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John Edward was in the Royal Navy

UK, Royal Navy Registers of Seamen's Services, 1853-1928

Name: John Edward James Winkworth
Gender: Male
Birth Date: 1 Aug 1899
Birth Place: Batham London
Service number: K44853
First Service Date: 7 Aug 1917
First Ship Served On: Pembroke II
Last Service Date: 17 May 1919
Last Ship Served On: Prince George

from image:-

Occupation:- Labourer
Joined for the duration of the Hositlities
Height:- 5' 7½"
Hair:- Light Brown
Eyes:- Blue

I'm trying to find the Winkworth children, now orphaned, in the 1911 Census. Difficult!!

I think this is Daisy as a Visitor

1911 Census

Name Age
Elizabeth Allen 49 Laundress
Florence Allen 19 Laundress (Callendars Hand)
Maud Allen 14
John James Allen 10
Grace Allen 8
Elizabeth Horman 22 Laundress (Starcher)
Dasey Winkworth 17 Laundress (Callendars Machinist) <<<< image actually says (Collar Machinist)



???????????

Name: James Winkworth
Age in 1911: 11
Estimated birth year: abt 1900
Relation to Head: Inmate
Gender: Male
Civil Parish: Penge
Search Photos: Search for 'Penge' in the UK City, Town and Village Photos collection
County/Island: Surrey
Country: England
Street address: Work House, North Surrey District School Anerley Road, Anerley S E
Registration district: Croydon
Registration District Number: 39
Sub-registration district: Penge
ED, institution, or vessel: 16
Piece: 3420

This was a huge school for both boys and giris, paupers form several areas in London. It was what they called an Industrial School where the children were trained for various occupations.


I cannot find Margaret Charlotte :-S

????????????

Did John O'Brien die???

If so, is this possible for Margaret in 1939 possible?????

1939 Register

First name(s) Last name(s) DOB Occupation
Margaret Corkett (O'Brien) 23 Nov 1892 Officer Cleaner Widow
Sorry, this record is officially closed. Check if you can open a closed record.
Sorry, this record is officially closed. Check if you can open a closed record.
Victor John O'Brien 01 May 1924 Married Unemployed Leather Worker Seeking Work


The change of name for Margaret indicates that she was O'Brien when the Register was taken but that she married a Mr Corkett sometime after 1939



England & Wales marriages 1837-2008

First name(s) MARGARET M
Last name O'BRIEN
Marriage quarter 4
Marriage year 1942
Registration month -
MarriageFinder™ MARGARET M O'BRIEN married
THOMAS A CORKETT
Spouse's last name CORKETT
District THURROCK
District number -
County Essex
Country England
Volume 4A
Page 1433
Record set England & Wales marriages 1837-2008
Category Life Events (BDMs)
Subcategory Marriages & divorces
Collections from United Kingdom



Victor John O'Brien died 1990.

I cannot find a birth registration for him ????

Going back to "bomb RFA" -

looking at the image, I think it says "bombr RFA".

Bomb, or bombr, should stand for bombardier.

From this link:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bombardier_%28rank%29

"Bombardier (Bdr) and lance-bombardier (LBdr or L/Bdr) are used by the British Army in the Royal Artillery and Royal Horse Artillery. . . . . . "Bomb" is widely used as an informal form of address for both full bombardiers and lance-bombardiers. "


Only trouble is, the RFA (Royal Fleet Auxiliary as suggested on page 1) doesn't seem to have had bombardiers.

If it had been RHA (Royal Horse Artillery) - which did have bombardiers - that could fit with the John O'Brien born Bansha, Co Tipperary in the 1911 posted on 21st March @ 18:56.

I wonder if the registrar wrote RFA instead of RHA??

On the other hand, the Midleton, Cork suggestion might fit better with the John O'Brien from "Berihram", Cork, who was a fusilier.
I've no idea what "Berihram" is a garbled version of - can't make out anything more sensible from the image of 1911 census.

Re the 2nd Dublin Fusiliers:
Upon the conclusion of the war, the 2nd Battalion returned to the UK, being based in Buttevant, Cork, Ireland. It left for Aldershot, England in 1910, where it received its new Colours from the Regiment's Colonel-in-Chief the following year. It remained in England until war began in 1914.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_Dublin_Fusiliers

However, the RDF doesn't seem to have had bombardiers either.

This is the thread from 2007

http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards/board/ancestors/thread/718837

"Hi, i'm trying to find my dad's grandfather and his family in Ireland but dont know where to begin? All i know is he was born around 1892 in Middleton County Cork, and his name was John O'Brien (on his marriage certificate) although family members have referred to him as Patrick John O'Brien. He was in the Royal Horse Artillery, and i've been told he went A.W.O.L from the british army to fight in the Irish civil war? His father was also John O'Brien and a farmer, who was still living in 1920 when he got married in England to my dad's granny, Margaret Winkworth. "

1991 3,Longfield Road Ealing
Edward Bowman 1859 Nottingham.
Margaret Charlotte lucy May Duckworth age 18 born Lambeth? Housemaid

When viewing original it says Winkworth not Duckworth.

Maryb

In view of the info from the 2007 thread, as posted by RR above - I wonder if this is relevant??


Patrick O'Brien
in the 1911 England Census
Name: Patrick O'Brien <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Age in 1911: 23
Estimated birth year: abt 1888
Birth Place: Midleton, Cork, Ireland <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Civil Parish: China and East Indies
County/Island: Royal Navy
Country: England
Marital Status: Single
Registration District Number: 640
ED, institution, or vessel: Vessels
Piece: 34972

The same man:


Patrick O'Brien
in the UK, Royal Navy Registers of Seamen's Services, 1853-1928
Name: Patrick O'Brien
Gender: Male
Birth Date: 16 Jun 1887
Birth Place: Midleton Cork
Service number: 310827
First Service Date: 22 Aug 1906
First Ship Served On: Vivid II
Last Service Date: 18 Jul 1919
Last Ship Served On: Attentive II

RFA also stands for Royal Field Artillery, which was the forerunner of Royal Artillery, and they did have bombardiers.

https://www.forces-war-records.co.uk/units/5000/royal-field-artillery/

http://1914-1918.invisionzone.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=27373

On the offchance, if you google

"List of Irish Volunteers Cork Corps - Cork City and County ..."

http://www.corkarchives.ie/

PDF giving names , there are a lot of O'Briens listed, so no indication of age etc.

It is worth googling perhaps "Patrick John O'brien Cork Irish Volunteers" there are various sites that cover volunteers etc

just want to thank everyone who has put in the time and effort to help me find this family ..some of it is coming together now .Margaret winkworth and her family ..still struggling to find the right john Obrien ..but I have been given some irish leads on here so I will be checking them out
many thanks ..