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The Emily Mosoph from the 1891 census is listed as Park in 1881

Name: Emily E. Park
Age: 8
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1873
Relationship to Head: Daughter
Father: Richard Park
Mother: Annie Park
Gender: Female
Where born: Manchester, Lancashire, England

Civil Parish: Salford
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England

Street Address: 18 Thos Turner St
Education:

Employment status:

View Image
Occupation: Scholar

Registration District: Salford
Sub-registration District: Regent Road
ED, institution, or vessel: 21
Neighbors: View others on page
Piece: 3967
Folio: 30
Page Number: 14
Household Members:
Name Age
Richard Park 48
Annie Park 38
James W. Park 18
Mary J. Park 10
Emily E. Park 8
Sarah Goodchild 59

Name: William Mosoph
Birth Date: 9 Dec 1889
Date of Registration: Sep 1969
Age at Death: 79
Registration District: Torbay
Inferred County: Devon
Volume: 7a
Page: 1891


Name: Eva Mosoph
Birth Date: abt 1891
Date of Registration: Sep 1966
Age at Death: 75
Registration District: Totnes
Inferred County: Devon
Volume: 7a
Page: 761



Is this lady Related?


Name: Alice Mosoph
Birth Date: 28 Mar 1912
Date of Registration: Sep 1972
Age at Death: 60
Registration District: Torbay
Inferred County: Devon
Volume: 7a
Page: 2025


or this one?

Name: Martha Ellen Mosoph
Birth Date: 8 Dec 1908
Date of Registration: Aug 1986
Age at Death: 77
Registration District: Manchester
Inferred County: Lancashire
Volume: 38
Page: 1465



EDIT - I see the ladies are wives of Ralph.

Thanks for all your help
Still not found Ralph birth 1914 ?
I will put a family tree to-gether with the info given, and what I have
Will speak with friend when I have done this. Unfortunately she does not have or know how to use a computer!

Name: John Edward Mosoph
Birth Date: 31 May 1878, DOB 31 May 1878
Baptism Date: 7 Jul 1878
Parish: Manchester, St Mary, St Denys and St George
Father's Name: John Mosoph, Occ. Warehouseman
Mother's Name: Ann Mosoph
Archive Roll: 774

1871

Name: Annie Mosoph
Age: 28
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1843
Relation: Visitor
Gender: Female
Where born: Manchester, Lancashire, England
Civil Parish: Little Bolton
Ecclesiastical parish: St George
Town: Bolton
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England
Registration District: Bolton
Sub-registration District: Little Bolton
ED, institution, or vessel: 25
Household Schedule Number: 16
Piece: 3935
Folio: 141
Page Number: 3
Household Members:
Name Age
Jane Lees 41
Robert W Lees 22
Elizabeth A W Lees 18
Annie Mosoph 28 <<<< Married

?? on the marriage of her 'sister' Mary in 1891, Emily was a witness and signed herself Emily Edith Park


keep coming back to this as William Mosoph's mother (supposedly Emily E Park)

Civil Registration event: Birth
Print Close Name: FRANKLIN, Emily Edith
Registration district: Manchester
County: Lancashire
Year of registration: 1872
Quarter of registration: Apr-May-Jun
Mother's maiden name: Not available before 1911 Q3
Volume no: 8D
Page no: 176


Civil Registration event: Marriage
Print Close Name: FRANKLIN, Emily Edith
Registration district: Salford
County: Lancashire
Year of registration: 1894
Quarter of registration: Apr-May-Jun
Spouse's last name: Not available before 1912
Volume no: 8D
Page no: 167
MarriageFinder: Emily Edith Franklin married one of the following people:


CALDWELL, Joseph
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>WATSON, John
WILSON, Lucy Ada


(the Watson connection on his marriage to Eva Hudson)

1901

RG number: RG13
Piece: 3736
Folio: 30
Page: 7
Reg. District: Salford
Sub District: Regent Road
Parish: Salford
Enum. District: 34
Ecclesiastical District: Salford St Bartholomew
City/Municipal Borough:
Address: 50, Robert Hall Street, Salford
County: Lancashire

WATSON, John Head Married M 35 1866 Builders Navvy
Balderstone, Nottinghamshire
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>WATSON, Emily E Wife Married F 28 1873
Manchester, Lancashire
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>WATSON, William Son M 11 1890
Salford, Lancashire
WATSON, Minnie Daughter F 3 1898
Salford, Lancashire

1911

RG14PN24147 RG78PN1387 RD466 SD3 ED14 SN214
Reg. District: Manchester
Sub District: St George
Parish: Manchester
Enum. District: 14
Address: 17 Eliza Ann St Manchester
County: Lancashire


WATSON, John Head Widower M 46 1865 Railway Contractor Labourer Balderton Nottingham
WATSON, Minnie Daughter F 13 1898 Salford Lancashire
WATSON, Annie Daughter F 8 1903 Manchester Lancashire
WATSON, Edith Daughter F 7 1904 Manchester Lancashire



Deaths Dec 1908 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

WATSON Emily Edith 36 Manchester 8d 165

(not much help folks, but just the below, Military)

British Army WWI Medal Rolls Index Cards, 1914-1920
Name: W Mosoph
[William Mosoph]
Regiment or Corps: Manchester Regiment
Regimental Number: 11015

Manchester City Battalions (Find My Past)
First Name(s):W.
Last Name:Mosoph
Soldier Number:11015

Chris :)

Well done Choccy. That explains the Watson connection. His stepfather was a Watson so William's birth name was his mother's maiden surname of Mosoph (except she was a Franklin?) but he was known by his stepfather's surname but wanted his children registered in his own birth surname.

Pity there doesn't seem to be a baptism record for William's mother Emily Edith. I feel that the John Edward Mosoph is her brother or at least half brother. Annie is on the 1871 census as Mosoph and is listed as married but I can't see her husband anywhere on the census.




Name: Ada Mary Franklin
Baptism Date: 3 May 1871
Parish: Little Bolton, All Saints
Parish as it Appears: All Saints, Bolton
Father's Name: John Franklin, Occ. Warehouseman <<<<<<<
Mother's Name: Annie Mosoph Franklin
Reference Number: L265/1/1/1
Item Number: 1
Archive Roll: 619
Address: Little Bolton



Births Jun 1871 FRANKLIN Ada Mary Bolton 8c 337

Deaths Sep 1871 Franklin Ada Mary 0 Ashton 8d 378



????

Marriages Mar 1869
Bland Thomas Manchester 8d 338
BURGESS Annie Manchester 8d 338
FRANKLIN John Manchester 8d 338
WILLIAMSON Elizabeth Manchester 8d 338

Name: Theresa Park
Birth Date: 1 Nov 1882
Age: 0
Baptism Date: 3 Jan 1883
Parish: Salford, Christ Church
Parish as it Appears: Salford, Christ Church
Father's Name: Richard Park, Occ. Tailor
Mother's Name: Annie Park
Reference Number: GB127.L189/1/1/4
Address: 9 Ewait (?) Street


Births Dec 1882 Park Theresa Salford 8d 162


Name: Theresa Park, Housekeeper
Birth Year: abt 1883
Age: 25
Marriage Date: 1 Aug 1908
Parish: Salford, Christ Church
Parish as it Appears: Christ Church
Father's Name: Richard Park, Tailor
Spouse's Name: William Ralph, Labourer
Spouse's Father's Name: William Ralph, Cabinet Maker (Dec'd)
Reference Number: GB127.L189/1/2/10

Address for both 7 Woodbine Street

Witnesses: Thomas Ralph and Lilian Ralph


1901

Name: Theresa Parks
Age: 18
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1883
Relation: Daughter
Father's Name: Richard Parks
Mother's Name: Anni Parks
Gender: Female
Where born: Salford, Lancashire, England

Civil Parish: Salford
Ecclesiastical parish: Salford Christchurch
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England

Street Address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Education:

Employment status:

View Image

Registration District: Salford
Sub-registration District: Regent Road
ED, institution, or vessel: 18
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Schedule Number: 3
Piece: 3734
Folio: 21
Page Number: 1
Household Members:
Name Age
Richard Parks 69
Anni Parks 58
Theresa Parks 18
James Ross 31
Richard Ross 2
Mary J Ross 30
James Ross 4
Caroline Challoner 55 Visitor, Widow
William Challoner 24


1911

Name: Theresa Ralph
Age in 1911: 29
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1882
Relation to Head: Wife
Gender: Female
Birth Place: Salford, Lancashire, England
Civil Parish: Salford
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England
Street Address: 7 Woodbine St Salford
Marital Status: Married
Registration District: Salford
Registration District Number: 465
Sub-registration District: Regent Road
ED, institution, or vessel: 30
Piece: 24073
Household Members:
Name Age
William Ralph 31
Theresa Ralph 29
Anne Park 68, Mother, widow


Deaths Dec 1947 Ralph Theresa 64 Salford 10f 458

Name: Theresa Ralph
Probate Date: 9 Dec 1947
Death Date: 23 Nov 1947
Death Place: Salford
Registry: Manchester, England

Theresa Ralph of 7 Woodbine Street, Salford died at 91 Eccles Old Road, Salford. Administration to Ellen Whitehead, widow and Lily Halford, married woman. Effects £209. 0s. 3d.



Deaths Sep 1944 Ralph William 65 Salford 8d 500

Name: William Ralph
Probate Date: 22 Aug 1944
Death Date: 4 Aug 1944
Death Place: Salford
Registry: Manchester, England

William Ralph of 7 Woodbine Street. Administration to Thesera Ralpjh, Widow. Effects £177



Deaths Sep 1907 PARK Richard 76 Salford 8d 85


Deaths Jun 1919 Park Ann 76 Salford 8d 139


The Lily Halford that was one of the Administraters of Theresa's Probate.

Marriages Mar 1924
Halford Harold Ross Salford 8d 47
Ross Lily Halford Salford 8d 47



And Ellen Whitehead

Marriages Jun 1930
Ross Ellen Whitehead Salford 8d 723
Whitehead Charles Ross Salford 8d 723

1911

Name: Mary Jane Ross
Age in 1911: 42
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1869
Relation to Head: Wife
Gender: Female
Birth Place: Salford, Lancashire, England
Civil Parish: Pendleton
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England
Street Address: 2 Penny St Pendleton Salford
Marital Status: Married
Registration District: Salford
Registration District Number: 465
Sub-registration District: Pendleton
ED, institution, or vessel: 4
Piece: 23935
Household Members:
Name Age
James Ross 42
Mary Jane Ross 42 9 Children born, 5 living 4 had died
James Ross 14
Richard Ross 12
Lilly Ross 8
John Ross 5
Ellen Ross 2

Thanks you ALL, for all the help given.
Plenty for me to work on. i will make a tree up.
Sadly the main question not answered. Ralph's birth
Maybe not registered? either he was illegitemate / or being born before the marriage not registered? How would he have got married with out a birth cert?
The family have been trying for years to find out his birth.
When did compulsive registration come in?

After 1875 there was a penalty for not registering a birth.

It is looking at the moment that he may have been registered under a different surname? Also I am wondering if Ralph was his middle name and of course we can't see middle names after 1911 on Freebmd!!!

At the moment given that William's (half?) aunt's married name was Ralph, my gut feeling is that IF he was "adopted" his mother was from William's family and not a Hudson.


I am just following up Minnie Watson at the moment and I will post anything that I find on her.


I was hoping that Ralph may have been mentioned on Theresa's probate but no luck, it was Mary Jane's girls.


Have you tried searching trees on here to see if any of the other people from William's family are there?

Marriages Sep 1920
McGarr James Watson Manchester 8d 654
Watson Minnie McGarr Manchester 8d 654


3 children from the above marriage.(See FreeBMD)

Name: Minnie McGarr
Birth Date: abt 1897
Date of Registration: Sep 1948
Age at Death: 51
Registration District: Manchester
Inferred County: Lancashire
Volume: 10e
Page: 391


Name: James McGarr
Birth Date: abt 1897
Date of Registration: Sep 1956
Age at Death: 59
Registration District: Manchester
Inferred County: Lancashire
Volume: 10e
Page: 340

I think that it is MarieCeleste. There is a baptism for an Ada Mary Franklin (posted above) whose parents are John (also a Warehouseman) and Annie Mosoph. Either John Edward or Ada Mary's birth certificates would hopefully give Annie's maiden surname.

As Pauline says though, we are no nearer to finding the birth registration for Ralph Mosoph.

Such a pity that William Mosoph's military records don't seem to have survived!

Is this William in 1911?

Name: William Watson
Age in 1911: 21
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1890
Relation to Head: Boarder
Gender: Male
Birth Place: Salford, Lancashire, England
Civil Parish: Salford
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England
Street Address: 58 Enbridge St Salford
Marital Status: Single
Occupation: Clerk
Registration District: Salford
Registration District Number: 465
Sub-registration District: Regent Road
ED, institution, or vessel: 25
Piece: 24068
Household Members:
Name Age
Samuel Farrow 47
Harriett Farrow 48
Amy Farrow 21
Nellie Farrow 13
William Watson 21

or this one? In Ladywell Sanatorium

Name: William Watson
Age in 1911: 22
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1889
Relation to Head: Inmate
Gender: Male
Birth Place: Salford, Lancashire, England
Civil Parish: Pendleton and Salford
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England
Marital Status: Single
Occupation: General Labourer
Registration District: Salford
Registration District Number: 465
Sub-registration District: Regent Road
ED, institution, or vessel: 44-45
Piece: 24087

Oops, I deleted the baptism I posted and the comment I made once I noticed Rootie had posted the same already - but it was spotted and at least we're thinking the same!

Ada Mary Franklin ?

http://www.lancashirebmd.org.uk/cgi/birthind.cgi

Lancashire Birth indexes for the years: 1871

FRANKLIN Ada M Little Bolton Bolton KEEN

?? the Mosoph connection (Mossop)


Marriages Dec 1839 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

KEEN William Mossop Manchester 20 577

SENIOR Harriet Manchester 20 577


1851

RG number: HO107
Piece: 2223
Folio: 0
Page: 0
Reg. District: Salford
Sub District: Greengate
Parish: Manchester
Enum. District:
Ecclesiastical District:
City/Municipal Borough:
Address: 5, Brownhill Street, Manchester
County: Lancashire

M.KEEN, William Head Married M 36 1815 Hotel Servant
Grassmere, Lancashire
KEEN, Harriet Wife Married F 39 1812
Sutterton, Lincolnshire
KEEN, John Son M 10 1841 Scholar
Chorlton Medlock, Lancashire
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>KEEN, Ann Dau F 8 1843 Scholar
Manchester?, Lancashire


can't see Ann Keen ever marrying anyone - but suspect she could be the mother of Ada Mary Franklin and others

That makes sense Choccy - there's nothing to suggest she ever married Franklin, on Ada Mary's baptism she isn't recorded as Franklin, just as Mosoph. It's the transcription that has assumed the surname of Franklin for her.

She's recorded as Mossop and married on the 1871 - she would have been heavily pregnant with Ada Mary so assumed her father's middle name as a married name?