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Thank you ChristinaS.

Jackie

HUTCHINS, Elizabeth F 50 1791 Essex
DEARSON, George M 30 1811 Essex
DEARSON, Reuben M 20 1821 Essex
DEARSON, Richard Hutchins M 14 1827
DEARSON, Eliza F 8 1833 Essex
DEARSON, George M 5 1836 Essex
DEARSON, Maria F 2 1839 Essex

Piece:323
Book/Folio:30
Page: 5
Registration District: West Ham
Civil Parish: West Ham
Municipal Borough:
Address: Well Street, West Ham, Stratford
County: Essex

This is the 1841 census that BatMansDaughter referred to. This is probably the George Dearson (aged 5) who went on to marry Frances Hill. In 1851 he was in a workhouse, where they would probably have helped him to become a mariner.

His sister Eliza, married a James Hill.

Sister Maria married John Kemp. Thomas is living with them in 1871

Brother Richard went on to have a daughter Elizabeth b.1866 in Stratford, who is almost certainly the Elizabeth Dearson living in Wales with Thomas.

Hi ChristinaS.
The two Frances's are the same person. It is her son who I am researching.
Her son was born as Thomas George Hill in 1854.
She them married George Dearson.
I am looking into whether Thomas George Hill later changed his surname to Dearson.
Jackie

Sorry, JackieinCardiff, but how can the Frances Collings who married John Hill, and the Frances Hill who married George Dearson not be the same person??

They were both living in Morning Lane at the time of their marriage, and they both had the father - Williams Collins - a dyer.

Okay, I've obviously missed something here. I'll read through the thread again and see what it is.

Thanks Chris.
that's one of Thomas George Dearson's children. 5 of his children died in infancy :-(

Jackie x

Burial
County Glamorganshire
Place Llanwonno
Church Parish Church
RegisterNumber
BurialDate 14 Oct 1893
Forename Maggie
Relationship
Rel1MaleForename
Rel1FemaleForename
Rel1Surname
Surname DEARSON
Age 18m
Abode Ynysybwl

(saw above, if one of family!)

Chris :)

http://www.freereg.org.uk/cgi/Search.pl

:-D :-D at the Ida Downes.... Bet she was warm at nighttime!!
Sorry didn't refresh my page before I sent you the last message so didn't see that you'd found Frances in 1911... Have messaged someone with Frances in their tree, so will see if they have any marriage details for her.
Someone out there must know something!! lol
Jackie x

Hi Jackie,
Hopefully the marriage cert for Frances to William Stevens may help..... Fingers crossed it may have an Essex Dearson cousin as a witness or maybe the address of someone similar?

Hi ChristinaS,
Even with that birth registration it's still not going to prove 100% that they are the same person..

Thanks BatMansDaughter,
I doubt i'm going to find any paperwork to prove my instinct. I've been looking at this branch for such a long time and this theory keeps coming back to me..
Im going to keep digging away and hope something turns up to prove that my instincts are right.
I've not been able to find Ida either, in Wales or England. She had a daughter in West Ham after her marriage. She came back to Wales at some point, where her death was registered. Will look into her marriage details.
Many thanks for your help. Lots more digging for me to do :-) :-)
Jackie x

1911


1911 England Census about Ida Pearson
Name: Ida Pearson
Age in 1911: 21
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1890
Relation to Head: Visitor
Gender: Female
Birth Place: Ynysybwl, Glamorganshire
Civil Parish: Walthamstow
County/Island: Essex
Country: England
Street Address: 76 Marten Road, Walthamstow
Marital Status: Single
Registration District: West Ham
Registration District Number: 188
Sub-registration District: Walthamstow
ED, institution, or vessel: 43
Household Schedule Number: 291
Piece: 9717
Household Members:
Name Age
William Stevens 28
Frances Stevens 29
Ida Stevens 6
Ida Pearson 21

So she's with her married sister.... Do you have her marriage cert to William? Frances may have been with family prior to marrying in West Ham in 1903

Was looking for Ida.... Still not found her but came across this and just had to post it,


1911 England Census about Ida Downes
Name: Ida Downes <<<<<
Age in 1911: 20
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1891
Relation to Head: Servant
Gender: Female
Birth Place: Maldon, Essex
Civil Parish: Maldon All Saints
County/Island: Essex

Sorry, very immature but made me giggle!!

Is this Ida marrying in Essex??


Surname First name(s) Spouse District Vol Page
Marriages Mar 1912 (>99%)
Anderson Peter Nelson W.Ham 4a 415
Cormack Charles C Dearson W.Ham 4a 415
Dearson Ida Cormack W.Ham 4a 415
Nelson Rose A Anderson W.Ham 4a 415


It maybe interesting to see who the witnesses were and where she was living...... I can't find her on the 1911 census.

But BatMansDaughter posted the birth registration last night.

Thomas George Hill
Jan-Mar 1854
West Ham
Vol.4a Page 16

If this shows the parents as John Hill and Frances nee Collins, then surely it will have been proved that Thomas Hill and Thomas Dearson are one and the same
:-S

My own opinion is that you are barking up the correct tree, however I doubt that you would be able to prove it with any sort of paperwork.

I had a similar case in my own family research.... It took me 3 years to solve and to have paperwork to back the theory, I felt an immediate "gut" instinct before finding the written evidence........ I think you probably feel the same instinct with Thomas George?

Just a quick message while i'm in work-
Thanks Maureen and BatMansDaughter for your help.

I knew the Hills and Dearsons were connected, but I too thought it strange that Frances was in the workhouse, and Thomas was not.
I am still confused whether Thomas G Hill and Thomas George Dearson are the same person!! I can find no record of a birth for Thomas George Dearson and there is no trace on him on the 1861 census..
I have found a death for George Dearson in 1863 which would explain where he went- (still cant find him in 1861 census though when Frances was with her 2 children)

I thought the Dearsons were going to be an easy branch of my family when I started out on my family tree many years ago..

Do you think I would be right by assuming that they are the same person???.
Which would mean I now need to go down the Frances Collings and John Hill line???

This family is driving me mad !! :-S

Jackie x

Think this maybe your Dearsons marriage,


Name: Elizabeth Page
Spouse Name: Henry Dearson
Record Type: Marriage
Event Date: 30 May 1806
Parish: Spitalfields Christ Church with St Mary and St Stephen
Borough: Tower Hamlets
Register Type: Parish Register

When Elizabeth Dearson marries Henry Hutchings 1 witness is Martha Patrick think she is Elizabeth's sister,


Name: Martha Page
Spouse Name: John Patrick
Record Type: Marriage
Event Date: 3 Jan 1814
Parish: Whitechapel St Mary
Borough: Tower Hamlets
Register Type: Parish Register

Looks like Elizabeth Dearsons marriage to Hutchings;


Name: Elizabeth Dearson >>> widow
Spouse Name: Henry Hutchings
Record Type: Marriage
Event Date: 22 Oct 1828
Parish: Poplar All Saints
Borough: Tower Hamlets
Register Type: Parish Register

1851 England Census about George Dearson
Name: George Dearson
Age: 17
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1834
Relation: Pauper
Gender: M (Male)
Where born: Stratford, Essex, England
Civil Parish: Leyton
County/Island: Essex
Country: England
Street Address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage: unmarried

Disability:

View Image
Registration District: West Ham
Sub-registration District: Leyton
ED, institution, or vessel: Union Workhouse
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Schedule Number: 1
Piece: 1769
Folio: 192

If you look at the 1841 census for Reuben Dearson you will see that with George Dearson aged 30 is his mother under the name of elizabeth Hutchins aged 50 and there is Richard Hutchins Dearson aged 14, Eliza Dearson aged 8 and Maria Dearson aged 2 AND George Dearson aged 5.... Think this could be your George Dearson???

What I can't understand is why Frances Dearson born 1859 is in the workhouse yet the stepson to the Dearsons is with his step family in 1871!!

1851 census


Name: James Hill
Age: 21
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1830
Relation: Head
Spouse's Name: Eliza Hill
Gender: M (Male)
Where born: Woodford, Essex, England
Civil Parish: West Ham
Ecclesiastical parish: All Saints
County/Island: Essex
Country: England
Street Address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Disability:

View Image
Registration District: West Ham
Sub-registration District: West Ham
ED, institution, or vessel: 1d
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Schedule Number: 51
Piece: 1768
Folio: 415
Page Number: 10
Household Members:
Name Age
James Hill 21 >>> silk printer
Eliza Hill 19
Eliza Hill 4