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BatMansDaughter
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20 Feb 2014 20:12 |
And Ellen???
All Victoria, Australia, Assisted and Unassisted Passenger Lists, 1839–1923 Results Victoria, Australia, Assisted and Unassisted Passenger Lists, 1839–1923 about Mrs Casabranca Name: Mrs Casabranca Estimated birth year: abt 1845 Age: 40 Arrival Date: 18 Apr 1885 Arrival Port: Adelaide, Melbourne and Sydney, Australia Departure Port: London Ship: Lusitania Nationality: Foreigner
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BatMansDaughter
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20 Feb 2014 20:16 |
Could Nellie be Ellen????
All Australia Marriage Index, 1788-1950 Results Australia Marriage Index, 1788-1950 about Nellie De Casabianca Name: Nellie De Casabianca Spouse Name: Joseph Williams Marriage Place: Victoria Registration Place: Victoria Registration Year: 1887 Registration Number: 1441
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BatMansDaughter
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20 Feb 2014 20:53 |
Looks like Joseph Williams travelled with them!!!!
All Victoria, Australia, Assisted and Unassisted Passenger Lists, 1839–1923 Results Victoria, Australia, Assisted and Unassisted Passenger Lists, 1839–1923 about Joseph Williams Name: Joseph Williams Estimated birth year: abt 1846 Age: 39 Arrival Date: 18 Apr 1885 Arrival Port: Adelaide, Melbourne and Sydney, Australia Departure Port: London Ship: Lusitania Nationality: English
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BatMansDaughter
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20 Feb 2014 21:43 |
Historical Records Australia Birth Index, 1788-1922 about Mary Forbes Eleanor De Casabianca Name: Mary Forbes Eleanor De Casabianca Birth Date: 16 Nov 1903 Father's Name: Louis Howard De Casabianca Mother's name: Adela Harriett Croft Birth Place: Gawler West Registration Place: Port Gawler, South Australia Page Number: 81 Volume Number: 721
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Tessa
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20 Feb 2014 21:47 |
thankyou for the info looks interesting will am trying to find living relatives now to see what happened to Eleanor Howard / De Casabianca and if she left a will i think that is the key to my family mystery. thanks Tessa
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Tessa
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20 Feb 2014 21:47 |
thankyou for the info looks interesting will am trying to find living relatives now to see what happened to Eleanor Howard / De Casabianca and if she left a will i think that is the key to my family mystery. thanks Tessa
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Tessa
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20 Feb 2014 21:47 |
thankyou for the info looks interesting will am trying to find living relatives now to see what happened to Eleanor Howard / De Casabianca and if she left a will i think that is the key to my family mystery. thanks Tessa
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BatMansDaughter
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20 Feb 2014 21:54 |
This is Louis Jnr coming back to the UK.
All UK, Incoming Passenger Lists, 1878-1960 Results UK, Incoming Passenger Lists, 1878-1960 about Reverend Louis De Cas Name: Reverend Louis De Cas Birth Date: abt 1873 Age: 40 Port of Departure: Sydney, Australia Arrival Date: 27 Dec 1913 Port of Arrival: London, England Ports of Voyage: Melbourne [Adelaide] [Colombo] [Bombay] [Plymouth] Ship Name: Medina Search Ship Database: View the 'Medina' in the 'Passenger Ships and Images' database Shipping line: Peninsula and Orient Steam Navigation Company Ltd Official Number: 131849 Travelling with wife Adela, children, Mary, Mabel, Louis and John (Alban)
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BatMansDaughter
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20 Feb 2014 22:20 |
I wonder???
All UK, Incoming Passenger Lists, 1878-1960 Results UK, Incoming Passenger Lists, 1878-1960 about Lady Williams Name: Lady Williams Birth Date: abt 1847 Age: 56 Port of Departure: Australia Arrival Date: 24 May 1903 Port of Arrival: London, England Ports of Voyage: Hobart [Melbourne] [Adelaide] [Colombo] [Plymouth] Ship Name: Orontes Search Ship Database: View the 'Orontes' in the 'Passenger Ships and Images' database Shipping line: Orient Steam Navigation Company Ltd Official Number: 115707 Travelling with Miss Williams aged 13
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BatMansDaughter
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20 Feb 2014 23:18 |
I'm confused with you thinking that Ralph Clegg could have been the one regarding the peerage case. He's here with his "mother" ,
Historical Records 1871 England Census about William G Howard Name: William G Howard Age: 6 Estimated birth year: abt 1865 Relation: Grandson Gender: Male Where born: London, Middlesex, England Civil Parish: Lambourne Ecclesiastical parish: Rochester County/Island: Essex Country: England Registration district: Ongar Sub-registration district: Chipping Ongar ED, institution, or vessel: 10 Household schedule number: 196 Piece: 1643 Folio: 147 Page Number: 35 Household Members: Name Age John Tunrosh 60 Susanna Tunrosh 81 Ann Marne 71 Ann Benbew 17 William G Howard 6 image states Earl of Wicklow Ellen Howard 29. Image states mother of above Harriet Richardson 28 Sidly Richardson 3 Sarah Reed 15
Can you explain what you think the link is, thinking I might be being slow on the uptake here. :-D
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ErikaH
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20 Feb 2014 23:41 |
Not just you, BMD...........I fail to see any reason for Ralph Clegg - born to named parents in 1863 - having any connection whatsoever with this woman Eleanor.
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BatMansDaughter
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20 Feb 2014 23:52 |
Hi Reggie, I thought that maybe Ralph Clegg was the child used to try and claim the peerage, however Ralph Clegg is with his parents in 1871.
I've googled about William George Howard b 1864, it's seems that in 1892/3 he tried to claim his heritage again, apparently he had a accent ( presumably French) and was married to a French milliner. So I can only presume he was sent to France after 1871??
I feel sure Nellie Casabianca who marries Joseph Williams is Eleanor, who shows as Ellen in 1841,51,61 and 71. Can't see her in 1881.
We'll have to wait for the OP to come back, but I'm pleased it's not just me that is confused.
Also read that Ellen's sister was murdered in 1877 by her husband Louis Staunton, this happened in a Kent and Louis Victor De Casabianca was in Kent at the time and identified the body.
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ArgyllGran
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21 Feb 2014 10:03 |
A link to that story about Ellen's sister, mentioned by BatMansDaughter above, in case anyone wants to read it:
http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=3Z3XzmHduXQC&pg=PA20&lpg=PA20&dq=louis+victor+de+casabianca&source=bl&ots=d_VwDwLN8h&sig=yfweGnczKFhxIVRDHQbQseh3uo0&hl=en&sa=X&ei=5CMHU_T6G8Gv7Aa3uICIDw&ved=0CDMQ6AEwAQ#v=onepage&q=louis%20victor%20de%20casabianca&f=false
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ArgyllGran
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21 Feb 2014 10:32 |
Re the 1871 posted above, the transcription on Ancestry is messed up, as so often. But so is the image, in this case - unless I'm missing something obvious, which could well be!
The first 4 names - John Tunrosh to Ann Benbow - are a different household.
The Howard household is:
William G and Ellen, as above. William's listed as grandson, but no grandparents listed in same household. Harriet is listed as Daughter of wife on image (but her parents aren't listed in this household) Sidly (Lilly? ) is grand-daughter on image. Harriet's daughter? Born Liverpool. Sarah Reed is a domestic servant. There's also a Harriet Butterfield, age 45, imbecile, born Brighton. Listed as "wife" on image - whose??
EDIT: Yes, you're right, BMD (below). Harriet Butterfield is Ellen & Harriet's mother. Nobody's listed as head of household.
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BatMansDaughter
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21 Feb 2014 10:35 |
Harriet Suter, Ellen's mother married a Butterfield, so it maybe her with the age out??
Reference the William G Howard Claim to his Earldom in 1892,
A Claimant to the Earldom of Wicklow. The lawsuit in which Mr. William George Howard seeks to oust his cousin from the Howard estates in Wicklow and Donegal, on the ground that he, not the cousin, is the true Earl of Wicklow, is creating some sensation in Ireland. If it goes on it is likely to be one of the most elaborate and costly suits ever prosecuted at the Four Courts. The proceedings so far have only had regard to the minor question whether the plaintiff should be ordered to give security for costs. In order not to be brought within the rule of court whioh governs actions brought in Irish courts of law by non-residence, Mr. Howard says that he has severed all .his business connections in France, and that as soon as his furniture arrives from Paris he will settle down in the house which he has rented at Blackrock, near Dub- lin. The plaintiff íb a tall and good-looking young man, who speaks English rapidly and with a very foreign accent. His self-posses- sion, readiness, and sang-froid, when sub- jected to a very severe croBB-examination as to his antecedents and means, were very remarkable. 'J hough bom in London, he haB lived most of his life abroad, especially in Paris, where he seemB to have had a good deal of employment from different commercial houses as a skilled accountant. His wife is a French lady, who carries on a millinery busi- ness in that city. He at first showed some heat when he was asked questions about his wife ; but as soon aB he understood that they were rendered necessary by his position as a litigant, he answered freely and frankly. The lady, it seems, is to dispose of her business at the earliest opportunity and join her husband at Blackrock. When asked what he intended to do in Ireland by way of a profession, he said he would teach French or become a journalist. Hie courage is all the more remarkable inasmuch as the House of Lords long Bince decided against that view of the case which he desires to present. Those proceedings, however, did not bind him, for he was only five years old at the time. He says, too, that some important testimony will be forthcoming now which was lacking then. The present Earl of Wicklow is a minor. The estates attached to the earldom are of great value ; and the family j residence, Shelton Abbey, Arklow, is one of the finest mansions in Ireland.
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BatMansDaughter
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21 Feb 2014 10:37 |
1891,
Text is pretty bad,
AN IRISH PEERAGE CASE. The Queen'a Bench Division, Dublin, on May 14 had before them ?. proposed action by which it is sought to recover the eatntes appertaining to the Earldom of Wieklow, preliminary to oo serting a claim to the title. Tbf- plaintiff in the proposed action is a Mr. William George Howard, who liven in Frrsnce nt Asmieron, de partment of the Seine. By his r-'nim bp would be a»ep- nephew to the prpaeDt Earl, '^ho sue ceeded hia full brother ; and would bo the son of fcho presnnt Earl'a eldept ntep-brother, long deceased. Tbe Conrt granted the application to join numerous coughs of action, including the appointment of a. recover over tho estates. The case is likely to be heard of in the Hou^e of Lords. The brother of tbe pvefienfc Earl nne ceedod to tbe title under a decision of tho Houso of Lords in 18GS).
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Chris Ho :)
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21 Feb 2014 10:52 |
Marriages Jun 1844 (>99%) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- NEWLAND Susanna Stepney 2 431 Tinnoth John Stepney 2 431
Marriages Jun 1879 (>99%) ------------------------------------------- Bridges Kate Holborn 1b 981 MOLES Jane Holborn 1b 981
Burial First name(s): John Last name: TINNOTH Date of burial 28 May 1890 Age at death: 79 Calculated year of birth: 1811 Place of burial Lambourne Dedication: St Mary & All Saints County: Essex Lambourne St Mary & All Saints
Burial First name(s): Susannah Last name: TINNOTH Date of burial 23 Dec 1872 Age at death: 83 Calculated year of birth: 1789 Place of burial Lambourne Dedication: St Mary & All Saints County: Essex Lambourne St Mary & All Saints
(was baffling over that 1871 surname earlier, sorted it with above!)
Chris :)
1871 (FMP) ???, John Head M 60 1811 Essex (Proprietor of Houses) ???, Susanna Wife F 81 1790 Essex MANN, Ann Cousin F 71 1800 Middlesex BENBOW, Ann Servant F 17 1854 Essex Piece: 1643 Folio: 147 Page: 35 Registration District: Ongar Civil Parish: Lambourne Municipal Borough: Address: Cottage, Lambourne County: Essex
1871 (FMP) HOWARD, William G Grandson M 6 1865 Middlesex (Earl of Wicklow) HOWARD, Ellen Mother Of Above F 29 1842 Sussex RICHARDSON, Harriet Wife's Daughter F 28 1843 Sussex RICHARDSON, Lilly Granddaughter F 3 1868 Lancashire REED, Sarah Servant F 15 1856 Essex BUTTERFIELD, Harriet Wife F 55 1816 Sussex Piece: 1643 Folio: 147 Page: 35 Registration District: Ongar Civil Parish: Lambourne Municipal Borough: Address: Abridge, Lambourne County: Essex
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/#
(not sure if anything Earl relating on above, click arrow, to Search our records)
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Tessa
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21 Feb 2014 10:58 |
Wow just open the thread I have put on here thank you everybody for taking such an interest think I have opened a can of worms my cousin and I will sit down and go through all this but if anyone comes across Eleanor's death anywhere in the world or her divorce from De casabianca that is what I would like to find will come back later thanks
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ArgyllGran
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21 Feb 2014 12:14 |
An aside:
wonder what happened to young Lilly after her mother's murder? Or after 1871, come to that. There's no mention of her in the link re the murder above - only a baby boy born 1876. Possibly this one: Births Jun 1876 Staunton Thomas Henry Lambeth 1d 521 Wonder what happened to him?
Can't even find Lilly's birth, unless Lilly was a "pet" name for something else - Elizabeth, perhaps.
I know it's nothing to do with Eleanor, Tessa - just appeals to my detective instincts!
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BatMansDaughter
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21 Feb 2014 12:20 |
I think Thomas Henry Staunton died the following year. I also looked for Lilly, couldn't see anything though.
Edit a tree on ancestry has that he died 8th August 1877 Cudham Kent, then I also read that someone from the house took the child away before he could be harmed??? So pleased this isn't my family, I'd never sleep trying to sort this all out :-D :-D
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