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ArgyllGran
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1 Mar 2019 12:41 |
A related thread by Julie, about George Perkins, son of Richard and Mary:
https://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards/board/ancestors/thread/1375861
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Julie
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22 Feb 2019 08:57 |
Thanks, I've found the birth of May Foster on the GRO overseas index. Not yet clear exactly when Joseph Foster settled back in the UK permanently, he must have gone back to Chile as there is at least one arrival back to England for him after the record of the family returning in 1903. Whether the family went back after 1903 is again unclear. Still a bit more digging to do.
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ArgyllGran
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21 Feb 2019 22:15 |
Fanny Foster (May's aunt in 1911 census) was Joseph's sister:
Fanny Foster in the England & Wales, Civil Registration Marriage Index, 1837-1915 Name: Fanny Foster Registration Year: 1880 Registration Quarter: Jan-Feb-Mar Registration district: Darlington Inferred County: Durham Volume: 10a Page: 30 Records on Page: Name Henry Bell Fanny Foster
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Julie
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21 Feb 2019 22:15 |
An additional quirk now I've been adding the details to my tree and reviewing the docs again. Ann Perkins/Booth & husband John appear to have adopted a child. Editha Toynbee appearswith them on the 1861 census as a 6 mth old visitor. The 1871 census has Editha Booth 10 yrs old. GRO index shows illegitimate birth of Edith Toynbee Q4 1860. So Mary Ann seems to have followed her mother's example.
Thanks Mary - looks like Ann & John were jumping the gun slightly being recorded as if married.
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ArgyllGran
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21 Feb 2019 22:04 |
As the Fosters arrived back in the UK in 1903 with Ivy and a baby, that baby must have been born in Chile.
The 1911 census says Emma and Joseph had had four children, and all were still alive .
Ivy and May (May per the Ancestry tree) , born in Chile, and then Herbert and Josephine born in Darlington.
Here's May in 1911:
May Foster in the 1911 England Census Name: May Foster Age in 1911: 8 Estimated birth year: abt 1903 Relation to Head: Niece Gender: Female Birth Place: Tocopilla, Chili Civil Parish: Darlington County/Island: Durham Country: England Street address: 21 North Rd Darlington Registration district: Darlington Registration District Number: 543 Sub-registration district: Darlington ED, institution, or vessel: 17 Piece: 29520 Household Members: Name Age Fanny Bell 51 - widow, head, Ryland, Lincs, stationer & sub-postmistress Lilian Jane Bell 28 - single, daughter, Darlington, PO assistant Nellie Taylor 31 - single, Niece, Scotherne Heath, Lincs, domestic servant May Foster 8
May married Albert Brown in Darlington in 1929. Died in Tavistock, 7 Jan 1992.
May Brown in the 1939 England and Wales Register Name: May Brown Gender: Female Marital status: Married Birth Date: 15 Dec 1902 Residence Year: 1939 Address: Queen Alexandra Road "Sea View" Residence Place: Seaham, Durham, England Occupation: Unpaid Domestic Duties Schedule Number: 302 Sub Schedule Number: 2 Enumeration District: FFYO Registration district: 552 - 2 Inferred Spouse: Albert E Brown Inferred Children: Rita S Brown Household Members: Name Albert E Brown May Brown This record is officially closed. Rita S Brown (later Hart) - 16 Oct 1933 [ died Cullompton, Devon, 31/10/2014 ]
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Mary
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21 Feb 2019 19:20 |
1841 N Rauceby page 4 of 7 John Booth 20 shoemaker Ann Booth 25 Next door but one to the Perkins family and daughter Mary Ann.
They married 23/5/1841 according to tree on Ancestry.co.uk
Maryb.
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Julie
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21 Feb 2019 18:46 |
Thanks ArgyllGran, found the familysearch info too. Also found another article, Chile actively encouraged Western Europeans to go out in the 1890's to help with the mining industries,there was also silver mining in the Tocopilla area. There was a "land for labour" incentive, but not everyone stayed long enough to get land. Had found some of the "movement" info listed above. I suspect there are more pieces of the jig-saw to be uncovered, it appears the oldest child Ida Ivy was the only one born in Chile.
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ArgyllGran
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21 Feb 2019 17:47 |
Maybe something to do with this ??
"When saltpeter exportation in Chile was at its highest point, Tocopilla was especially significant as an export point."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tocopilla
"The region was sparsely populated by indigenous Changos and Atacameños until massive Chilean immigration in conjunction with a saltpeter boom in the later 19th century."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antofagasta_Region
Tocopilla is in the Antofagasta region.
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ArgyllGran
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21 Feb 2019 17:39 |
?? this must be Emma going out to marry Joseph:
Mrs Emma Oldfield in the UK, Outward Passenger Lists, 1890-1960 Name: Mrs Emma Oldfield Gender: Female Departure Date: 6 Oct 1898 Port of Departure: Liverpool, England Destination Port: Tocopilla Ship Name: Orissa Master: C Yates Southgate
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ArgyllGran
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21 Feb 2019 17:35 |
Joseph was a boiler-maker and riveter - so I expect they went because of his work.
Joseph travelled to and fro between Chile and the UK a few times, on his own, so presumably work-related:
Mr Jos Foster in the UK, Incoming Passenger Lists, 1878-1960 Name: Mr Jos Foster Arrival Age: 35 Birth Date: abt 1866 Port of Departure: Valparaiso, Chile Arrival Date: 3 Sep 1901 Port of Arrival: Liverpool, England Ports of Voyage: Coronel; Sandy Point; Montevideo; Rio de Janeiro; Bahia; Pernambuco Ship Name: Oropesa Shipping Line: Pacific Steam Navigation Co Official Number: 102192
Mr Joseph Foster in the UK, Incoming Passenger Lists, 1878-1960 Name: Mr Joseph Foster [boilermaker ] Port of Departure: Valparaiso, Chile Arrival Date: 6 Apr 1908 Port of Arrival: Liverpool, England Ports of Voyage: Valparaiso; Rio de Janeiro; Lota; St Vincent; Punta Arenas; Pernambuco; La Pallice; Lisbon and Montevideo Ship Name: Oronsa Shipping Line: The Pacific Steam Navigation Co Official Number: 123986
Here he's with Mrs Foster, Miss Ivy Foster, and a baby:
Joseph Foster in the UK, Incoming Passenger Lists, 1878-1960 Name: Mr Joseph Foster Port of Departure: Valparaiso, Chile Arrival Date: 9 Dec 1903 Port of Arrival: Liverpool, England Ports of Voyage: Lota; Sandy Point; Montevideo; Rio de Janeiro; St Vincent Ship Name: Victoria Shipping Line: Pacific Steam Navigation Co Official Number: 115316
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Julie
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21 Feb 2019 17:06 |
I haven't tracked Mary Ann down in 1861 either, in 1871 mother and daughter were living next door to each other!
I have found evidence to support the Chile marriage of Emma Oldfield and Joseph Foster, it's on familysearch. Her mother is listed as Mary Ann Booth rather than Perkins. The GRO overseas births index also has the birth of Ida Ivy in Chile. Lord knows why they were in Chile!!
The death regn in Stockton is the right one , I found detail on FMP, she's buried at Egglecliffe, the same location s the 1901 census.
All I'm waiting for on Ann and Mary Ann is confirming the death of Ann's mother, have emailed the parish where the burial is likely to have taken place as the PR isn't with Lincoln Archives.
I will follow up on Emma, as I'm intrigued as to why she and John Foster were out in Chile.
Thank you all for your help.
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ArgyllGran
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21 Feb 2019 15:35 |
But I don't see her anywhere in 1861 under any surname - Booth, Perkins, or Oldfield.
Unless this is her with wrong place of birth , and already calling herself Oldfield They married very soon after the census. Probably not, though, as John was in Nottinghamshire in 1861:
Mary Oldfield in the 1861 England Census Name: Mary Oldfield Age: 23 Estimated birth year: 1838 Relation: Servant Gender: Female Where born: Ingham, Lincolnshire, England Civil Parish: Glentworth County/Island: Lincolnshire Country: England Registration district: Gainsborough Sub-registration district: Willingham ED, institution, or vessel: 7 Neighbors: Household schedule number: 61 Piece: 2410 Folio: 102 Page Number: 13 Household Members: Name Age Charles Cross 50 Mary Ann Cross 37 Edward Cross 16 Robert Cross 17 Arthur Cross 13 Mary Oldfield 23 Bessey Chafer 23 Joseph Herrick 48 Christopher Wray 20 :
Or possibly this one:
Mary Ann Peckens in the 1861 England Census Name: Mary Ann Peckens Age: 23 Estimated birth year: 1838 Relation: Servant Gender: Female Where born: Grantham, Lincolnshire, England Civil Parish: Grantham Town: Grantham County/Island: Lincolnshire Country: England Registration district: Grantham Sub-registration district: Grantham ED, institution, or vessel: 3f Neighbors: Household schedule number: 75 Piece: 2350 Folio: 60 Page Number: 12 Household Members: Name Age William Swain 60 Catherine Swain 55 Mary Ann Peckens 23 John Douglass 48 Mary Douglass 48 Luke Brown 66
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Julie
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21 Feb 2019 14:25 |
Have just located the 1871 census page for Mary Ann Oldfield, low and behold she is living next door to John and Ann Booth. Should have followed the advice I gave my fellow family history hunters at my local U3A group about looking at neighbours on census data!
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Julie
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21 Feb 2019 14:07 |
Thanks ArgyllGran, I think you may have tracked Mary Ann down for me. The later "Chile" element is intriguing and surprising.
John & Ann Booth migrated to Yorkshire and indeed are shown in Bradfield in 1871, where John remained after Ann's death. Need to work my way through your info in more detail, but it looks promising.
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ArgyllGran
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21 Feb 2019 13:06 |
The tree says Emma was born 1874 Darlington. She was adopted by John and Mary Ann, per John's Will.
The tree also says she married Joseph Foster in Chile, 18 Nov 1898. No proof offered.
Children: Birth of Daughter Ida Ivy Foster(1900–1979) 07 Feb 1900 • Tocopilla Chile South America
Birth of Daughter May Foster(1902–1992) 15 Dec 1902 • Tocopilla Chile South America
Birth of Son Herbert Oldfield Foster(1904–1965) 7 Apr 1904 • Darlington, Durham, Yorkshire - North Riding, United Kingdom
Ivy Foster in the 1911 England Census Name: Ivy Foster Age in 1911: 11 Estimated birth year: abt 1900 Relation to Head: Daughter Gender: Female Birth Place: Chile, South America Civil Parish: Darlington County/Island: Durham Country: England Street address: 86 Lowson St Harrowgate Hill Darlington Occupation: School Registration district: Darlington Registration District Number: 543 Sub-registration district: Darlington ED, institution, or vessel: 19 Piece: 29522 Household Members: Name Age Joseph Foster 45 Emma Foster 35 - Darlington Ivy Foster 11 Herbert Foster 6 - Darlington Josephine Foster 3 -darlington
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ArgyllGran
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21 Feb 2019 13:03 |
You say Ann married John Booth.
A tree on Ancestry (tree owner: Sharon Hansen ) has a Mary Ann Booth, born 1838 North Rauceby, unknown parents. Married John Oldfield.
I don't know where the tree owner got the name Booth from - proof of her existence is only from censuses after her marriage.
I don't see an Oldfield/Booth marriage.
??
Marriages Dec 1861 (>99%) OLDFIELD John Lincoln 7a 997 Perkins Mary Ann Lincoln 7a 997
Mary Ann Oldfield in the 1871 England Census Name: Mary Ann Oldfield Age: 33 Estimated birth year: abt 1838 Relation: Wife Spouse's name: John Oldfield Gender: Female Where born: North Randley, Lincolnshire, England Civil Parish: Bradfield Ecclesiastical parish: Bolsterstone Town: Bolsterstone County/Island: Yorkshire Country: England Registration district: Wortley Sub-registration district: Bradfield ED, institution, or vessel: 17h Household schedule number: 61 Piece: 4660 Folio: 97 Page Number: 12 Household Members: Name Age John Oldfield 38 Mary Ann Oldfield 33 Price Edward 21
Mary Ann Oldfield in the 1881 England Census Name: Mary Ann Oldfield Age: 42 Estimated birth year: abt 1839 Relationship to Head: Wife Spouse: John Oldfield Gender: Female Where born: North Rauceby, Lincoln, England Civil Parish: Attercliffe cum Darnall County/Island: Yorkshire Country: England Street address: 37 Lord Street Marital status: Married Registration district: Sheffield ED, institution, or vessel: 14 Neighbors: Piece: 4667 Folio: 145 Page Number: 26 Household Members: Name Age John Oldfield 42 Mary Ann Oldfield 42 Annie Freeman 17 - servant
Mary A Oldfield in the 1891 England Census Name: Mary A Oldfield Gender: Female Age: 53 Relationship: Wife Birth Year: 1838 Spouse: John Oldfield Child: Emma Oldfield Birth Place: Rauceby, Lincolnshire, England Civil Parish: Darlington Residence Place: Darlington, Durham, England Sub registration district: Darlington ED, Institution or Vessel: 17 Neighbors: Piece: 4042 Folio: 98 Household Members: Name Age John Oldfield 53 Mary A Oldfield 53 Emma Oldfield 15 - daughter, Durham [Can't see her birth ]
Mary Ann Oldfield in the 1901 England Census Name: Mary Ann Oldfield Age: 62 Estimated birth year: abt 1839 Relation to Head: Wife Gender: Female Spouse: John Oldfield Birth Place: N Civil Parish: Eaglescliffe Ecclesiastical parish: St Mary Town: Eaglescliffe County/Island: Durham Country: England Street address: Occupation: Registration district: Stockton Sub-registration district: Stockton ED, institution, or vessel: 49 Neighbors: Piece: 4628 Folio: 105 Page Number: 1 Household schedule number: 1 Household Members: Name Age John Oldfield 62 Mary Ann Oldfield 62 Joseph Chaplow 22 James Farndale 15 Grace E Hullah 18 Evelyn Ransom 15
??? Deaths Mar 1906 (>99%) Oldfield Mary Ann 68 Stockton 10a 40
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SylviaInCanada
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19 Feb 2019 23:34 |
Definitely NOT that Elizabeth Parkins :-D ............
from Freereg .........
County Lincolnshire Place Louth Church name St James Register type Unspecified Register entry number 305 Burial date 28 Mar 1816 Burial person forename Elizabeth Burial person surname PARKINS Person age 100 <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< Burial person abode Louth Notes Widow <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< Transcribed by Karen Christley Credit Karen Christley File line number 306
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Julie
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19 Feb 2019 23:19 |
I believe I have traced Ann Perkins through to her death. The main piece of the puzzle remaining for Ann is the death of her mother Elizabeth. I suspect her burial is at Osbournby, my next step is I think to see where the burials reg is for that parish is. I know that the Lincoln Archives have not scanned PR's that have been lodged with them in recent years.
I'm signing off for the night now, but can anyone shed any light on what happened to Mary Ann after the 1851 census?
Many thanks for your help so far.
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malyon
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19 Feb 2019 22:51 |
could be elizabeth died there
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rootgatherer
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19 Feb 2019 22:43 |
If it's any help, Edward Coddington was a witness to both the Richard Perkins marriages. It's not unusual for a widower to state "single" at a second marriage. It would depend on how the question was worded.
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