registration district: Dudley
ED, institution, or vessel: 30
Neighbors:
Piece: 2871
Folio: 36
Page Number: 13
Household Members:
Name Age
Job. Hartshorne 68
Mary Hartshorne 62
Jessie Hartshorne 19
Charles Freeman 39
Margaret Freeman 39
Esther Freeman 11
Fanny Freeman 9
George Freeman 7
Ada Freeman 5
Charles Freeman 3
Mary Jane Freeman 1

Maybe saying her father was a brewer was a flight of fancy - sounded better than an unemployed general labourer.

In case that Elizabeth is the right one -

her parents' marriage:

Margaret Hartshorn
in the England, Select Marriages, 1538–1973
Name: Margaret Hartshorn
Gender: Female
Age: 20
Birth Date: 1841
Marriage Date: 1861
Marriage Place: West Bromwich, Stafford, Eng.
Father: Job Hartshorn
Spouse: Charles Freeman
FHL Film Number: 1526219
Reference ID: 2:3QQ0WSH


And therefore Elizabeth's birth:

FREEMAN, ELIZABETH mms HARTSHORN
GRO Reference: 1862 J Quarter in DUDLEY Volume 06C Page 41

Wow. I think you've cracked it! Once the cert arrives it hopefully will confirm the connection. Thanks so much for your time.
Regards
Jen

Wow. I think you've cracked it! Once the cert arrives it hopefully will confirm the connection. Thanks so much for your time.
Regards
Jen

Seems like Robert died soon after the marriage

Deaths Dec 1880
MEDLICOTT Robert 20 Rotherham 9c 335