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Hi I am trying to find some family details for an Elizabeth Russell
father James Russell mother Jane Kyle records I have census records 1891 and 1901 showing Elizabeth born in Shotts or Holytown Lanarkshire

Lizzie first married David Allan 1882 in Glasgow both parents are shown there father given has Occ Mason's labourer deceased.
and when David died 1891 she married Andrew Baxter in Leven, Fife same parents named there. father Occ Coalminer deceased
On the first marriage she's aged as 25 years and the second marriage she is given aged 30 years. I have both certs

I cannot find Elizabeth's birth record or birth and marriage details for both of her parents
regards
Ian

Strange extra note on both marriage certs she is shown as a spinster?

For our reference:

Lizzie Baxter
in the 1901 Scotland Census
Name: Lizzie Baxter
Age: 40
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1861
Relationship: Wife
Spouse's name : Andrew Baxter
Gender: Female
Where born: Holytown, Lanarkshire
Registration Number: 483
Registration district: Kilsyth
Civil Parish: Kilsyth
County: Stirlingshire
Address: Banknock Rows
ED: 15A
Household schedule number: 50
LINE: 25
Roll: CSSCT1901_160
Household Members:
Name Age
Andrew Baxter 40
Lizzie Baxter 40
Thomas Baxter 17
Mary Baxter 5
Andrew Baxter 6


Elizabeth Allan
in the 1891 Scotland Census
Name: Elizabeth Allan
Age: 31
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1860
Relationship: Head
Gender: Female
Where born: Shotts, Lanarkshire
Registration Number: 644/11
Registration district: Hutchesontown
Civil Parish: Glasgow Govan
County: Lanarkshire
Address: 157 Waddell Street
ED: 62
Household schedule number: 70
LINE: 13
Roll: CSSCT1891_287
Household Members:
Name Age
Elizabeth Allan 31
Thomas Allan 7
Jane Whitehill 28


There's such a wide range of possible YOBs for her - you say c1865, the censuses above say 1860-61, the first marriage you quote says 1857, the second says 1862.

Two different people with the same name and same parents?????????

Not impossible!

Hi thank you for your kind help
Yes there is quite a wide range of possible birth dates for Elizabeth
and yes could be two different Elizabeth's with same named parents but I feel it not likely.

Ian

There were 7 Elizabeth Russells born in Holytown 1855-70 - all born between 1863 and 1868.
And three born in Shotts in the same period, born 1855, 1857, and 1869.

You can buy credits on ScotlandsPeople to view the certs - I imagine you know that, having researched her marriages.
Unfortunately, as you will also know, it's impossible to tell which, if any, might be her, without looking at the certs.

Like you, I can't see her parents' marriage.


Re being "spinster" on both marriages, maybe when she married the second time, she was asked if she was married or not, she said she wasn't (because she was a widow), and the registrar assumed she was a spinster ?

Have you found her on censuses earlier than 1891?

???

Elizabeth Russall
in the 1871 Scotland Census
Name: Elizabeth Russall
[Elizabeth Russell]
Age: 4
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1867
Relationship: Grandaughter (Granddaughter)
Gender: Female
Where born: Shotts, Lanark
Registration Number: 626B
Registration district: Calderhead
Civil Parish: Shotts
County: Lanarkshire
Address: 37 ??
ED: 4
Household schedule number: 42
LINE: 12
Roll: CSSCT1871_119
Household Members:
Name Age
Thomas Russall 64
Rachel Russall 63
Hugh Russall 25
King Russall 11
Elizabeth Russall 4


EDIT:

Another possibility:

Elizabeth Russelle
in the 1871 Scotland Census
Name: Elizabeth Russelle
Age: 3
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1868
Relationship: Daughter
Father's name: James Russelle
Mother's name: Greene Russelle
Gender: Female
Where born: Holytown, Lanarkshire
Registration Number: 625/2
Registration district: Holytown
Civil Parish: Bothwell
County: Lanarkshire
Address: Yateside Buldings
ED: 10
Household schedule number: 123
LINE: 13
Roll: CSSCT1871_118
Household Members:
Name Age
James Russelle 31
Greene Russelle 23 (maybe mistranscription of Jean ?)
Elizabeth Russelle 3
David Russelle 12 Mo
William McLullie 20



In spite of there being so many Elizabeth Russels born around the right time, there are very few claiming Shotts or Holytown as birthplace in 1871 census.

Hi
I have viewed most if not all births for Elizabeth Russell none with said marriage parents.

Ian

????


1881 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
Main Street, Carnwath, Lanarkshire, Scotland

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Household Members
First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Sex Age Birth year Birth place Occupation
Jane Russell Head Widow Female 48 1833 Carluke, Lanarkshire, Scotland Ag Lab
Transcription
Lizzie Russell Daughter Unmarried Female 20 1861 Carluke, Lanarkshire, Scotland Domestic Serv
Transcription
Maggie Russell Daughter Unmarried Female 17 1864 Lanark, Lanarkshire, Scotland House Keeper

Hi,
Re the Russelle family in 1871 census
I have come across a marriage for James Russell and Jane McLuckie I see there is a McLuckie in the census report

Ian

1871 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
Gateside Buildings, Bothwell, Holytown, Lanarkshire, Scotland

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Household Members
First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Sex Age Birth year Occupation Birth place
James Russell Head Married Male 31 1840 Coal Miner Bothwell, Lanarkshire, Scotland
Transcription
Jane Russell Wife Married Female 23 1848 - Coatbridge, Lanarkshire, Scotland
Transcription
Elizabeth Russell Daughter - Female 3 1868 - Holytown, Lanarkshire, Scotland
Transcription
David Russell Son - Male 0 1871 - Holytown, Lanarkshire, Scotland
Transcription
William McLuckie Lodger Unmarried Male 20 1851 Coal Miner Ayrshire, Scotland

Hi
I have checked and viewed births for above Elizabeth and David Russell
Parents for both are James Russell and Jane McLuckie they married 12/4/1867 Holytown
So not the Jane Kyle I am looking for.

Ian

Have you looked for Jane Kyle in earlier censuses?

Based solely on location

1861 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
Glasgow and Edinburgh Turnpike Road, Bothwell, Holytown, Lanarkshire, Scotland

William Bryden Head Unmarried Male 46 1815 Wine And Spirit Merchant Muirkirk, Ayrshire, Scotland Transcription
Elizabeth Symington Servant Unmarried Female 26 1835 Domestic Serv Dalrymple, Ayrshire, Scotland Transcription
Jane Kyle Servant Unmarried Female 17 1844 Domestic Serv Strathaven, Lanarkshire, Scotland

1851 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
Green Street, Avondale, Middle Ward, Lanarkshire, Scotland

David Kyle Head Married Male 32 1819 Shoemaker Strathaven, Lanarkshire, Scotland Transcription
Jean Kyle Wife Married Female 29 1822 - Lanarkshire, Scotland Transcription
Jane Kyle Daughter - Female 8 1843 Scholar Strathaven, Lanarkshire, Scotland Transcription
Margaret Kyle Daughter - Female 6 1845 - Strathaven, Lanarkshire, Scotland Transcription

Following on from ErikaH's post, I think the above Jane Kyle married William Mather in 1864. Need to check if he died and she remarried

1871 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
Waterside Row (James Gibbs Land), 2, Avondale, Lanarkshire, Scotland

William Mather Head Married Male 28 1843 Tailor & Clothier Glasgow, Lanarkshire, Scotland
Jean Mather Wife Married Female 28 1843 Housekeeper Strathaven, Lanarkshire, Scotland
Jean W Mather Daughter - Female 5 1866 - Glassford, Lanarkshire, Scotland
Elizabeth G Mather Daughter - Female 4 1867 - Strathaven, Lanarkshire, Scotland
Margaret Mather Daughter - Female 2 1869 - Strathaven, Lanarkshire, Scotland
Agnes Mather Daughter - Female 0 1871 - Strathaven, Lanarkshire, Scotland
John Mather Brother Unmarried Male 17 1854 Tailor (Journeyman) Glassford, Lanarkshire, Scotland

Ian, have you checked the address from the 1882 marriage to see if Elizabeth was living there in 1881 please?

Does either marriage note that either of her parents were deceased please?

Can you tell us the witnesses to her marriages please?

Do you have Elizabeth's death certificate please?

Could this be your Elizabeth in 1881 please.

1881 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
182, Main Street, Barony, Bridgeton, Lanarkshire, Scotland

Thomas Coulter Head Married Male 39 1842 Bridgeton, Lanarkshire, Scotland Tinsmith & Gas Fitter
Jane Coulter Wife Married Female 34 1847 Glasgow, Lanarkshire, Scotland -
Ellen Coulter Daughter - Female 8 1873 Glasgow, Lanarkshire, Scotland Scholar
Thomas Coulter Son - Male 3 1878 Glasgow, Lanarkshire, Scotland -
John Coulter Son - Male 1 1880 Glasgow, Lanarkshire, Scotland -
Elizabeth Russell Servant Unmarried Female 22 1859 New Monkland, Lanarkshire, Scotland Genl Serv Domestic

Hi
Lizzie Russell first marriage to David Allan 24/11/1882 Glasgow both living at 82 John Street. Bridgeton, Glasgow. Lizzie was a Domestic Witnesses Thomas Allan & Mary Dick
Second marriage to Andrew Baxter 31/12/1991 Leven, Fife both living at 79 Carlow or Caslow Place, Leven Lizzie was again Domestic Servant Witnesses Andrew McCallum & Jessie McKenzie
On both Certs parents for Lizzie are James Russell and Jane Kyle

Ian

Hi
I cannot find a death cert for Andrew Baxter or his wife Lizzie Russell
I have all the certs for their children. they all lived and died in Stirlingshire.

regards
ian

Have you looked for Lizzie and Andrew on the 1911 census? If so, where were they living at that time?