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Karen, if he was in the ROYAL Navy, then I guess this isn't him as it's Merchant Navy?

Merchant Seamen
First name(s) WILLIAM
Last name Morton

Birth year 1902
Birth place South Shields
Birth county Durham

Place SOUTH SHIELDS
Discharge number R 44341
Identity certificate number ­
Card type CR1
Date range 1921­1941
Series BT349

The card is dated 1928 so that, I suppose, would exclude it if he was in the RN 1921 to 1941.

For the record, it appears that the card was signed in Tenbury? Shame, as the signature on it would have been useful for comparing to that on any marriage certificate.

This man was 5' 7'' tall, fair complexion, brown hair, blue eyes.

There are two separate William's merchant navy records on FMP - this is the more likely of the two.

First name(s) WILLIAM
Last name Morton
Age -
Birth year 1902
Birth day -
Birth month -
Birth place South Shields
Birth county Durham
Place SOUTH SHIELDS
Discharge number R 44341
Identity certificate number -
Card type CR1
Date range 1921-1941
Series BT349
Piece number -
Record set Merchant Navy Seamen
Category Education & work
Record collection Merchant navy & maritime
Collections from Great Britain

Do you have this?

I wouldn't be too worried about Thomas not being shown as deceased on a marriage certificate - seems often to have been hit or miss (I have several where the father IS shown as deceased when he wasn't!!) But yes I would agree that "Weaver" doesn't compute whatsoever with either of them! If Jean was registered "on time" then only that Halifax birth fits for her IF Jean was her registered name.

The Battye marriage is on Ancestry....

That Halifax birth may be worth a punt just to discount it!

Jude

Snap MC! :-)

Jude

I realise a brick wall is frustrating but so is finding multiple threads with exactly the same answers being researched separately and in vain over the last few days...

http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards/board/ancestors/thread/1314446

http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards/board/living_relatives/thread/1325080

http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=646690.0

I hope you do manage to break down this brick wall but please use one thread and add to it rather than create new identical threads!

Jude

Sorry, my error. Yes it was Merchant Navy and the record you show for William Morton (R44341) IS the correct one.

I too have often wondered if Jean was in fact her first name, but I do have several photos - ALL stating Jean, and at various stages from being a 4 month old baby through to about 5 years old. I think it would be VERY strange to put Jean aged 4 months old, if her first name was something else - (but hey, who knows?).

Thanks, I never even gave it a thought about comparing the signatures. I'm going to get the certificate out later and do a comparison.

SO SORRY - Even though I've been researching for quite a long while now, I'm quite new to this Community bit. Wasn't aware that I was starting a new "thread" each time. Can someone point me in the right direction as to what I am doing wrong please. I thought I just had to add my reply.

No I wasn't too worried that it DIDN'T show that William's dad Thomas was deceased, as like you, I have found differences in this before. However, the "Weaver" bit and the groom's age, just DIDN'T fit.

I will certainly send for the certificate for Jean born in Halifax and the appropriate marriage certificate - (if only to rule it all out).

Thanks so much for all the help - and also the links.

Regards
karen

I have a number of photos of someone called "Maureen" when in fact her name was Olive. It's very common for someone to be known by an abbreviated version of their first name or by their middle name.

Karen,

Rather than start a new thread by "add a topic"

Go to My Threads, and select My Threads Started in the blurb above the threads.

This will then bring up all your threads...and then if you reply on one of them it will bring the old thread up in the boards datewise. I'll send you the image of the Merchant Navy card though it doesn't actually show much more than is transcribed.

Unless one of those certificates is a match, I really think your best hope of ever sorting this is to find Jean marrying (she is possibly still alive). But if she was actually Jean Morton, it is a very common name where marriages are concerned and it's a bit like searching for a needle in a haystack.

Jude

Using the local index at South Tyneside Register Office
http://www.southtyneside.info/applications/2/registersearch/

Jean MORTON
Register: 32
Entry: 170
District: SS/Jarrow.C

George MORTON
Register: 33
Entry: 370
District: SS/Jarrow.C

Hannah Moore Morton's (née Corbett) death was rego'ed in Newcastle Jul 1987

No BMD cert from the GRO has any original signatures on it - they're all copies.
The register's that were signed by B or D informants are at the local registery office that now holds the Registers - South Tyneside in the case of S Shields/Jarrow.

http://www.northtyneside.gov.uk/marriage-register.shtml?p_subjectCategory=592
MORTON, Thomas
TROUSDALE, Mabel
Marriage date: 1902
Register Book, Entry Number: W69, 61

I think W is a registrar's rego - I looked at Morton marrs 1880-1909, and there's more than a dozen there, but no entry # exceeded 200, unlike church registers. So the register Thomas and Mabel signed is with the N Tyneside local office - church registers that the couple actually signed are usually deposited in some local archive. and viewable there. There are some images of NE marr rego's and banns books online via GR/FMP (FS only has images of the church's own backup copy - the Bishop's Transcripts).

I don't know what local offices have the capability of scanning their rego's, and displaying that scan on a BND.cert - mostly they employ copyists to produce their certs.

Thanks for the info and the links.

I live in Hertfordshire, so have no chance of visiting the records offices in Tyneside, but thanks for the info anyway.

Regards
Karen

Have you discounted this one?

Births Mar 1934 (>99%)

Morton Jean Pratt Auckland 10a 353


Marriages Jun 1934 (>99%)
Morton Henry Pratt Auckland 10a 491 Margaret E Pratt

It may be that William had married before and was not divorced? My own grandfather used false first name when he bigamously remarried.

Just to clarify re William Morton's b.cert - if his name is William Morton, then only William will appear in col 2. The surname is assumed to be that of the father & mother if they're the same, and the mother if no father is named. There's no assumption as to which surname the child will use if both parents are named, and their surnames differ - and the GRO index will index the b.cert under both surnames (pointing at the same b.cert).

If your b.cert says William Morton in col 2, then his name would normally be considered to be William Morton Morton..- just have a look at other pre-1969 b.certs.

there is a william morton marriage in 1932 scotland to a maud
you will need scotlands people to view which is pay per view

http://www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk

there is also a jean morton born 1934

safc has posted a possible Scottish marriage on other thread which looks possible and I have advised Karen how to find her threads.

It's always possible that a child or mother is known by a 'pet' name...my auntie Kathleen ( as per census) was always known as 'MIck' ( I have no idea why!) but even then her actual name was not Kathleen on birth reg, it was Catherine :-S

Just had a peep on Scotlands People at the marriage - he was William Hugh (she Maud Christina Noble) so probably not the correct marriage?

The marriage and birth Rose posted look fitting....waited to give birth before marrying :-)

Jude

????

MORTON WILLIAM M 1903 1957 1957 Deaths & burials Hammersmith, London, England

This is probably that 1957 death Jacqueline?

NAME: William Murray Morton
PROBATE DATE: 7 Jan 1958
DEATH DATE: 16 Dec 1957
DEATH PLACE: London, England
REGISTRY: London, England

Jude

At least it rules it out................thanks

Thanks to you all for your help, and I'm SO sorry if I've annoyed some of you by not really knowing what I was doing with the threads etc.

Just to confirm. Yes I do have William Morton's birth certificate, and in the second column it does ONLY say William, and under the surname it does just say Morton. So unless he was given a middle name at time of baptism (if indeed there was one), then I haven't found it.

I got quite excited when one of you mentioned the marriage and birth in Scotland, but then that was ruled out.

I have wedding photos, and have searched and searched pictures of churches in the area William came from (South Shields) and surrounding areas, but of course they usually married where the bride came from, and obviously I don't know where she came from.

I too, have thought along the lines that she may have been married before, or that even her name of "Maud" was a nickname. The few family members I have been able to ask, only knew her as Maud, so no clues there either.

My nan (William's sister) moved down from South Shields to the Hertfordshire area where I am living, some time in the 1940's I think, but as I think I said previously, William was in the Merchant Navy, and one of my aunties has said that she doesn't know for sure, but she seemed to remember that William and his family "MAY" have move to Wales. I know that on one of his Naval records, one of the "stamps" does mention Cardiff, so that could be correct.

Thomas Morton and Mabel Trousdale mentioned above IS correct, they are William and my nan's parents.

The Hannah Moore Corbett sounded promising, but she married a George T Morton, so again ruled out.

I'm going to send for a few certificates of "possibles" and see what happens. I'll keep you posted, and thanks again for all your help.

Regards
Karen

Karen, nobody is annoyed but it helps to have everything on one thread (this one, now, I would suggest) - if nothing else for your own convenience.

Get Jean's birth Halifax - this will either rule in or rule out and you can take it from there. If it were to be her, it will then give you a guide to who "Maud" was.

I know you want "everything at once" but don't waste money on any of the other possibles until you have ruled out that Halifax birth. The Henry marriage sounds compelling but the birth of their Jean doesn't quite fit your timeline....so one to consider only after you rule out (or otherwise) the Halifax birth.

Jude

Coming at it from a slightly different angle, If Jean is the Halifax one ( or indeed the Auckland one) there apear to be siblings, do you have any clues in photos as to whether there were any siblings to Jean?

for eg

Births Sep 1931 (>99%)
Morton Molly Dyson Halifax 9a 454
Births Jun 1934 (>99%)
Morton Jean Dyson Halifax 9a 471

I would have made the guess that the above are children of this marriage
Marriages Jun 1932 (>99%)
Dyson Edith Morton Sheffield 9c 1215
Morton Frank S Dyson Sheffield 9c 1215

Likewise the Auckland birth for Jean has a likely sibling

Births Mar 1934 (>99%)
Morton Jean Pratt Auckland 10a 353 Scan available - click to view

Births Mar 1938 (>99%)
Morton Audrey Pratt Auckland 10a 321