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actually, I think "Mercantile Marine" was quite an unusual phrase to use back then


it was commonly just put as Merchant seaman, or even just seaman ..................... someone in the Royal Navy almost always had "seaman R.N."


someone else may know better ................ but I feel that Mercantile marine was more a US terminology back then than the UK

I appreciate and and understand your comments about info supplied at marriage - but one of you had asked what was actually on the marriage certificate re the father............!
David

I appreciate and understand your comments about info supplied at marriage - but one of you had asked what was actually on the marriage certificate re the father............!
David

Yes that was me David - thanks :)

Obviously as Sylvia has said anything on certs etc can be incorrect or wrong, as you didn't have to provide evidence, but even so it is still stuff to work from.

One of my ancestors was serial bigamist and although he used fake names, he did tell some element of truth in the information he gave.

Seeing that Thomas was in the navy it seems (providing that is correct) , it would be even more likely he wasn't at home with family at time of the census.

Wasn't one of the Thomas variations I found in 1871 in the Navy or Similar? (will have to look back to check)

That seems a very precise description of occupation that Jane gave her father. Just seaman would of been sufficient.

I will keep looking, I love a challenge and it bugs me we can't find her or her parents. I cracked a great mystery with my great grandfather. One that had me firmly stuck behind a brick wall for many years. It was sheer luck of piecing together bits of info that led me to the full story.

So don't give up :)

Found this family in 1861, now to try and find them in a later census (not sure if this has already been posted, I don't think so?)

Thomas Hamby Head Married Male 32 1829 Master Mariner Orford, Suffolk, England
Harriet M Hamby Wife Married Female 29 1832 Master Mariners Wife Ipswich, Suffolk, England
Thomas C Hamby Son Unmarried Male 9 1852 - Ipswich, Suffolk, England
Edward W Hamby Son Unmarried Male 6 1855 - Ipswich, Suffolk, England
Maria E Hamby Daughter Unmarried Female 4 1857 - Ipswich, Suffolk, England
Kate E Hamby Daughter - Female 2 1859 - Ipswich, Suffolk, England
Annie A Hamby Daughter - Female 0 1861 - Ipswich, Suffolk, England
Sarah Ann West Servant Unmarried Female 16 1845 General Servant Ipswich, Suffolk, England

Same family in 1871, Thomas is missing.

Name: Harriet M Hamby
Age: 39
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1832
Relation: Wife
Gender: Female
Where born: Ipswich, Suffolk, England
Civil Parish: Ipswich St Margaret
Ecclesiastical parish: Norwich
Town: Ipswich
County/Island: Suffolk
Country: England
Registration district: Ipswich
Sub-registration district: St Margaret
ED, institution, or vessel: 9
Household schedule number: 12
Piece: 1755
Folio: 155
Page Number: 3
Household Members:
Name Age
Harriet M Hamby 39
Thomas C Hamby 19
Maria E Hamby 14
Kate E Hamby 12
Fredrick A Hamby 8
Eliza C Hamby 6
Annie C Hamby 4
Walter H Hamby 2
Clara Hamby 1


Now to see if I can find them in 1881

Here they are in 1881

Name: Harriet Maria Hamby
Age: 49
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1832
Relationship to Head: Head
Gender: Female
Where born: Ipswich, Suffolk, England
Civil Parish: Ipswich St Margaret
County/Island: Suffolk
Country: England
Street address: No 15 Upper Barclay St
Marital Status: Windower (Widower)
Education:

Employment status:

View image
Registration district: Ipswich
Sub-registration district: St Margaret
ED, institution, or vessel: 13
Neighbors: View others on page
Piece: 1877
Folio: 33
Page Number: 12
Household Members:
Name Age
Harriet Maria Hamby 49
Kate Elizabeth Hamby 22
Fredrick Abbott Hamby 18
Eliza Emma Hamby 16
Walter Henry Hamby 12
Clara Hamby 10
Percy George Hamby 8
Leah E.Pudden Hamby 3


No sign of a Jane and still in Ipswich so probably unlikely.

Although the Annie in 1871 could be a possibility, but then that would make Jane born 1867 ish (she did give 1868 in one census)

I had an idea.........Jane Ann Hann died 9 December 1961 at Parkstone, Poole, aged 90. I wonder if she has a headstone which records her date of birth? Possible?
I will put my local (Parkstone) sleuth onto a search.........
David

I was also looking at a family where the head was a William Hambly who was a mercantile marine/seaman, he is in london but also in Plymouth for one of the census

he has a daughter Florence Annie born 1878 in plymouth to his first wife and no children with his second from what i could see, but cant find any children born around the time of Jane. (will post census details later, if you want to take a look).

surprisingly there are quite a few hambly and variations whose occupations were mercantile marines.

i am starting to wonder if Jane my of been born illegitmate to a wandering seaman, so could be under her mothers maiden name, but later takes on her fathers surname Hasby (such a complex name too with such a lot of variations)

when did she die and what age was given? does it put her born around 1872 still?

here's the death registration from freebmd ................


Deaths Dec 1961 (>99%)

HANN Jane A 90 Poole 7c 716



age 90 ..................... gives a possible birth between 1870 to 1872



and of course, depends on the informant knowing Jane's true age :-)

Re her birth:
As I think I mentioned before she gave her age as 19 on census April 1891 and 20 when married November 1891 SO IF TELLING THE TRUTH ACCURATELY she was born April - November 1871.
This also fits with age 90 when she died 9th December 1961.

I feel 'Hambley' is too far away from 'Hasbey' but appreciate the detective work!
David

Haven´t done any look ups. Sorry.
Have you considered Harby as an alternative.
Just thought I would put my "two pennörtn " in

There is a Thomas Asbey born 1822 in Greenwich to Thomas a Mariner and Jane his wife.

Could be a possibility for Jane Ann's father (maybe she was named after his mother) and maybe he followed his fathers occupation.

Can't find this Thomas in any census though.

It would mean Thomas was about 50 when she was born, but that isn't unusual and he could of died soon after her birth.

Also I was looking into a baptism of a Jane Ann Hauks/hawks/hanks who was born in Greenwich. Parents are Joseph and Jane, oddly enough on the baptism record Hauks looks very like Hasby

This is them in 1871

Name: Jane Hanks
Age: 1
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1870
Relation: Daughter
Father's Name: Joseph Hanks
Mother's name: Jane Hanks
Gender: Female
Where born: Greenwich, Kent, England
Civil Parish: Greenwich
Ecclesiastical parish: St Peter
Town: Greenwich
County/Island: Kent
Country: England
Registration district: Greenwich
Sub-registration district: Greenwich West
ED, institution, or vessel: 1
Household schedule number: 112
Piece: 752
Folio: 12
Page Number: 18
Household Members:
Name Age
Joseph Hanks 30
Jane Hanks 28
James Hanks 8
Joseph Hanks 6
Jane Hanks 1
Jane Millar 12


Joseph the father dies and Jane remarried to a Alfred Walker. All the children took on the walker name. But I can't find daughter Jane Ann in 1891 under Hawks variations or Walker and can't see a possibly marriage. Which would tie in with finding Jane Ann Hasby in 1891 on her own as a servant in Teddington.

But as there is no father Thomas, I am inclined to rule it out, although you never know, she may of made up her fathers name.

I looked at all other Jane Ann/e born in Greenwich from 1868 to 1872 and think I have traced their movements and therefore don't fit in.

So either her birth wasn't registered/baptised or she wasn't born Jane Ann/e or wasn't born in the Greenwich area.

I wouldn't totally rule out Hamby as a name, it is actually very close to Hasby, only one letter in difference. But I think the ispwich family is unlikely.

Hello everybody..........
I am coming to the opinion that 'Hasbey' was not a surname (look at bmd 1837-1915 - VERY few entries. I think we are looking for Ashby or Asby or Asbe or Asbee or Asbey..........
Have nearly given up!
Many thanks for all your efforts...........
My last hope now is that Jane Ann mentioned 'Hasbey' relatives in her will - but it is a very long shot..........will let you know in due course
David

Yes it is definately a badly mistranscribed name I'd say. There are a huge amount of possibilities - Housby being one too, along with hasberry and similar variations. Plus there seems to be more matches overseas.

If they married in a church it might be worth getting a copy of the parish register entry, so you can see how the name was written there. Only issue is if she couldn't write it just gets written as heard which of course is your most likely issue here.

The marriage cert you have, is it a print of the exact entry? Or is it handwritten by the local records office.

CelticShiv
It is clearly a copy as everything written is in the same hand - that of the Registrar - BUT Jane would have to sign and she signed Jane Anne Hasbey [apparently]
AND her name appears as Jane Ann Hasbey in the 1891 census
David