Find Ancestors

Once again, I would like to thank you all for your time and effort. Not all the dates fit but some could her siblings. I appreciate your help a lot, especially since you have cited references from places I did not know about to check. The greatest obstacle remains finding the marriage of Robert Ambrose and Mary Ann Pape and a link between them and Elizabeth Ambrose in any of the censuses. I am sure that there must be a name listed incorrectly somewhere. Thank you very, very much all.

Thank you Chris. I feel sure that the first entry you found must be Elizabeth Ambrose's brother. The other bit about the marraiges is puzzling though because Mary Ann Pape is not listed, not even with a different surname. How can that be? I am beginning to wonder if there might be a mistake in the records. I have already found a mistake relating to one of Elizabeth's children - her name on his birth cert was listed as Andrews instead of Ambrose. When i sent all my evidence to GRO, they agreed that there was a mistake at the time of registration and although they could not change it, they agreed to enter a notation to this effect. Beginning to wonder if something like that has happened here.

ooh good find Chris :-)

?...

Chris :)

Baptism
Day Month 23-Jun
Year 1861
Parish Or Reg District Lostwithiel
Forename Robert George
Surname AMBERS
Father Forename Robert
Mother Forename Mary Ann
Residence Plymouth
Father Rank Profession Plate Layer

http://www.cornwall-opc-database.org/search-database/

(if below)

(although looking at Marriage/Baptisms Find My Past, on all, Robert is a Carpenter, Baptsms, Abode 23 Clarence Street) (Marriage, 17 Ham Street, his Father, Robert Ambrose occ. Carpenter)

Birth
AMBROSE, ROBERT GEORGE (DAVEY)
GRO Reference: 1859 D Quarter in PLYMOUTH Volume 05B Page 236


Marriages Dec 1856 (>99%)
----------------------------------------------------
Ambrose Robert Plymouth 5b 443
BURT Elizabeth Plymouth 5b 443
Davey Eliza Plymouth 5b 443
FORD John Clarke Plymouth 5b 443
Rich Eliza Tavistock 5b 443


Birth
AMBROSE, FREDERICK CHARLES (DAVEY)
GRO Reference: 1861 D Quarter in PLYMOUTH Volume 05B Page 225

Birth
AMBROSE, WILLIAM HENRY (DAVEY)
GRO Reference: 1858 M Quarter in PLYMOUTH Volume 05B Page 331

Birth
AMBROSE, LOUISA EMMA (DAVEY)
GRO Reference: 1863 S Quarter in PLYMOUTH Volume 05B Page 224

I have the marriage cert of Nicholas James Davis and Elizabeth Ann Ambrose in 1887 (these are my great grandparents) showing Elizabeth aged 22, daughter of Robert Ambrose, Railway plate layer.
I also have a birth cert for Elizabeth Ann Ambrose but I am not 100% sure it's the right one. Logically it seems to be, as it shows the birthdate as 19 Sept 1865, making her the right age to be married at 22 in 1887, also showing father's name as Robert, Railway Labourer. Mother is listed as Mary Ann Pape. Address is 28Adelaide St, Penzance. But I have unable to find a marriage between Robert Ambrose and Mary Ann Pape and the Listing of Penzance ,Cornwall is confusing me as I seem to remember a nearly identical entry somewhere showing the registration of Elizabeth Ann's birth in Penzance, Devon. Looking at the map of the locality, Penzance is too far from Plymouth, Devon for the boundaries to be fudged. ( I live in Malta so not that familiar with UK localities, but my dad's side of the family are from Plymouth, Devon)

Another thing is that Robert obviously died between 1865 and 1877, probably before 1871 as I can not find him and his daughter Elizabeth listed in the 1871 census. This would give me more proof of her lineage.

Is it possible that Robert and Mary Ann Pape did not actually marry and she just took his name? (How frustrating would that be?!)

My particular interest in this branch of my ancestry is that I am really hoping to obtain a photo of Elizabeth. We have a photo of Nicholas but not of her. The more I can find out about her side of the family, the higher the chance of finding a descendant of hers who might have a photo.

Once again, I thank you all very much for your help. I have checked out the info given but none of it is definite - even on the census entries of people who might have been Elizabeth's siblings, she does not appear listed with them.

What am I missing?

Mmmm! Getting better ...........

Elizabeth Ann Ambrose birth reg Q4 1865 Penzance RD mmn Pape
Elizabeth Ann Ambrose marries 1887 Father Robert Ambrose

Mary Elizabeth Ambrose baptised Penzance, Father Robert, Mother Mary Ann
Not seeing a GRO entry for a Mary Elizabeth Ambrose apart from one in Bangor (Wales) with mmn Parry

Andrea - where did you get the name May (or Mary?) Ann Pape from?

Does below fit anywhere? (apologies if already added)

Chris :)

Baptism
Day Month 03-Nov
Year 1865
Parish Or Reg District Madron, Penzance Chapelry
Forename Mary Elizabeth
Surname AMBROSE
Sex dau
Father Forename Robert
Mother Forename Mary Ann
Residence Adelaide Street
Father Rank Profession Labourer


(for Newspaper reference)

Burial
Day Month 14-Mar
Year 1866
Parish Or Reg District Madron, Penzance Chapelry
Forename William Henry
Surname AMBROSE
Age 2
Residence Adelaide Street
Notes
Transcriber Notes Src: Register of Churchyard & Consecrated part of Burial Board Cemetery

http://www.cornwall-opc-database.org/search-database/

(from above link)

But can't find Robert with a Mary Ann and can't find Elizabeth Ann or Mary Ann Ambrose mmn Pape between Birth and marriage nor Emma after her birth apart from 1891 with Elizabeth

and Elizabeth's death

England & Wales deaths 1837-2007 Transcription

First name(s) ELIZABETH
Last name AMBROSE
Gender Female
Birth day -
Birth month -
Birth year 1837
Age 52
Death quarter 4
Death year 1889
District Plymouth
County Devon
Volume 5B
Page 159

By 1891 Robert (although a little older than usual ) is shown as a Widower

1891 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
Sir Frances Drake, Camden Street, Plymouth, Devon, England

First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Gender Age Birth year Occupation Birth place
Henry Harding Head Married Male 56 1835 Publican Devon, England
Mary J Harding Wife Married Female 59 1832 - Devon, England
Sarah L Lloyd Sister In Law Widow Female 54 1837 Living On Her Own Means Devon, England
Sarah M Lloyd Niece Single Female 27 1864 Milliner Devon, England
John Palmer Boarder Widower Male 50 1841 Pensioner Devon, England
Robert Ambrose Boarder Widower Male 62 1829 Carpenter Devon, England

England & Wales marriages 1837-2005 Transcription

First name(s) ROBERT
Last name AMBROSE
Marriage quarter 1
Marriage year 1877
Registration month -
MarriageFinder™ ROBERT AMBROSE married
Elizabeth Gill
District Plympton
District number -
County Devon
Country England
Volume 5B
Page 347

------------------------------------
Devon Marriages Transcription

First name(s) Robert
Last name Ambrose
Age -
Birth year -
Marriage year 1877
Marriage date 27 Feb 1877
Denomination Anglican
Place Pennycross, St Pancras
Father's first name(s) Robert
Father's last name Ambrose
Spouse's first name(s) Elizabeth
Spouse's last name Gill
Spouse's father's first name(s) Nathaniel
Spouse's father's last name Gill
County Devon
Archive Plymouth & West Devon Record Office

Image shows Robert as a Widower, a Builder by trade and of the parish of Charles, Plymouth. Father Robert a Builder.

Elizabeth is Spinster of Weston Mill, Pennycross, daughter of Nathaniel Gill a Seaman

Witnesses Richard and Ann Doidge

Does the plot thicken??

Robert Ambrose marries Eliza Davey 1856. Eliza dies 1876.

The 1881 and 1891 for Robert haven't been posted as yet -

1881 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
Elm Road Manna, Compton-Gifford, Plympton St Mary, Devon, England

First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Gender Age Birth year Occupation Birth place
Robert Ambrose Head Married Male 48 1833 Carpenter Plymouth, Devon, England
Elizabeth Ambrose Wife Married Female 43 1838 - Plymouth, Devon, England
Fredrick C Ambrose Son Single Male 19 1862 None Plymouth, Devon, England
Louisa E Ambrose Daughter Single Female 17 1864 - Plymouth, Devon, England
Laura M Ambrose Daughter Single Female 11 1870 - Plymouth, Devon, England

Right Robert with 3 of the children from his marriage to Eliza Davey but his wife is Elizabeth

Devon Cemetery Burials 1848-1974 Transcription
Print transcription
First name(s) Mary Ann
Last name Ambrose
Age 74
Birth year 1797
Residence 11 Chester Place Plymouth
Home parish St Andrew
Death year 1871
Burial year 1871
Burial date 23 Dec 1871
Parish Ford Park Cemetery
Place Plymouth, Ford Park Cemetery
Denomination General
Grave type Common
Memorial reference Section AH, No.4, Row 23
County Devon
Country England
Document reference 2595/9
Repository Plymouth & West Devon Record Office
--------------------------------------------

Devon Cemetery Burials 1848-1974 Transcription
Print transcription
First name(s) Robert
Last name Ambrose
Age 72
Birth year 1799
Residence 14 Clifton Street Ply
Home parish Charles
Death year 1871
Burial year 1871
Burial date 13 Aug 1871
Parish Ford Park Cemetery
Place Plymouth, Ford Park Cemetery
Denomination Church
Grave type Common
Memorial reference Section AH, No.33, Row 5
County Devon
Country England
Document reference 1015/8
Repository Plymouth & West Devon Record Office
Record set Devon Burials

Many thanks again all for the comprehensive info you have provided. I am going to spend the next few hours going through it all. :-)

A platelayer (British English) or trackman (American English) is a railway employee whose job is to inspect and maintain the permanent way of a railway installation.[1] The term "platelayer" derives from the plates used to build plateways, an early form of railway.[

did he change occupation ????

have checked these records but no result
All UK, Railway Employment Records, 1833-1956 results for Robert Ambrose

As well as the death for a William in Penzance there is also this one in Exeter, though I am not seeing a birth?

AMBROSE, WILLIAM HENRY 2 Order
GRO Reference: 1866 M Quarter in PENZANCE Volume 05C Page 258

AMBROSE, WILLIAM HENRY 2 Order
GRO Reference: 1869 S Quarter in EXETER Volume 05B Page 75

Has anyone found Emma on the 1881 census?

Hi Lesley, I don't use this site for records, but if you go to "Search" at top of page, click on it and then on "Search records", then "Births .Marriages, Deaths" you should see a long list of records available which include all the Parish records. Hope that helps.

Thank you also Austin Q

Dear NYX, GreyGhost and Maddie, Thank you soooo much for the very comprehensive info! A lot of it is spot on for the Davis side - I have all the certificates - for the Ambrose side you have provided me with info I have not been able to find/verify myself. So very grateful.
Do you think that "Joiner and House Carpenter Journeyman" may be roughly the same as "Railway Plate layer"?
One more question please - I have subscribed to the Platinum membership and paid for access to Parish Records but cannot find how to access these and Genes have not replied to my email about it yet. How do I access them? Very frustrating!
Many thanks again. I am overwhelmed with your help! :-)

The Cornish Telegraph - Wednesday 14 March 1866

Deaths:
At Adelaide Street, in this town on the 10th inst,. Wm. Henry, son of Robert Ambrose, aged 2 years