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I'd wait and see what his birth certificate says- hopefully it'll give you some answers. Please keep us updated! :)

Someone on ancestry has a photocopy of the Emma Price/ Thomas Start marriage certificate:

Date: Nov 28th 1861
Thomas Start of full age, Bachelor, book keeper of St. John's Oadby, Leicestershire
Father: John Start, Shoemaker

Emma Price of full age, Spinster of St. John's Oadby, Leicestershire
Father:Joseph Price, Farmer

Witnesses: John Richard Cain & Sarah ??? Ball

I did find this when 'mooching around' - It may well have no connection but I will post it just in case:

Births Jun 1857 (>99%)
Taylor Elizabeth Start Nottingham

Could it be the Elizabeth Taylor witness at that wedding?

Dea x

This appears to be Thomas Start on 1861:


1861 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
5, Stamford Street, St Margarets, Leicester, Leicestershire, England

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Household Members
First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Gender Age Birth year Occupation Birth place
John Start Head Married Male 57 1804 Shoemaker Shepshed, Leicestershire, England
Sarah Start Wife Married Female 54 1807 - Derby, Derbyshire, England
Thomas Start Son Unmarried Male 23 1838 Hosiery Warehouseman Shepshed, Leicestershire, England
Edwin S Start Son Unmarried Male 17 1844 Frame Smith Shepshed, Leicestershire, England
George Jackson Boarder Unmarried Male 22 1839 Plumber Loughborough, Leicestershire, England
William Benoon Boarder Unmarried Male 18 1843 Shoemaker Loughborough, Leicestershire, England
Sarah Wykes Boarder Unmarried Female 36 1825 Dressmaker London, Middlesex, England



It looks like he was recorded twice (not unusual!) as here he is with Emma and her family:

1861 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
Oadby Lodge, London Road, Oadby, Blaby, Leicestershire, England

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Household Members
First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Gender Age Birth year Occupation Birth place
Joseph Price Head Married Male 55 1806 Farmer 58 Acres 1 Man 1 Boy Mountsorrel, Leicestershire, England
Mary S Price Wife Married Female 43 1818 - Sibbertoft, Northamptonshire, England
Emma Price Daughter Unmarried Female 20 1841 Farmers Daughter Oadby, Leicestershire, England
Joseph E Price Son Unmarried Male 16 1845 Farmers Son Oadby, Leicestershire, England
Walter Price Son Unmarried Male 14 1847 Farmers Son Oadby, Leicestershire, England
Agnes M Price Daughter Unmarried Female 12 1849 Scholar Oadby, Leicestershire, England
Anne S Price Daughter Unmarried Female 10 1851 Scholar Oadby, Leicestershire, England
Alfred S Price Son Unmarried Male 6 1855 Scholar Oadby, Leicestershire, England
Naomi A Price Daughter Unmarried Female 4 1857 Scholar Oadby, Leicestershire, England
Morley E Price Son Unmarried Male 1 1860 - Oadby, Leicestershire, England
Thomas Start Visitor Unmarried Male 23 1838 ... Leicestershire, England (Hosiery Servant, born Sheepshed)


Dea x

If Thomas and Emma married in 1861, and didn't have any children with them in 1871, perhaps they couldn't have children?

Maybe Albert's mother was Elizabeth Taylor and she had the baby for them? I'll be interested to see the details of his birth certificate- it's driving me a bit potty trying to think how he got the surname Taylor!

Do you know Austin - I was thinking the very same thing !!

It does seem strange that he was born 12 years after they married !

I am desperate to see the details from that birth cert.......

I have followed Thomas Start right the way back and can find no connection to the name Taylor!

Dea x

1871 the Wart /Start couple were at no 7,at number 9 was a Robert Taylor a policeman age 26 and married to Emma 26.

Maryb.

I happen to have the Leicester baptism's

lo and behold

Albert Harry Andrew Start Taylor bp 2nd March 1873 at St. John Devine
to Fanny Maria Taylor

had a preliminary look for her -- nothing firm no - Marriage or death
for her 1873 to 1881 -- did try Frances Maria as well

so another person in the mix

Mavis ;-) ;-)

Well done Mavis !!!!!

Hang on - I am sure I have seen her somewhere, though I have seen so many Taylors that I haven't a clue where ;-)

I will see if I can retrace my steps !! - ( I may be some time ;-) :-D :-D :-D).

Dea x

Wow, that's fabulous Mavis!

I had a quick look, couldn't see anything obvious for Fanny. I did see a death in Leicester 1878 for a 26 yr old Fanny Taylor. Papers record the death just as Miss Fanny Taylor, 26, of Palmerston Street.

I'll have another look later. I don't suppose there's an address for her on that baptism Mavis?

No no addresses just an index

did look for her - but to no avail

Mavis

OK, still nothing on Fanny, but closing in!

On Emma's marriage to George Dibben witnesses were Henry Thomas Pratt & Elizabeth Taylor. Emma gives her address as Summer Lane- she was staying with the witnesses- here they are in 1881 (note Elizabeth was born Leicester):

1881:

128 SUmmer Lane, Birmingham
Henry T Pratt, head, 36, Jeweller, Middlesex London
Mary Ann Pratt, wife 36, attends shop, Birmingham

129 Summer Lane, Birmingham
Elizabeth Taylor, Head, 46 married, Mistress Buterer?? (one man), Leicester, Newton Harcourt
Hannah Bland, mother, 73, Nottingham
Annie M Bland, neice, 8, scholar, Leicester

I read that 1881 as '.Mistress Butcher' Austin ??

I suppose as in 'Master Butcher' only a woman?

Dea x

Haha! Yes, I think you're right, it does say Butcher, and her husband Charles was a butcher, so makes sense.

I was thinking what a mistress buterer was and if I should get one ;)

I think you might well treat yourself to a 'Mistress Buterer' when (and IF) we manage to sort this family out !! - It sounds like a 'nice way to go' !! ;-) :-D :-D :-D

Dea x

Wow good work folks!

For Fanny have you looked for Frances?

My great grandmother married as Fanny Cox (I jest not :-) ) but she was born Frances Jane and died Frances Jane.

Elizabeth is betwixt and between...not old enough to be Albert's mother but seemingly too old to be his sister ;-) ;-) ;-)

Jude

I dont know if this is relevant for the searching for Edna Chapman as we
hav'nt had any luck in finding her this could be why.


if you insert into a census just Chapman born 1875 + 10y Mansfield Nottinghamshire. -- I have found that some of the Chapmans found are
fairground / travellers / gypsies -- people who move about a lot .

I have been trying for awhile to trace families of travellers / gypsies connected
to a member of my family -- they don't marry always but usually baptise their children -- but not always where they state they were born -- finding them on Census can be hard. they can also change 1st names and Surnames - if parents not married children can be known under mothers maiden name -- we had a Matilda but she was known as Esther -- this was mainly through 1800's

Mavis
:-) :-)

There are four Edna Chapman births matching in Cornwall/Devon..............

Jude

Thanks everyone for keeping the search x I'll post details as soon as the certificate appears :)

No cert yet then -- or does it take a long time to reach you ??

Mavis :-) ;-) :-) ;-)

Hello it arrived today.... Drum roll.....

Albert Harry Andrew start
Born 21 Jan 1873 @ 19 Stanford street
Mother: fanny Maria Taylor a saleswoman in a shop
No father registered
Residence 94 Chatham street Leicester
Registered birth in March 1873