Find Ancestors

Very frustrating this family :-S

Her birth date similarly is all over the place.
1861 says 1835; 1871 says 1839; 1881 says 1835; 1891 census says 1841; 1901 says 1834;

Ah. I see. Just a thought. Was hoping this might explain the difficulty. But you might be on to something with the mcbride surname. :-)

Unless Thomas had more than one wife named Margaret (as someone suggested earlier), it's hard to know where she was born.

1861, 1871 and 1901 say Ireland, 1881 says Liverpool, 1891 says Boston USA.

I don't see any travel record as early as pre-1855 for her.


ADDED:

There's a place called Boston in County Clare.

When I said Mary I really meant Margaret, sorry. Getting confused now with all the m, s. Thought maybe if ages correct on 1891 census ish, then Mary woukd be a bit young to have child in marriage at 14. Unless John not hers or John born out of wedlock. But think you all may have hit on something with the mcbride /macbrad. Wonder if there is a mention of a Mary mcbride travelling from Boston America to Liverpool anywhere? :-)

Hi
Perhaps you are correct in thinking John was born out of wedlock. I notice thst Mary was born in Boston massachussets, so perhaps that helps. John born 1859. Does it say on 1939 census John's date of birth. He died in 1940 I think. Bridget remained unmarried. I had thought maybe Mary and Thomas married in America and came back to Liverpool to have their kids.?, :-S

??? Matches the baptism posted earlier.

DAFFY, BRIDGET -
GRO Reference: 1864 D Quarter in LIVERPOOL Volume 08B Page 148

The name is Duffy on FreeBMD and on the image.

Well, there we go - we have a tiny golden nuggat !! (Thank you AG )

We know the ones I posted from the 1939 are the correct ones as I have this burial detail with John at that address buried with Bridget and also with Margaret Ellen and her daughter:

Grave: A18176 Burnley Cemetery, Burnley, Lancs.
Interments:
Name Age Abode Gender Source Register Date buried
1 John Duffy 84yrs 48 Forfar St M Book 15 #112498 23 Mar 1940
2 Bridget Duffy 85yrs 69 albert Street F Book 16 #122992 18 Mar 1950
3 Margaret Ellen Byrne 82yrs 28 Hunslet Street F Book 16 #129670 22 Jun 1957
4 Margaret Jane Copeman 65yrs Hunslet St F Book 17 #138127 1 Jan 1971
Grave: A18177 Burnley Cemetery, Burnley, Lancs.
Interments:
Name Age Abode Gender Source Register Date buried
1 Bridget Disley 23yrs Victoria Hospital F Book 12 #89504 6 Aug 1921
2 James Byrne 79yrs 18 Layfield Street M Book 13 #102795 19 Dec 1931
3 Thomas Byrne 62yrs Municipal Hospital M Book 14 #110710 13 Oct 1938

Takes a bit of sorting but the info is there.

SO - we now have a new name to follow - Mc Brad or McBride !!!

Dea x

??? Mary Ann ??

DUFFY, MARY mms DUFFY
GRO Reference: 1858 D Quarter in LIVERPOOL Volume 08B Page 119

John, born May 1855 ???


MCBRIDE, JOHN -
GRO Reference: 1855 J Quarter in LIVERPOOL Volume 08B Page 77

Possibly not linked, but will post anyway, in case:

Margarita Duffy
in the Liverpool, England, Catholic Baptisms, 1741-1916
Name: Margarita Duffy
Age: 0
Birth Date: 20 Jul 1869
Baptism Date: 25 Jul 1869
Baptism Place: Holy Cross, Liverpool, Lancashire, England
Father: Thomas Duffy
Mother: Margarita Duffy


Well, not unless they're mucking about with their surnames - which is perfectly possible. It would still match that marriage I posted erlier:


DUFFY, MARGARET mms DUFFY
GRO Reference: 1869 S Quarter in LIVERPOOL Volume 08B Page 95

And Bridget ??


Brigitta Duffy
in the Liverpool, England, Catholic Baptisms, 1741-1916
Name: Brigitta Duffy
[Bridget Duffy]
Age: 0
Birth Date: 25 Dec 1864
Baptism Date: 11 Jan 1865
Baptism Place: Our Lady of Reconciliation de La Salette, Liverpool, Lancashire, England
Father: Thomas Duffy
Mother: Margarita Mcbrad


One of the godparents is Pat. McBrad.

That John who's on the 1939 register:

Joannes Duffy
in the Liverpool, England, Catholic Baptisms, 1741-1916
Name: Joannes Duffy
[John Duffy]
Age: 0
Birth Date: 23 May 1855
Baptism Date: 3 Jun 1855
Baptism Place: Our Lady of Reconciliation de La Salette, Liverpool, Lancashire, England
Father: Maria Duffy [ image says Thomas, I think ]
Mother: Margarita Duffy

Yes ArgyllGran - this family is taking us all over the place !!

I had explored that Bridget who ended up with a Rooney but it didn't fit !!

I am convinced that they used another name entirely and I am not even sure that the 1891 and 1881 we have are even of the same family??

I also decided that Thomas had been attached to 2 different 'Margaret's ?? - but I couldn't prove that either !!!!!!!!!!!! :-| :-| :-|

This 'looks like' the same family in 1861 so they were still calling themselves Duffy on there !!!!!!!!! :


1861 England, Wales & Scotland Census
Lowergate, Clitheroe, Lancashire, England
First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Sex Age Birth year Occupation Birth place
Thomas Duffy Head Married Male 28 1833 Labourer At Cotton Mill Ireland
Margaret Duffy Wife Married Female 26 1835 Drawer At Cotton Mill Ireland
John Duffy Son Unmarried Male 6 1855 Scholar Liverpool, Lancashire, England
Mary Ann Duffy Daughter - Female 4 1857 Scholar Liverpool, Lancashire, England

Can't find a matching mothers maiden name for the John and Mary Ann births (nothing new there then!).

This gives dates of birth for John and Bridget in 1939 - John is a widow and he is living with his sister Bridget who is still single:

Duffy Household (2 People) 48 Forfar Street , Burnley C.B., Lancashire, England
(brother + sister)
First name(s) Last name(s) DOB Occupation
John Duffy 23 May 1855 General Labourer (Retired) - widow
Bridget Duffy 25 Dec 1864 Cotton Rover (Retired) - single

The dates of birth, again, do not help though in finding the registrations and matching mothers maiden names.............

I am sure that I am only one of several people working on this who are going round and round in circles and getting absolutely nowhere - It is most frustrating.

We just have to keep at it and hope that one of us strikes gold sooner or later and it all then fits into place.

Dea x

There's a Bridget Duffy born in Liverpool in 1868, with mms Duffy, who MIGHT be the daughter of the couple whose marriage I posted earlier - Thomas Duffy and Margaret Duffy.

But then there aren't Duffy/Duffy births for the other children.

And 1868 is later than the censuses in the main agree for your Bridget's birth.

And I think this may be the death of that child;

DUFFY, BRIDGET 0
GRO Reference: 1868 S Quarter in LIVERPOOL Volume 08B Page 104

NO!!!

Sorry - ignore the above Rooney family. I've just been confusing myself.

Your Bridget was still at home with her parents in 1901 and 1911, and I see what you mean about the 5-year age discrepancy.

1901 says 1871, but then 1911 is back to 1864.

?? But your Bridget's with her parents and unmarried in 1891 ??

Andrew Rooney
in the England & Wales, Civil Registration Marriage Index, 1837-1915
Name: Andrew Rooney
Registration Year: 1884
Registration Quarter: Jul-Aug-Sep
Registration district: Liverpool
Inferred County: Lancashire
Volume: 8b
Page: 274
Records on Page:
Name
Thomas Burns
Bridget Duffy
Kate Mackin
Andrew Rooney

But this looks like Martin in 1891, so the above MAY be correct after allt.
There's no surname given for him, but also no ditto marks to indicate that he's a Finigan, and also no relationship is given.
He's been fostered out, or a "nurse child", I think.

There's no matching birth of a Martin Finigan or variation of spelling, that I can see.



Martin J
in the 1891 England Census
Name: Martin J
Gender: Male
Age: 1
Birth Year: 1890
Birth Place: Liverpool, Lancashire, England
Civil Parish: Liverpool
Residence Place: Liverpool, Lancashire, England
Sub registration district: St Martin
ED, Institution or Vessel: 14
Neighbors:
Piece: 2900
Folio: 93
Household Members:
Name Age
Marten Finigan 44
Annie Finigan 29
James Finigan 5
William Finigan 4
Martin J 1
James Murphy 22
Elizabeth Murphy 20

EDIT:

No, this (below) may be wrong, as the son Martin was born 1889, whereas your Bridget was still at home with her parents in 1891.

Don't see Martin anywhere in 1891, though.

***

Bridget then seems to have married Andrew Rooney, though I don't see the marriage so far.


Bridget Rooney
in the 1901 England Census
Name: Bridget Rooney
Age: 36
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1865
Relation to Head: Wife
Gender: Female
Spouse: Andrew Rooney
Birth Place: Liverpool, Lancashire, England
Civil Parish: Liverpool
Ecclesiastical parish: St Albans
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England
Street address:
Registration district: Liverpool
Sub-registration district: St Martin
ED, institution, or vessel: 21
Neighbors:
Piece: 3410
Folio: 111
Page Number: 9
Household schedule number: 64
Household Members:
Name Age
Andrew Rooney 44
Bridget Rooney 36
Martin J Rooney 11
Elizabeth Rooney 9
Andrew Rooney 6
Agnes Rooney 3
Catherine Rooney 1

MMS for all the children is Duffy.


Martinus Josephus Rooney
in the Liverpool, England, Catholic Baptisms, 1741-1916
Name: Martinus Josephus Rooney
Age: 0
Birth Date: 13 Sep 1889
Baptism Date: 20 Sep 1889
Baptism Place: Our Lady of Reconciliation de La Salette, Liverpool, Lancashire, England
Father: Androae Rooney
Mother: Brigidae Duffy

Yes -
1871, 1881, 1891 all say Liverpool.


If it wasn't for that I might have considered this birth - but the names are all very common, so I'm not suggesting it's correct:

Bridget Duffy
in the Ireland, Select Births and Baptisms, 1620-1911
Name: Bridget Duffy
Gender: Female
Birth Date: 14 May 1865
Birth Place: Ratoath, Meath, Ireland
Father: Thomas Duffy
Mother: Margaret Kelly
FHL Film Number: 101106

Bridget's birth year only varies by 2 years in the censuses - 1865 or 1867.