Find Ancestors

Ronald ......

this is the link to the GRO website ..............

http://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/

You have to register, but it is free to do so.

Just follow the instructions. Do not give too much ............. what you ask for must be EXACTLY what is on the certificate, if it differs even slightly they will not send the certificate (although they will refund your money).

You will be asked if you have the GRO Reference Number ................. just tick Yes. That number is the sequence of 2 numbers at the end of the freebmd entry

For example, in the marriage of James, the GRO reference number is 6b 121 ...........

Marriages Jun 1894

Gaffnay James Newcastle L. 6b 121


In this case, I would ask ONLY for the marriage certificate for James, without adding Ann's name.

The Freebmd entries do not include the other spouse's surname until mid-1911, and there is always the faint possibility that the bride might not be who you expect!!!


The cost of £9.25 includes postage and handling .............. even when you live overseas.

You can order copy certificates online from the GRO. They cost £9.25 each including postage.

Wow, so much info you have discovered, thank you once again. I have managed to get into the freebmd site, and the information given is of course all ´transcribed´, how does one get to see original copies of births/marriages/death certificates?, or is this a no no ? if so, is it possible to obtain copies of BMD certificates, to whom does one request them and pay for them. In the early 70`s my family and I were travelling by train from my posting in N.Ireland to London, one suitcase was stolen en route, it contained all our birth certs & marriage cert. I went to Somerset House, and was helped by friendly staff who aided my own search of the large volumes, they then copied the relevant certs for which I paid a small fee. I understand that Somerset House no longer exists, and dont know where records are now held, but wherever it is, would I be allowed to have copies of the originals?

Incidentally, I think Daniel Brindley was the Brindley child that died

I think these are his birth and death records from Freebmd

Births Jun 1881 (>99%)
BRINDLEY Daniel Newcastle L. 6b 85

Deaths Dec 1883 (>99%)
BRINDLEY Daniel 2 Newcastle L. 6b 52

Ronald ...............

do not put the information on KeepSafe, it is for memories, and photos, but people have lost information posted on there

Do not leave on here, threads may disappear. And GR itself may also disappear

You must put it onto your own home computer.

The easiest and quickest way is to copy and paste it into a word file.

I don't know what system you have, I have Microsoft.

But set up a new word document that you label something like "family history", "from GR" ............. ie, some title that lets YOU know what the document contains.

To copy and paste this thread or information from this thread ...................

Place the mouse cursor at the beginning or end of the piece that you want to copy.

Click the left, and holding your finger steady move the mouse cursor over the whole piece that you want to copy. It will turn blue.

Remove your finger from the left "clicker".

Look at the very top of your monitor, there should be a tab labelled Edit

Open that, and you should see a list of functions, one of which will be Copy and another Paste.

Click on COPY

Now open your ne document on your home computer, place the mouse cursor where you want to paste the information

Open the Edit tab again, and click on PASTE

What you copied should now appear where you want it to be.

Save it


You can clean up what you have copied over by deleting any extraneous material that is unnecessary ...... but make sure that you save after every step.


You should also think about getting what they call an external hard drive so that you can save any important documents in another place in case you have problems with your computer. Ask your computer "guru" for help with that.



.......... and don't worry about being a senior citizen "for many years". There are many of us well over 70, and quite a few over 80 ...... and most of us have taught ourselves how to do these things :-) So we do understand.

I had an advantage in that I did use a computer for the last 15/20 years of my working life, but I didn't use the internet until I was 63/64, after I had retired, so I have had to teach myself that aspect.

Thank you so much for the information that you have gathered, the picture is now so much clearer, as it seems my great granmother - Ann, was married twice, and that my grandfather was born before she married Brindley, Ann was later widowed, and then married James Gaffney. Am I on the right track? Can I put all the information that is being provided through your efforts into ´keepsafe´ or is ´keepsafe´only for records and information that I find for myself. Or is it safe leaving it in ´threads´? Wish I could make progress through the freebmd site, I am most grateful for all the advice and research that has, thus far, been provided by so many, never imagined I would become an apprentice again, being a ´senior citizen´for many years!

A similar thing to what happened to your grandfather happened to Ann's first child ..........

The 1881 Census shows Arthur Brindley born ca 1873, Audley, Staffordshire

But William Brindley and Ann Bosson did not marry until 1875

There is no child Arthur Brindley registered on Freebmd at the correct time

BUT there is an Arthur Bosson ...........

Births Sep 1872 (>99%)
BOSSON Arthur Newcastle L. 6b 88


Newcastle L = Newcastle under Lyme, and is the Registration District that includes Audley.



I cannot find an Ann Bosson on the censuses, so I don't know whether Bosson is her maiden name or whether she had also been married to someone before marrying William Brindley

This is probably William Brindley in 1871 ..........living in Boon Hill with his mother and stepfather, but a Widower. He was much older than Ann Bosson.

1871 Census

Name: William Brindley
Age: 39
Estimated birth year: abt 1832
Relation: Stepson
Mother's name: Hannah Cartledge
Gender: Male
Where born: Audley, Staffordshire, England
Civil Parish: Audley
Ecclesiastical parish: Audley
Town: Bignall End
County/Island: Staffordshire
Country: England
Registration district: Newcastle Under Lyme
Sub-registration district: Audley
ED, institution, or vessel: 6
Household schedule number: 177
Piece: 2836
Folio: 20
Page Number: 33

Philip Cartledge 66
Hannah Cartledge 69
William Brindley 39 Widower,Coal Miner

Address:- Boon Hill


He married Eliza Charlesworth ........

Marriages Dec 1857 (>99%)

Brindley William Leek 6b 375
Charlesworth Eliza Leek 6b 375

and they had at least 1 child, Hannah (according to a Public Family Tree on Ancestry)

The actual image of the 1911 Census is quite confusing, with lots of crossings out and corrections.

One of the changes involves the number of children born, still living and died.

This information was supposed to be entered for the wife, and was usually though not always taken to be the number of children born to her.

I've seen some entries where the wife had more children than could be found for that marriage ..... and it turned out that she had been married before and had children from both marriages. I've also seen other entries where the wife seems to ignore the children from a previous marriage, and only lists the number born in the current marriage.

The latter is what seems to apply in this case ............

......... the number of children born to Ann has been changed from 6 with 5 still living and 1 died to 2 born, 2 still living and none died


She had 6 children with William Brindley, as shown in the 1881 Census

Name Age
William Brindley 49 b.ca 1832, Audley, Staffordshire, Colliery Lamp Cleaner
Ann Brindley 27 b.ca 1854, Keele, Staffordshire
Arthur Brindley 8 b.ca 1873, Audley, Scholar
Alfred Brindley 4 b.ca 1877, Audley, Scholar
Frank Brindley 2 b.ca 1879, Audley
Daniel Brindley 0 b.ca 1881, Audley <<<<< 2 weeks old on the image

Address:- Boon Hill

If James was born to Ann Brindley before she married James Gaffney but after her husband William Brindley had died, then any baby would be registered as Bridnley ............ Brindley was her legal name at that point, and a child is registered in that name unless a statement otherwise is made at the time.

Plus it was (???still is) assumed that the child of any married woman would be the child of her husband even if he had been dead for years. The longest time interval between death of a husband and birth of a child credited to him that I have found so far was 10 years.

However, he would be raised and known as Gaffney, after his (apparent) stepfather.

It is quite possible that James was indeed Gaffney's son born before they married .......... but it would be impossible to prove that now without confirmatory DNA evidence from living descendants of both families..



I would think that Alfred Brindley in the 1901 Census is probably Ann's son from her marriage to William Brindley, even though he is shown as Boarder!

This is really easy to find on Freebmd. I wish I knew why you are having problems! Did you click on the link I gave you above?

Marriages Jun 1914 (>99%)
GAFFNEY James Robinson Rotherham 9c 1295
Robinson Evelyn Gaffney Rotherham 9c 1295

Well, my supposition is this:

Ann married William Brindley.
She had various children with William (you can see them 1881 & 1891 above).
He died 1890
She then had James 1894, after this she married James Gaffney.

You might consider getting the birth cert for James Brindley, to check who is put as father (if anyone).

The spelling variations aren't relevant, names were often just recorded as spoken. It doesn't mean another line in the family.

If I had to guess, I would say this is there marriage::

Marriages Mar 1875 (>99%)
BOSSON Ann Newcastle L. 6b 71
BRINDLEY William Newcastle L. 6b 71
Foster George Newcastle L. 6b 71
LUNT Elizabeth Newcastle L. 6b 71


1871

Name: Ann Bossons
Age: 17
Estimated birth year: abt 1854
Relation: Servant
Gender: Female
Where born: Madeley, Staffordshire, England
Civil Parish: Knowle End
County/Island: Staffordshire
Country: England
Registration district: Newcastle Under Lyme
Sub-registration district: Audley

John Bibby 66
Mary Bibby 62
Annie Bibby 37
John W Bibby 33
Ann Bossons 17
Thomas Atkinson 30
Daniel Devenport 33

Thanks again, looks like your info confirms that which I have, but to answer your Qs; My grandfather married Evelyn Robinson, don`t know the year or seen a record of it, yet. Got the year of birth of my grandfather from 1911 census,listed as James Gaffney,age 17 which back dated gives 1894. Reason I reckon am tracking the right Gaffney is that the boarder Alfred Brindley is listed in the same household in the 1911 census, plus my grandmother on her deathbed told my grandfather that he was a Brindley not a Gaffney.
I note also from transcription that my great grandparents James and Ann were married 1894, same year as my grandfather was born. I have tried to access 1901 census to see what is listed, but am still having problems of accessing the free BMD site! The other bit of info I have, my father told me many years ago that he was born and lived at Dalton Brook, nr Rotheram,Yorks, and again cannot access the site to confirm his BC details. You mention - from the 1901 census - of Gaffeney, is this a typo ? if not, could be another line of Gaffneys, (there are about 8 variants in spelling)!! Am now wondering if my great grandmother Ann was married previously to a Brindley, and widowed, then married my great grandfather same year as my grand father was born??, gosh, tis getting complicated.

Deaths Sep 1890 (>99%)
Brindley William 59 Newcastle L. 6b 46

1881

Name: Ann Brindley
Age: 27
Estimated birth year: abt 1854
Relationship to Head: Wife
Spouse: William Brindley
Gender: Female
Where born: Keele, Staffordshire, England
Civil Parish: Audley
County/Island: Staffordshire
Country: England
Street address: Boon Hill
Marital Status: Married

Registration district: Newcastle Under Lyme

William Brindley 49
Ann Brindley 27
Arthur Brindley 8
Alfred Brindley 4
Frank Brindley 2
Daniel Brindley 0

I think this might be the answer. Ann was a widow 1891, so James was not her late husband's son. So whose was he?

I am guessing she registered the birth as Brindley, as she hadn't yet married James Gaffney?

Births Mar 1894 (>99%)
Brindley James Newcastle L. 6b 82

1891

Name: Annie Brindley
Age: 37
Estimated birth year: abt 1854
Relation: Head
Gender: Female
Where born: Madeley, Staffordshire, England
Civil Parish: Audley
Ecclesiastical parish: Audley
Town: Boon Hill
County/Island: Staffordshire
Country: England

Registration district: Newcastle Under Lyme

Annie Brindley 37
Arthur Brindley 18
Alfred Brindley 14
Frank Brindley 12

Looks like James' mother Ann was a Brindley.

Marriages Jun 1894
Brindley Ann Newcastle L. 6b 121
Dutton Hannah Newcastle L. 6b 121
Gaffnay James Newcastle L. 6b 121
Walker John Newcastle L. 6b 121

Looks like the James above, with mother Ann 1901.

1901

Name: James Gaffeney
Age: 7
Estimated birth year: abt 1894
Relation to Head: Son
Gender: Male
Father: James Gaffeney
Mother: Ann Gaffeney
Birth Place: Audley, Staffordshire, England
Civil Parish: Audley
Search Photos: Search for 'Audley' in the UK City, Town and Village Photos collection
Ecclesiastical parish: Audley St James
Town: Bonehill
County/Island: Staffordshire
Country: England

Registration district: Newcastle under Lyme
Sub-registration district: Audley
ED, institution, or vessel: 06

James Gaffeney 44
Ann Gaffeney 45
James Gaffeney 7
Mary M Gaffeney 5

I am guessing this might be the 1911 you are referring to? Not sure how it relates tho.


Name: James Gaffney
Age in 1911: 59
Estimated birth year: abt 1852
Relation to Head: Head
Gender: Male
Birth Place: Mayo, Ireland
Civil Parish: Dalton
Search Photos: Search for 'Dalton' in the UK City, Town and Village Photos collection
County/Island: Yorkshire-West Riding
Country: England
Street address: 55 Norwood St Dalton Brook Nr Rotherham
Marital Status: Married
Occupation: Scavenger
Registration district: Rotherham
Registration District Number: 511
Sub-registration district: South East Rotherham
ED, institution, or vessel: 21
Piece: 28063
Household Members:
Name Age
James Gaffney 59
Alfred Brindley 34 Birth Place: Boon Hill, Staffordshire, England
Ann Gaffney 58
Gainey Gaffney 17 READS JAMES Boon Hill, Staffordshire, England
Mary Ann Gaffney 15

Ronald has been having problems with Freebmd, so I offered to help him. His reply is as below.

The standard advice is to start with what you know for certain. So, to start with, who did your grandfather marry, and do you have the birth cert?

Can I ask a daft question? How do you know where your grandfather was born if you don't have his birth record?

I can't see the 1911 census you mention, please could you give a bit more detail? e.g. your great-grandfather's name (how do you know that?) & where living. Thanks.

'Details are - James Gaffney, year 1894, place of registering, Boon Hill, Staffordshire. Info from my late cousin (died last year, Australia), was that my great grandfater was BRINDLEY, and that my great grandmother was not allowed to marry him, and that when she did marry my great grandfather he then started using the family name. In the 1911 census there is a boarder named BRINDLEY under my great grandfathers name, (he is listed as Irish).'

Thanks for the tip, I guessed I had made a mistake, silly me, still learning. Are you in Canada?, I am in Valencia, Spain, been here 20 yrs.