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Were the certificates any help Ann-Marie? Any other information we could try to track down for you.........

I did get a quote from National archives for the ships log for the period immediately before the missing months, but it was £264!!!!!!!!

Another problem, there don't appear to be any ships logs for the Simoom, so presumably they were lost when she sank.

I was trying to see if there would be a record of where her master & crew took over the ship. I realise Mr Rozee was based at HMS Pembroke before joining Samoom, but as that was a shore base he was not necessarily living there unless delivering or undergoing training - or doing maintenance.

Look forward to your update Anne-Marie once snail mail arrives!

Problem, the ships logs have not been digitised by national archives - and there is a missing period for the Mentor by the look of the index references. They appear to be in date order:

ADM53/49064 - 1/7/1916 - 31/8/1916
ADM53/49065 - 1/9/1916 - 31/10/1916

ADM53/49066 - 22/1/1917 - 28/2/1917

Could this signify a period in port for repairs - so no crew & no log??

Flip/Jude,thank you for all the research that you are doing. Flip, I realise that you haven,t lost track of my original questions and that you are just waiting on the certificates. These are due to be dispatched on the 9th, but they will take longer to get to me as I am not in England. Also post to my little village can be very hit and miss!Will of course let you know what details they give.

Ann-Marie

And the image could say Mentor - it's so badly written. So how do we establish where the Mentor was - I know it was at Scapa Flow in 1915, and in North Sea after this, but was it in Newcastle?

Yes the commander is one of the two dozen I have looked at...the service dates differ but all the ones that are Mentor have 12 362 just like Thomas' :-)

Jude

That's interesting Jude, were the numbers the same and did the match Rozee's, or the date they joined that ship?

The commanding officer from the Mentor - Edward Tyrell Inman also died on the Simoom.

I have now done a dozen all are Mentor.... it's stretching it but.....................

Watching footie now :-)

EDIT two dozen...all Mentor.............

Jude

I have but I googled and found this anyway

ATKINS, Henry R, Leading Stoker, K 7427 (Ch)
AUTON, Reginald T, Ordinary Telegraphist, J 28593 (Ch)
BENNETT, Francis A, Able Seaman, 211730 (Ch)
BLACK, Henry J, Leading Cook's Mate, M 2575 (Ch)
BONNETT, Herbert E A, Ordinary Seaman, J 59859 (Ch)
BOOTH, Albert, Ordinary Seaman, J 56050 (Po)
CAMP, Victor G, Ordinary Seaman, J 23814
CLOSE, Herbert, Able Seaman, J 22395 (Ch)
COTTON, John, Ordinary Seaman, J 56029 (Po)
DARKER, John, Able Seaman, J 17737 (Ch)
DISTON, Amos, Stoker 1c (RFR B 9880), SS 107379 (Ch)
FARRANT, William T, Officer's Steward 2c, L 5946
FITZROY, Edward H, Lieutenant
FUTTER, Arthur W, Leading Seaman, 236471 (Ch)
GALLANT, Alfred W, Ordinary Seaman, J 40051 (Po)
GOODMAN, Charles E, Signalman, J 18130 (Po)
GOODRUM, Charles W, Signalman, RNVR, Bristol Z 5203
GRIFFITHS, Thomas, Leading Telegraphist, J 12978 (Dev)
GURNEY, Charles E, Able Seaman, J 2424 (Ch)
HARRIS, Joseph, Able Seaman, 191655 (Dev)
HINCHLIFFE, Percy, Able Seaman, J 10198 (Ch)
HOOD, Robert, Able Seaman, RNVR, Tyneside Z 7667
HOWE, Arthur, Stoker 1c, 293827 (Ch)
INMAN, Edwin T, Commander
JOHNSON, Ernest, Ordinary Seaman, J 56026 (Po)
JOHNSON, William A, Officers' Steward 3c, L 5676 (Ch)
KNOTT, Charles J H, Able Seaman, J 3191 (Ch)
LAMBERT, David, Stoker 1c, K 22813 (Ch)
LEE, Charles H, Stoker 1c, K 30084 (Ch)
LEE, William G, Leading Signalman, J 6174 (Ch)
LUDBY, Alfred G, Able Seaman (RFR B 2626), 177913 (Ch)
MADDISON, Brian A, Act/Sub Lieutenant, RNR
MITCHELL, David, Able Seaman, J 18400 (Ch)
NOTMAN, George W W, Petty Officer, 221596 (Ch)
OATLEY, Maurice J, Ordinary Seaman, J 46888 (Ch)
PAGE, Victor A, Stoker 1c, K 26880
PARKER, George C, Able Seaman, RNVR, Tyneside Z 10096
PARSELL, John E, Able Seaman, RNVR, Mersey Z 2046
PURCELL, Charles T, Able Seaman, 205004 (Po)
REVELL, Stanley H, Yeoman of Signals, 201407 (Ch)
ROOT, Frederick G, Able Seaman, SS 3195 (Ch)
ROZEE, Thomas G A, Able Seaman, J 4568 (Ch)
SAYER, Edward W, Able Seaman, J 7630 (Ch)
SCOTT, Archibald, Chief Stoker, 280108 (Dev)
TURNER, Arthur E, Able Seaman (RFR B 2374), 171502 (Ch)
WITHERS, Maxwell J, Act/Stoker Petty Officer, K 413 (Ch)
WOODER, James, Petty Officer, 232422 (Ch)

All the ones I have looked at so far (about half a dozen) are Monitor....

Jude

Couple more:

John Darkner b 27/6/1892
Victor George Camp 18/10/1897

Jude, have you also got Ancestry? - if you just put in the death date (under search military records) a lot come up. But I can only look at the distorted image on National archives.

I can post up some more from Ancestry if you want to check?

Good thinking Flip - these two come up blank though I think - both on Monitor or Mentor as are all the others I have looked at so far!


Jude

The reason I suggested the above, my husband was in RN, although not in WW1 I hasten to add :-D and a lot of his crew mates went from one ship to another but were quite often posted together. So it's worth a try. A couple of other sailors who died on the Simoom:

Henry Richard Atkins, b 4/1/1892 Chislehuram, Kent
herbert Edwin Austin Bonnett b 6/7/1904 Rochester, Kent

I can't check their military cards as I don't have a FMP sub.

Just a suggestion, could we find any other sailors who died on the Simoom see if they have the same service record, which we may be able to read??

Anne-Marie, we are just doing this to see if we can place this man in Newcastle - we haven't lost track of your original questions, but until you get the death certificate and the possible re-marriage to confirm findings so far we may as well try to follow this line!

Yeah Mavis we have seen this....what we are trying to establish is how he was in Newcastle to have fatherered the twins.....

So we are trying to find what the vessel name (associated with deport ship Dido) he was on at around the time..and to see if that was in the North Sea around then :-)

And none of us can read the name of that vessel!

jdue

don't know if this will help


Name:
Thomas George Alfred Rozee

Rank:
AB

Birth Date:
17 May 1893

Birth Place:
Poplar, London

Branch of Service:
Royal Navy

Cause of Death:
Killed or died as a direct result of enemy action

Official Number Port Division:
J.4568. (Ch)

Death Date:
23 Jan 1917

Ship or Unit:
HMS Simon

Location of Grave:
Not recorded

Name and Address of Cemetery:
Body Not Recovered For Burial

Relatives Notified and Address:
Friend: Rebecca Payne 96 Adamson Road, Custom House London,E






Mavis

Marie...nice play on words:-)

UK, Naval Medal and Award Rolls, 1793-1972 (Ancestry)
Name: Thos G A Royce
Medal or Award: Star, Victory Medal, British War Medal
Service Year: 1914-1920
Service Location: Europe
Campaign or Service: World War I
Service number: J 4568

(his service No. brings up above)

Chris :)

I do think it's quite ironic that he served on the Tyne 1914/15 .....

Death at Sea record

First Name THOMAS G A
Last Name ROZEE
Year 1917
Vessel H. M. S. DIDO FOR SIMOOM
Age At Death 23
Year Of Birth 1894
Page 360
Record Source GRO Marine Death Indices (1903 to 1965)
Record set British nationals died overseas 1818-2005
Category Birth, Marriage, Death & Parish Records
Record collection Deaths & burials
Collections from Great Britain

It could be Teuton Chris

Jude